Radio Pros/Past Alumni: What inspired you to leave the radio business? On the contrary, what made you stick with radio for your professional career?

[fordranger797]

Hi everyone,

I've always been curious about what circumstances have led some radio professionals to leave the radio business for other opportunities. Similarly, I've always been curious about how some people fight for their broadcasting goals no matter what personal sacrifice they have to make. I would assume that corporate layoffs would have significant influence in the decision making process for radio pros. I just find it interesting that some continue to fight for their career, while others decide to seek "greener" pastures in different industries. I think it's even more significant when someone decides to seek out a different career on their own terms, rather than have a layoff/changes in the industry influence the decision making process. For many pros, radio seems to be somewhat of a lifestyle. When radio is your life, how do you move on?

On a personal note, I've worked in radio for a few years, but would consider myself FAR from being a radio pro. I've thoroughly enjoyed my experience, and have had the opportunity to learn so much about the industry. My job gave me something to enjoy while attending college, and certainly helped me acquire skills that I will use in future professional endeavors. The industry as a whole really isn't really for me anymore, but I appreciate that I've been incredibly lucky to work for a company that has been nothing short of welcoming and supportive. Not many people get that kind of treatment in this industry, and I consider myself fortunate. I hope to continue my role for a while longer, but overall, I am looking forward to exploring other opportunities in the future.

 

[Kelly A]

I hope to continue my role for a while longer, but overall, I am looking forward to exploring other opportunities in the future.

You're smart to look at other options. Not that I'm knocking the business, it's just evolving into a ever-shrinking business model that's being forced to become much more regionalized/centralized. The new model will require less bodies overall.

Something similar is gradually happening to TV too. Agree or disagree with the results, I've been a behind the scenes part of the evolution.

 

[b-turner]

I am in the business because I am passionate about it. All my life I have wanted to work in the business. I was given an old tube radio when I was 4. I was impressed enough to sometimes pretend to be on the radio as early as first grade by announcing records I'd play on my record player, announcing them to a pencil and I used call letters (I liked WXYZ because it was the end of the alphabet). By 6th grade I had a 100mw AM (the local Radio Shack knew me by name & I had 2 battery cards!). Initially I only wanted to be a DJ. Within a few months at my first station in 1978 I was doing mornings and programming duties.

After 10 years working up the ladder to larger stations, I got a gig in a small town at a regional FM just as the rated station where I worked afternoons sold and flipped formats. That was a fateful move since I wound up across the street at a competitor doing sales.

I managed a few stations, my latest in the Houston market, but now I'm back in a small market selling. Honestly I love the one on one with clients and actually creating campaigns to help them.

In the early days of radio it was said the more you can do at a radio station the better. That is still true. It was said 4 decades ago that if you could sell advertising, you always had a place in radio. That statement is still very true.

If there were 100 opportunities 40 years ago, there were 20 twenty years ago and maybe 2 or 3 now. The need for air talent is very minimal. Lots of programming duties are multi-format, multi-station deals just like jocking. For many positions outside sales, there are so many that are working more than one station, the traditional salary per station is very part-time in monetary value. It is a very tough business today. It still applies, the more you know and the more you can do is the key to sticking around but not mean good money. You'd need to do sales to make the real money. Even the sales side is very different but finding a good salesperson truly is like finding a needle in a haystack.

It is harder now to carve out a living in radio. Even so, I love the business and still love going to work every day. Having a good boss really helps and I work with so excellent people.

 

[fordranger797]

You're smart to look at other options. Not that I'm knocking the business, it's just evolving into a ever-shrinking business model that's being forced to become much more regionalized/centralized. The new model will require less bodies overall.

Something similar is gradually happening to TV too. Agree or disagree with the results, I've been a behind the scenes part of the evolution.

Thank you for sharing your perspective, Kelly. I have absolutely no regrets about spending a few years in radio while I was figuring out what I wanted to do with my life. I learned a tremendous amount along the way that I probably wouldn't have learned from any other run-of-the-mill job, and for that I am thankful. With that being said, radio is indeed a shrinking business, and we've seen some drastic changes in the past year alone. I often think about other younger people who are trying to navigate their way in the broadcasting world. I wish them all the best, because I know they are facing an uphill battle.

 

[fordranger797]

I am in the business because I am passionate about it. All my life I have wanted to work in the business. I was given an old tube radio when I was 4. I was impressed enough to sometimes pretend to be on the radio as early as first grade by announcing records I'd play on my record player, announcing them to a pencil and I used call letters (I liked WXYZ because it was the end of the alphabet). By 6th grade I had a 100mw AM (the local Radio Shack knew me by name & I had 2 battery cards!). Initially I only wanted to be a DJ. Within a few months at my first station in 1978 I was doing mornings and programming duties.

After 10 years working up the ladder to larger stations, I got a gig in a small town at a regional FM just as the rated station where I worked afternoons sold and flipped formats. That was a fateful move since I wound up across the street at a competitor doing sales.

I managed a few stations, my latest in the Houston market, but now I'm back in a small market selling. Honestly I love the one on one with clients and actually creating campaigns to help them.

In the early days of radio it was said the more you can do at a radio station the better. That is still true. It was said 4 decades ago that if you could sell advertising, you always had a place in radio. That statement is still very true.

If there were 100 opportunities 40 years ago, there were 20 twenty years ago and maybe 2 or 3 now. The need for air talent is very minimal. Lots of programming duties are multi-format, multi-station deals just like jocking. For many positions outside sales, there are so many that are working more than one station, the traditional salary per station is very part-time in monetary value. It is a very tough business today. It still applies, the more you know and the more you can do is the key to sticking around but not mean good money. You'd need to do sales to make the real money. Even the sales side is very different but finding a good salesperson truly is like finding a needle in a haystack.

It is harder now to carve out a living in radio. Even so, I love the business and still love going to work every day. Having a good boss really helps and I work with so excellent people.

Wow! I really appreciate your perspective on the advertising and marketing side of radio. I worked on a few sales projects before, and I cannot for the life of me understand how professional salespeople do it. It was a fantastic learning experience, but it was definitely a challenge. I tip my hat to those who do that kind of work on a daily basis, and keep their company afloat. I would make the argument that selling the intangible (in this case, radio advertising) is something that not many are cut out for, because you truly have to sell a client on an idea. They certainly can't touch it or hold it, so it's up to you to convince them that an advertising package will be worth their while.

I've heard radio be referred to as "the labor of love." You really have to love what you do, and be passionate about putting your best foot forward every time you step into the studio. I tend to think of radio of being somewhat of a unique field, as highly talented people are willing to make large sacrifices to stay in the game (including their salary). While I can never fault anyone for following their dream, I would hope they also exercise caution and do what is best for themselves, too.

 

[davideduardo]

I became interested in radio in a convoluted manner: my dad administered the finances of a larger cemetery, and he taught me how to invest before I was 10. I'd buy single shares, and track them and trade them.

One company I bought a couple of shares of was Storer Broadcasting. They owned local WJW radio and TV, so as an investor I felt I had to visit the local stations. They were very welcoming of the very young shareholder, and I was amazed by the live TV show I saw and the radio DJs working.

I then decided to visit and DX radio stations. My nearest one was WJMO, an r&b station in Cleveland. They also had an FM that ran 5 PM to 11 PM, Monday to Friday. I began by taking coffee, cleaning up, filing records, dubbing carts and then got a weekend shift when the FM was forced to run 16 hours minimum a day.

After that I interned at a group in Mexico and stayed in the business for over 62 years now.

However, except for one dreadful interlude at KHJ, I never worked in radio. It was not the money, for sure. It was a calling, but with the feeling some have for sports... a passion.

But Kelly is right: today is not the time to plan a future in radio unless you have a way of merging new media with traditional that can save a declining industry.

 

[b-turner]

People make sales this monster it is not. I am included because I went kicking and screaming to the sales side of the building.

Sales is about establishing relationships with business owners and decisionmakers and building trust. This is done by direct contact. Your goal is to work for the continued success of that business owner that chooses to buy from you. You don't work for the station or yourself but the client. Everybody succeeds when the client does.

You are selling your client's imagination. They believe advertising works and likely believe radio works. So all you have to do is learn a bit about them so you can use your knowledge to bring them an idea that works. As for that idea, it is gleaned from their words I wrote down while we spoke. They hear their words from me. Simply put you're selling what the client wants for what they can afford. If all works out, the results will justify another campaign.

Sure you are a salesperson but you have a product that owner or decisionmaker needs to know about if only for informational purposes. Most will give you the time. Most are nice folks. Most salespeople fail because they try to sell instead of investing the 5 to 8 times you need to connect with that client to build a relationship and trust to convince them you are worthy of the buy. Yes the radio station product is important but a little common sense is to visit businesses your radio listeners would frequent.

 

[TheBigA]

But Kelly is right: today is not the time to plan a future in radio unless you have a way of merging new media with traditional that can save a declining industry.

There are more options now than ever before in radio. The trick is to be able to identify where those options are and take them. They're all over the place if you know where to look. Radio stations are looking to diversify revenue streams because they know the traditional ones are drying up. If you can help them diversify, there's a job for you.

 

[Lester_the_NightFly]

Started in the Engineering in 1980.

Left in 2013 when the Less-cume folks took over.

I was the last of a 5 man department. No raise, had to get the VP-Engineer approval for anything over $5.00, no budget.

When I told them I was leaving, the VP asked the Market Sales Manager to see if I could stay.
I told her, "It's has nothing to do with anyone in this building," and told her what was happening."

She told the VP, "Why should he stay?"

The business is complaining of not getting young engineers, the cause is on them and I have no sympathy.
Radio will probably gone by the end of this decade, sorry to see it go but wall street investors are killing it.

 

[davideduardo]

There are more options now than ever before in radio. The trick is to be able to identify where those options are and take them. They're all over the place if you know where to look. Radio stations are looking to diversify revenue streams because they know the traditional ones are drying up. If you can help them diversify, there's a job for you.

That "works" if you redefine "radio" to mean "the delivery of audio over any/all available channels". However, I think this conversation was focused on AM and FM terrestrial delivery.

Of course, your definition is today's correct one. But many who entered the business decades ago don't "get it" that radio has been redefined by the user, not the provider. In other words, "I've seen the enemy and the enemy is us".

 

[TheBigA]

That "works" if you redefine "radio" to mean "the delivery of audio over any/all available channels".

Realistically, that's the only way to view it IF you want to remain employed, Even the Museum of Television & Radio has changed it's name.

 

[davideduardo]

Realistically, that's the only way to view it IF you want to remain employed, Even the Museum of Television & Radio has changed it's name.

The issue I see is that, again referring to the original post, that many "veterans" in the industry do not see new media as being part of the whole. Some even see it as an enemy.

As to what the Museum of Television and Radio think, I have ambiguous to negative feelings about them. First, they are very focused on content and mostly TV network content. Then, they tend to dismiss the last 5 or 6 decades of radio when it became a music and personality medium and no longer ran the Golden Age type of content.

 

[TheBigA]

The issue I see is that, again referring to the original post, that many "veterans" in the industry do not see new media as being part of the whole. Some even see it as an enemy.

The generation that grew up with AM never fully accepted FM either. You mention the Golden Age, and I had a chance to meet Norman Corwin. To the day he died, he believed there was still a place for radio drama on the air. And maybe there is. Just not in the commercial world. That's the key: If you want to hold on to old definitions, you have to find a place where they speak that language. The only place I know is public radio, and even then, it's not universal. But that's also why I said there are lots of options.

 

[davideduardo]

The generation that grew up with AM never fully accepted FM either. You mention the Golden Age, and I had a chance to meet Norman Corwin. To the day he died, he believed there was still a place for radio drama on the air. And maybe there is. Just not in the commercial world. That's the key: If you want to hold on to old definitions, you have to find a place where they speak that language. The only place I know is public radio, and even then, it's not universal. But that's also why I said there are lots of options.

Now that you came on board with the Golden Age, I recommend GOLD TIME RADIO

There is a huge depth in pieces about that era, along with some audio. Jim did some great readable articles, each in a size that is a short and succinct read.

Jim passed last month, but I've been given the honor of preserving his works and the whole site will appear shortly on mine.

 

[fordranger797]

There are more options now than ever before in radio. The trick is to be able to identify where those options are and take them. They're all over the place if you know where to look. Radio stations are looking to diversify revenue streams because they know the traditional ones are drying up. If you can help them diversify, there's a job for you.

That sounds a bit like "creating a job for yourself." While I know this strategy works well in some industries, I'm not sure if that method works well enough in the media industry where upper management is always looking to cut costs. Not to say that radio is a "one trick pony" by any means, but it seems like it would be difficult to diversify. For example, many media outlets take advantage of social media platforms to advertise and grow their audience. It must be an effective strategy (or else they wouldn't be doing it), but on the flip-side of the coin, it seems like social media marketing teams are among the first to be cut. I could definitely be wrong, but that is my observation.

 

[fordranger797]

Started in the Engineering in 1980.

Left in 2013 when the Less-cume folks took over.

I was the last of a 5 man department. No raise, had to get the VP-Engineer approval for anything over $5.00, no budget.

When I told them I was leaving, the VP asked the Market Sales Manager to see if I could stay.
I told her, "It's has nothing to do with anyone in this building," and told her what was happening."

She told the VP, "Why should he stay?"

The business is complaining of not getting young engineers, the cause is on them and I have no sympathy.
Radio will probably gone by the end of this decade, sorry to see it go but wall street investors are killing it.

That is really too bad. I've always been somewhat interested in the engineering side of radio, and at one time considered getting a certification. Engineering has always seemed like the safe but also interesting side of radio, where you provide the most direct support to a broadcasting company. It's a shame to hear that your experience forced you to leave. It seems like a very risky proposition to allow your engineers to become dissatisfied with the environment, as engineers are not easy to obtain.

 

[TheBigA]

That sounds a bit like "creating a job for yourself." While I know this strategy works well in some industries, I'm not sure if that method works well enough in the media industry where upper management is always looking to cut costs.

They cut costs that don't make money. But those that are attached to growing areas of revenue never get cut. And yes, don't become a "one trick pony." Or a one format pony. Rick Dees only wanted to do CHR. He could have extended his career had he grown into classic hits. But he turned it down.

 

[fordranger797]

They cut costs that don't make money. But those that are attached to growing areas of revenue never get cut. And yes, don't become a "one trick pony." Or a one format pony. Rick Dees only wanted to do CHR. He could have extended his career had he grown into classic hits. But he turned it down.

That is interesting. I was always under the impression that most personalities would be willing to accept any format, as long as it means securing another gig in radio. You really have to admire the longevity of Rick Dees in the CHR format. Even he if didn't want to make the switch to classic hits, he certainly worked late into his career at KIIS. I don't think there are many personalities out there in their 50's who work in CHR, but I could be wrong.

 

[TheBigA]

I don't think there are many personalities out there in their 50's who work in CHR, but I could be wrong.

The most notable is iHeart's Elvis Duran at Z-100.

 

[TheBigA]

While we're on the subject, I see posts where people bemoan the lack of DJ training, saying nobody has time to guide new talent or show them the way. That's not true. These are about a dozen DJ conventions and seminars every year. Lots of opportunities for people in all parts of radio & audio streaming to get training and get some ideas. Here's one taking place next month:

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