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Vinyl records outsell CDs for first time since 1986

davideduardo

davideduardo

Moderator/Administrator
Staff member
Last edited by a moderator:
TheBigA said:
It's more a statement on the death of the CD. Physical sales are down 23%. Meanwhile subscriptions for streaming music services are up.

https://www.allaccess.com/net-news/...u-s-music-revenue-climbs-6-in-halfyear-survey



Want to know where music listeners are? They're streaming.
Click to expand...


True but vinyl has made a big comeback. A lot of people are into collecting - both the young (those that grew up with ipods) and older. Also with the way new vinyl is being priced it is pretty profitable. The used market is also big on eBay and sites like discogs along with the Mom and Pop record stores and some smaller chains like Newbury Comics in the Boston area. Plenty of new turntables and related equipment on the market as well.
 
CDs still outsell vinyl in terms of number of units sold. But vinyl sales make more revenue because the average new vinyl record costs over twice that of the average new CD. (Remember when it used to be the exact opposite?)

And in 1986, cassette tapes were outselling both records and CDs. In fact, cassettes were the best-selling pre-recorded music format from 1983 to 1992.
 
kevtronics said:
And in 1986, cassette tapes were outselling both records and CDs. In fact, cassettes were the best-selling pre-recorded music format from 1983 to 1992.
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So much for the argument that audio quality mattered (or still matters) to the average consumer of recorded music.
 
spt87 said:
True but vinyl has made a big comeback. A lot of people are into collecting - both the young (those that grew up with ipods) and older. Also with the way new vinyl is being priced it is pretty profitable. The used market is also big on eBay and sites like discogs along with the Mom and Pop record stores and some smaller chains like Newbury Comics in the Boston area. Plenty of new turntables and related equipment on the market as well.
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I think a lot of this is "Hipster Chic" among Millennials who are too young to have experienced vinyl in its heyday. To them it is something unusual and different. However I have to wonder how much actual listening to vinyl is going on--I saw an article about a survey that was done in the U.K. and it found that 48% of those who had purchased vinyl albums did not own any sort of phonograph.

Among older people there is the nostalgia aspect, but I think this is a very tiny group. Boomers and GenX have mostly moved on.

kevtronics said:
CDs still outsell vinyl in terms of number of units sold. But vinyl sales make more revenue because the average new vinyl record costs over twice that of the average new CD. (Remember when it used to be the exact opposite?)
Click to expand...

Thank you for pointing that out. Vinyl tends to be stupidly expensive, especially when its content length is only 50-65% of a CD. I can't justify spending $40 (or more) for 40 minutes of music. And vinyl is not really portable--I can take audio anywhere my phone goes. We forget how much audio cassettes and CDs, and later mp3 files and streaming, liberated music from its phonograph chains.

And the cost of turntables often dives into the depths of silliness. I've seen plenty of turntables online that cost thousands of dollars. Some even approach $20k. Who has that kind of money?

I grew up with vinyl in the 1960's and have fond memories of it. But, like film photography, it is now impractical and expensive, and the realm of hard-core devotees. The rest of the world has moved to newer, more practical technologies.
 
I love the LP format for the artwork. But I still prefer the CD for the music.

To this day, I've never streamed or purchased a full-album download. As long as the physical format still exists, I'll gladly stay with it.
 
Mediafrog+ said:
Thank you for pointing that out. Vinyl tends to be stupidly expensive, especially when its content length is only 50-65% of a CD. I can't justify spending $40 (or more) for 40 minutes of music. And vinyl is not really portable--I can take audio anywhere my phone goes. We forget how much audio cassettes and CDs, and later mp3 files and streaming, liberated music from its phonograph chains.
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Some older folks I've talked to think that was a benefit. 40 or 50 years ago, people listened to music, as a standalone activity. People would put on an album, and just listen to it after work/etc. I don't know how accurate of a depiction that is, but it's a claim I've heard from some of my older colleagues.

Meanwhile, I have never known a time when music wasn't portable. I had a cassette walkman when I was a youngster, maybe 7 or 8. I'm sure that colors my perception of how valuable portable music is.
 
I can't explain it but I have digitized vinyl records on my computer and burned them to CD.
I have noticed that the digital audio sounds pretty much like the LP. Clean with the analog warmth.
I have purchased a CD of the same album and the CD sounds strident. It lacks the musicality of my homemade analog-to-digital-to-CD copy.
It must have something to do with the format conversion (bit reduction) from the studio master to the CD format.
 
PTBoardOp94 said:
Some older folks I've talked to think that was a benefit. 40 or 50 years ago, people listened to music, as a standalone activity. People would put on an album, and just listen to it after work/etc. I don't know how accurate of a depiction that is, but it's a claim I've heard from some of my older colleagues.

Meanwhile, I have never known a time when music wasn't portable. I had a cassette walkman when I was a youngster, maybe 7 or 8. I'm sure that colors my perception of how valuable portable music is.
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Maybe not 50 years ago; but my father used to have a really nice system with a SAE/Nikko stack of components and a pair of Speakerlab Super 7 speakers.

I remember he used sit back after work and just listen to records like Alan Parson's Project, Steely Dan, Pink Floyd and alike. I suppose he would have been considered a bit of an audiophile, but I wouldn't go so far as to say very many folks of that generation were. The majority were fine with their Craig aftermarket car speakers and Pioneer AM/FM/Cassette, or mono clock radio.
 
Kelly A said:
Maybe not 50 years ago; but my father used to have a really nice system with a SAE/Nikko stack of components and a pair of Speakerlab Super 7 speakers.

I remember he used sit back after work and just listen to records like Alan Parson's Project, Steely Dan, Pink Floyd and alike. I suppose he would have been considered a bit of an audiophile, but I wouldn't go so far as to say very many folks of that generation were. The majority were fine with their Craig aftermarket car speakers and Pioneer AM/FM/Cassette, or mono clock radio.
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My father was an audiophile in those days, but he was listening to classical music on his high-end system. I was fine with low-end equipment for my rock, folk, R&B and "outlaw" country LPs.
 
PTBoardOp94 said:
Some older folks I've talked to think that was a benefit. 40 or 50 years ago, people listened to music, as a standalone activity. People would put on an album, and just listen to it after work/etc. I don't know how accurate of a depiction that is, but it's a claim I've heard from some of my older colleagues.
.
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This is one of the appeals - instead of it being background music while driving or doing something else, collectors will sit and listen to an album, look at the album cover, etc. Doesn't mean they do that all the time to hear music but once in a while to relax.
 
frankberry said:
I can't explain it but I have digitized vinyl records on my computer and burned them to CD.
I have noticed that the digital audio sounds pretty much like the LP. Clean with the analog warmth.
I have purchased a CD of the same album and the CD sounds strident. It lacks the musicality of my homemade analog-to-digital-to-CD copy.
It must have something to do with the format conversion (bit reduction) from the studio master to the CD format.
Click to expand...

I think with vinyl, the limitations of the medium force the audio engineers doing the masters to not overdo it as far as compression, boosting the bass, etc. so the end result was better. With CD's, those same limitations don't apply so all the dynamic range was compressed out, bass pumped up or other changes done resulting in the music sounding more harsh.

I've read critiques about the vinyl craze with people talking about the great specifications of the CD medium which is true - far and away blows vinyl away on paper - but if those specs are put to bad use it doesn't get you anything/gets you a worse result.

Unfortunately, a lot of vinyl being re-issued today is not just a reprint but is remastered. I find the modern era remasters to be inferior in many cases to what was done originally. Maybe some of the CD mastering mentality is creeping in to the extent that is possible. Example, the Chicago Transit Authority 50th anniversary vinyl reissue. I had an older copy but not in the best shape so I sprung for this. The first time I played it I was shocked by how bad it sounded. Had to switch to my old copy before I finished the 1st of the 4 sides. It was much preferred to me even with some pops and clicks due to its condition. There are others on youtube who have compared old/new releases to demonstrate similar differences. Better off to go find a very good condition used copy of anything released on vinyl in the early 1990's and prior.
 
The Media Observer said:
I love the LP format for the artwork. But I still prefer the CD for the music.

To this day, I've never streamed or purchased a full-album download. As long as the physical format still exists, I'll gladly stay with it.
Click to expand...

The real issue here is that, just as we saw prior to the 60's push for albums, singles drive the market. Few younger consumers buy "albums". About 90% of music revenue is from streams, and consumers listen to songs, not albums.

Downloads of specific songs is down to single digit percentages. Purchase of whole downloadable albums is minimal, and purchase of physical product is only a few percent of the market.
 
In the early days of the CD, MCA Records CDs (from analog masters) stated:

This compact disc contains program transferred from analog tape and therefore
may contain some tape hiss and other anomalies that exist with analog recordings

IIRC, one of the High End audio journals of the time made fun of this statement,
although (IMHO) it's a fairly good way of explaining the particular CD isn't noise
and distortion free.


Kirk Bayne
 
kfbkfb said:
In the early days of the CD, MCA Records CDs (from analog masters) stated:
Click to expand...

Seeing that quote reminded me of something several millennial musicians have told me, which is they like to be able to hear imperfections. It makes the musicians human. It's interesting discussion this subject with them because they weren't raised on a analog audio, yet some of them prefer it. They will record on 2 inch tape, and then transfer to digital for mixdown. Some of the richer musicians will seek out old Neve consoles or Neumann tube microphones for that classic sound. So this isn't just a boomer thing.
 
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