103.7 KVIL Jettisons Delilah / New Home on KDMX 102.9 HD2

[texasstooge]

Last month throughout RadioDiscussion's...hibernation, I tuned to 103.7 KVIL one night. Only to find out there was a voice other than Delilah's. She has been a main staple of nighttime AC radio for years. Now, she has been replaced by local DJ Blake Powers as part of their plan to "contemporize the sound" of the station. (See Story Here)

It wasn't until a few nights later when I made the discovery on KDMX 102.9 HD2 (formerly "Sunny Radio") [HD Radio needed] that Delilah has made her return. She has acknowledged that some stations (including KVIL) dumped her. I even answered many inquiries of DFW area listeners on Delilah's Facebook page on where her new home is, stating the new station and iHeartRadio's streaming page. It is noted, however, that the HD Radio scroll is still showing song titles/artists from "Sunny Radio", so I'm guessing it's still a work in progress.

A few listeners replied saying that they are NOT listening to KVIL anymore, because they have no idea what they have done...and I'm beginning to agree. But what do y'all think? Did KVIL make the smart decision or not?

 

[Gregg.]

This is a question that's being repeated in market after market. How uptempo do formerly Soft AC stations have to get to keep their 25-54 audience?

KVIL has struggled with this question and tried to stay in the top 10. Meanwhile in nearby Houston, KODA is often #1 and always in the top 3. How are Dallas and Houston so different? I'm sure it was a tough decision for CBS in Dallas to put the Christmas format this past year on Oldies KLUV, as they try to tell middle aged women that KVIL is NOT that soft or sentimental anymore. KLUV enjoyed double digit #1 ratings during the holidays, ratings that used to go to KVIL.

Getting rid of Delilah is one more step in trying to be more contemporary. KVIL could have just put their own more contemporary AC music in and only took Delilah's comments and phone calls, which is what WLTW NYC does. But I guess if they got rid of the all-Christmas format, getting rid of Delilah is part of the process too.

Where does it end? Our parents listened to orchestra versions of popular songs in the Easy Listening format, but that died 30 years ago. No more Smooth Jazz format, no more Soft AC format in most markets. Other than Classical WRR, is there anything relaxing on the dial in Dallas? Do people under 55 no longer need relaxing music in their lives, even though their lives are more hectic than ever?

 

[Kent]

PPM has been absolutely brutal to Delilah. She's been getting dropped left and right in PPM markets for several years.

As Gregg points out, AC has experienced its own struggles not just related to Delilah. The old sound of KVIL doesn't resonate with younger listeners, and most of those who were in its target audience in 1989 are no longer desired by advertisers.

 

[andrewduong77]

I'm not too surprised that KVIL finally dropped Delilah. KVIL's playlist is waaay too extreme to even carry Delilah at all. How does Delilah even fit herself into "The 'LAME' New Sound of 1037 KVIL" positioning as "Best Variety...90s, 2k, and Today" for 6-7 months? Every night I'm driving home from school, listening to KVIL, I thought it's pretty crazy that Delilah had to identify her show on KVIL as "You're listening to Delilah, tonight, here on 1037 KVIL with Best Variety...90s, 2k, and Today!" (something like that) in her voice.

My mom likes Delilah a lot. Sometimes I like her show. I don't have an opinion for her show, really. On the other side, I have a very strong opinion of specifically which AC stations she's more likely to fit to based on how upbeat the music is or which decades of music they play from. Delilah would not fit with KVIL at all, even before KVIL's format retool in May 2013. OFC, Delilah would fit with KVIL back in 2010. KVIL really starts to freshen up their playlist since Fall 2011 and throughout 2012 (Cleveland's WDOK approach), which is why they came to the point they might as well dumped 1980s music altogether and retooled their AC format in May 2013.

I really think Delilah would fit more on AC's like WLYF/Miami, WMGF/Orlando, WLMG/New Orleans, and KOST/LA even though one of these stations have their very own special dedicated show like KOST with "Love Songs on the Coast" with Karen Sharp. WMGF used to have both Delilah and John Tesh. I really believe Delilah would fit with WMGF again based on their slight old-leaning AC music approach since 2012, but as we all know Cheap Channel wouldn't invest in something like that... I believe Delilah would fit "PERFECTLY" to WLYF based on their very old-leaning AC music approach. WLYF currently have John Tesh throughout the evening and night hours. It's funny, but I really thought John Tesh rather fits more on KVIL than WLYF whilst Delilah rather fits more on WLYF than any other AC's in the US.

 

[andrewduong77]

San Diego is another market with a CBS AC KYXY that is a little older-leaning than KVIL, but still pretty young-leaning compare to most AC's in the US just like CBS' KEZK (Fresh 102.5)/St. Louis and WDOK/Cleveland. Last year, KIFM flipped from Smooth Jazz to Soft AC which sounds like it's between (WFEZ and WDUV) and WLYF to compete with KYXY. By now, they beat KYXY in numbers. (FYI: KIFM and WLYF are both owned by Lincoln Financial Media.)

I couldn't understand why DFW couldn't have a decent AC station like WLTW/NY, KOST/LA, KODA/Houston, KMGL/Oklahoma City, or WLYF/Miami. Could it be the combination of Classic Hits KLUV and Adult Hits KJKK that really got in KVIL's way since they are co-owned with KVIL? KMGL does pretty well in numbers as an AC with an 80s-present playlist while being co-owned with Classic Hits KOMA which is also doing pretty well in numbers with a 60s-80s playlist in OKC. Before KMGL dropped 70s music in 2012, KMGL was doing pretty well in numbers with a 70s-present playlist while KOMA was doing pretty well in numbers with a few 60s-80s playlist. Therefore there is no reason why an AC couldn't be successful when it's co-owned with a successful Classic Hits.

It seems like DFW is the least-friendly AC market in the US (if I were not to include the markets without an AC). It seems like KVIL is the least-friendly AC in the US if I were not to include WWFS, WIAD, and WCFS (former "Fresh").

Is DFW seriously the youngest market in the US? I'm wondering just because DFW doesn't have either a Soft AC or a decent AC on commercial FM radio. It's funny how most of us here believe NY is one of the youngest market in the US, but as of yet, WLTW billed #1 in the NY market. WLTW plays everything from the 70s-present. It seems like the DFW market is the toughest market to support a decent AC that plays 80s-present music if I were to compare the DFW market to the Houston, Oklahoma City, New York, Los Angeles, and Miami markets.

Does anybody really knows why DFW couldn't support a decent AC that plays everything from the 80s-present?

Does anybody here know what is the average age and the median age of the Dallas-Fort Worth, Houston, Oklahoma City, New York, Los Angeles, or Miami markets? (Pardon me for not being resourceful enough to look up such data.)

(P.S. Don't tell me to listen to Jack FM for an 80s-present playlist. I prefer a station that plays 80s, 90s, 00s, and today's music, but that also does local weather and traffic reports because I drive to school everyday. I don't have time and I'm too lazy to check weather and traffic on my PC or iPod Touch.)

 

[Kent]

I really think Delilah would fit more on AC's like WLYF/Miami, WMGF/Orlando, WLMG/New Orleans, and KOST/LA even though one of these stations have their very own special dedicated show like KOST with "Love Songs on the Coast" with Karen Sharp. WMGF used to have both Delilah and John Tesh. I really believe Delilah would fit with WMGF again based on their slight old-leaning AC music approach since 2012, but as we all know Cheap Channel wouldn't invest in something like that...

You do realize Clear Channel syndicates Delilah, don't you? Plus, she's essentially free. Unless things have changed recently, her show is 100% barter. If they thought she'd work with WMGF's approach, she'd still be there. The reason Clear Channel pulled Delilah from WMGF was because she just wasn't working. Once Orlando switched to PPM, her ratings plummeted.

Delilah has never been the goddess she was purported to be. She was the classic case of a personality who rides your ratings rather than gets them. When KBFB was AC "B-97.9," KVIL's local dedication show with Valiere Smith mopped the floor with her. Once B went away and KVIL took her show, it was like she'd been there forever. Pre-PPM, Delilah was inoffensive enough to keep your audience but not exciting enough to generate a new one. Since your typical AC took a huge nosedive between 6 and 7 PM, a personality who could replace your night jock for free without losing audience was appealing. Once PPM hit, the average listener was changing stations if break announcing lasted longer than 30 seconds. A typical Delilah break was, and still is, about a minute. Plus, you have three four minute breaks (one minute of network time and three minutes of local) during her show. So, it's five minutes between music sweeps, and only one music sweep an hour is longer than 10 minutes. That's not going to make you any friends in the PPM world.

 

[Kent]

I couldn't understand why DFW couldn't have a decent AC station like WLTW/NY, KOST/LA, KODA/Houston, KMGL/Oklahoma City, or WLYF/Miami. Could it be the combination of Classic Hits KLUV and Adult Hits KJKK that really got in KVIL's way since they are co-owned with KVIL?

Not sure how you define a decent AC. Personally, I couldn't even stand 'LTW 20 years ago, but it's always gotten the ratings. AC has been trying to find its place for several years, and PPM has accelerated its inevitable change. The biggest issues facing AC today are that it has to get a 25-54 audience to remain relevant, and that age range is actually declining. Advertisers would really prefer 25-49 today. What product do you air to appeal to that group? More than 2/3 of the 25-49 audience came of age after 1990, and there are only around 100 songs from that entire decade that test well. For the younger side of that demo, the 80's, which AC relied on far too long, are completely irrelevant.

KMGL does pretty well in numbers as an AC with an 80s-present playlist while being co-owned with Classic Hits KOMA which is also doing pretty well in numbers with a 60s-80s playlist in OKC. Before KMGL dropped 70s music in 2012, KMGL was doing pretty well in numbers with a 70s-present playlist while KOMA was doing pretty well in numbers with a few 60s-80s playlist. Therefore there is no reason why an AC couldn't be successful when it's co-owned with a successful Classic Hits.

Keep in mind, OKC isn't a PPM market. OKC has also always been notoriously under-radioed. When OKC was down to one AC, Tulsa still had two or three. Make no mistake that competition, or the lack thereof, is a big factor in what will work.

It seems like DFW is the least-friendly AC market in the US (if I were not to include the markets without an AC). It seems like KVIL is the least-friendly AC in the US if I were not to include WWFS, WIAD, and WCFS (former "Fresh").

Of course, the fact that there are markets without an AC at all should tell you all you need to know. I'm not sure you could even find one market of any reasonable size that lacked AC altogether 10 years ago. Now, it's not particularly rare. Kansas City, a top-35 market, just got an AC a few weeks ago after being without one for roughly three years.

 

[TheBigA]

Getting rid of Delilah is one more step in trying to be more contemporary.

Plus, as I said in another thread, CBS has made a point to be live & local 7-midnight. They've refused any syndication, regardless of the source or host. Localism allows them to maximize whatever sales they get in the evenings, and adjust the music to fit the market.

 

[mbatchelor]

I'd rather listen to three hours of fingernails on a chalkboard then Delilah; most people I know feel the same. Bad radio, and the fact that her affiliate base is ever shrinking is IMHO a good thing. CBS ran her show for years here in St Louis and just ditched it within about the last 18 months for a local Acoustic show.

 

[andrewduong77]

AC has been trying to find its place for several years, and PPM has accelerated its inevitable change. The biggest issues facing AC today are that it has to get a 25-54 audience to remain relevant, and that age range is actually declining. Advertisers would really prefer 25-49 today. What product do you air to appeal to that group? More than 2/3 of the 25-49 audience came of age after 1990, and there are only around 100 songs from that entire decade that test well. For the younger side of that demo, the 80's, which AC relied on far too long, are completely irrelevant.

Of course, the fact that there are markets without an AC at all should tell you all you need to know. I'm not sure you could even find one market of any reasonable size that lacked AC altogether 10 years ago. Now, it's not particularly rare.

I strongly agree with you on that and it's something I've been aware of. AC's have gotten into trouble to stay consistent with it's demographics target since the late 2000's. And that ever since the youngest round of baby boomers hit the retirement age in 2011, that was a sign when AC's are getting into more troubles after that year, and...it's evident enough.

Keep in mind, OKC isn't a PPM market. OKC has also always been notoriously under-radioed. When OKC was down to one AC, Tulsa still had two or three. Make no mistake that competition, or the lack thereof, is a big factor in what will work.

Well there are other bigger markets (I believe are PPM markets) where an AC is co-owned with a Classic Hits and the AC still does pretty well and play pretty decent music. Heck, some of these AC's are still playing 70's music now! These markets are Portland with AC KKCW and Classic Hits KLTH, Miami with AC WLYF and Classic Hits WMXJ, and Memphis with AC WRVR and Classic Hits WKQK. Though in some of these markets the Classic Hits aren't doing so well. Therefore sister KLUV shouldn't be the reason for KVIL low numbers or KVIL lack of older music from the 70s and 80s.

Kansas City, a top-35 market, just got an AC a few weeks ago after being without one for roughly three years.

Same for Tulsa, they just got an AC during the summer of last year after being without one for roughly three years as well.

 

[andrewduong77]

Not sure how you define a decent AC. Personally, I couldn't even stand 'LTW 20 years ago, but it's always gotten the ratings.

Examples of a decent AC is the stations I mentioned above including KMGL, KODA, WLTW, WLYF. A decent AC still plays a lot of softer songs from the 80s and 90s, perhaps 70s as well if they're still playing songs from the 70s, mixed along with the upbeat songs of the 80s, 90s, 00s, and today's that they had been playing a lot in the past couple of years. A decent AC plays everything ranging from "You're In My Heart (My Final Acclaim" by Rod Stewart, to "These Dreams" by Heart, to "It's My Life" by Bon Jovi, to "What Is Love" by Haddaway, to "Just Dance" by Lady Gaga w/ Colby O'Donnis, to "Demons" by Imagine Dragons.

A 'LAME' AC is like KVIL where it pounds on the same recurrents over and over again while it mixes a 70s/80s/90s song in once in a while (2010 to 2011), a 90s song once in a while (2013 to now). KVIL lacks a lot of variety, their playlist rotates about 200-300 songs, while pounding heavily on the recurrents. Back in 2010, I remember KVIL keeps on playing the same recurrents like "Hey, Soul Sister", "Paparazzi", and "Hot N Cold" over and over again while mixing in "Rocket Man", "Lost In Love", "Livin' On A Prayer", "Ironic" once in a while. Now, they're doing the same thing again after they retooled their AC format back in 2013. They're playing the same recurrents like "Treasure", "Rumor Has It", and "Roar" over and over again while mixing in "Real World", "You Learn", or "Breakfast At Tiffany's" once in a while.

I guess I just answered my question of why KVIL isn't decent like other AC's in other markets even though it's the only AC in the DFW market. It's just a poorly programmed AC. The DFW market should have a fair amount of demographics to fit a decent AC. I guess all I can say is the PD of KVIL sucks. (I'm sorry if you're the PD of KVIL and you're reading this.) The GM of CBS DFW and PD of KVIL just doesn't put effort into programming a decent AC on KVIL in DFW at all, they just have KVIL play the same 3 Adele songs and the same 4 Bruno Mars songs every 3 hours and called it variety. Seems like CBS just leave their Full-Powered 99 kW C Class FM station dangling in the #5 market. KVIL presented CBS Radio embarrassment in the DFW market. (No offense) -__-

 

[texasstooge]

Examples of a decent AC is the stations I mentioned above including KMGL, KODA, WLTW, WLYF. A decent AC still plays a lot of softer songs from the 80s and 90s, perhaps 70s as well if they're still playing songs from the 70s, mixed along with the upbeat songs of the 80s, 90s, 00s, and today's that they had been playing a lot in the past couple of years. A decent AC plays everything ranging from "You're In My Heart (My Final Acclaim" by Rod Stewart, to "These Dreams" by Heart, to "It's My Life" by Bon Jovi, to "What Is Love" by Haddaway, to "Just Dance" by Lady Gaga w/ Colby O'Donnis, to "Demons" by Imagine Dragons.

A 'LAME' AC is like KVIL where it pounds on the same recurrents over and over again while it mixes a 70s/80s/90s song in once in a while (2010 to 2011), a 90s song once in a while (2013 to now). KVIL lacks a lot of variety, their playlist rotates about 200-300 songs, while pounding heavily on the recurrents. Back in 2010, I remember KVIL keeps on playing the same recurrents like "Hey, Soul Sister", "Paparazzi", and "Hot N Cold" over and over again while mixing in "Rocket Man", "Lost In Love", "Livin' On A Prayer", "Ironic" once in a while. Now, they're doing the same thing again after they retooled their AC format back in 2013. They're playing the same recurrents like "Treasure", "Rumor Has It", and "Roar" over and over again while mixing in "Real World", "You Learn", or "Breakfast At Tiffany's" once in a while.

I guess I just answered my question of why KVIL isn't decent like other AC's in other markets even though it's the only AC in the DFW market. It's just a poorly programmed AC. The DFW market should have a fair amount of demographics to fit a decent AC. I guess all I can say is the PD of KVIL sucks. (I'm sorry if you're the PD of KVIL and you're reading this.) The GM of CBS DFW and PD of KVIL just doesn't put effort into programming a decent AC on KVIL in DFW at all, they just have KVIL play the same 3 Adele songs and the same 4 Bruno Mars songs every 3 hours and called it variety. Seems like CBS just leave their Full-Powered 99 kW C Class FM station dangling in the #5 market. KVIL presented CBS Radio embarrassment in the DFW market. (No offense) -__-

I think you just summed it up nicely.

 

[RadioFaninTexas]

I remember how great KVIL sounded in the late 80's. Who programmed that station then?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChSpS0MZTpE

 

[andrewduong77]

Well that would be an AC back in the late 80's. An AC today would sound different than it would two decades and a half ago.

Though a good AC as of today would sound something like KODA, WLTW, KOST, or KMGL as of today. WLTW still plays Chicago, Bob Seger, Brenda K. Starr, Chaka Khan, and Whitney Houston along with OneRepublic, Katy Perry, Capital Cities, and Imagine Dragons. KVIL could have taken WLTW approach in the AC format and make good numbers in the DFW market like WLTW does in the NY market.

 

[BBontheRadio]

Dude, you are brilliant! I wonder why you're not programming a station in a major market somewhere!!

 

[texasstooge]

A 'LAME' AC is like KVIL where it pounds on the same recurrents over and over again...
...KVIL lacks a lot of variety, their playlist rotates about 200-300 songs, while pounding heavily on the recurrents.

Sadly (and I'm ashamed to say it), this is what we wanted, per CBS Radio Dallas. They're "focused on the Dallas/Fort Worth area", that's us.

 

[firepoint525]

Mix 92.9 here in Nashville jettisoned Delilah two years ago, so this is relatively old news to me. As far as I know, she is still on Lite 98.7 out of Hopkinsville, KY. Mix 92.9's sister station, B97.5 out of Knoxville was still carrying her last fall while we were in east Tennessee. Don't know if they still have her on, or not.

 

[Unregistered]

Who had the love song show before Delilah?

I seem to remember that before Delilah there was another "Sappy Love Song" show on 103.7 KVIL. I think it was "Love Songs with LuAnn" or something along those lines. Can't find anything about it on a standard web search, so figured I would through my hat into this ring and see if anyone remembers.