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WCBS vs. WINS postscripts

The NYRMB (aka "The Dentist's Board") currently has a thread on former WCBS Newsradio 880 reporters who have been absorbed by 1010 WINS. Apparently, the original poster was either unaware or forgot that the October 2022 contract between Audacy and SAG-AFTRA essentially merged the two newsrooms, allowing for anchors and reporters to be "cross-utilized" on both stations (and, of course, the arrival of WINS-FM and the eventual winding down of WCBS).

But, as is the norm, the thread has been hijacked by posters who continue to air their gripes and grievances about what they don't like now that WCBS is gone and WINS is the only all-newser in town.

The well-respected Ted David offered this somewhat biased, stinging critique of what he doesn't like about WINS today:
There are only several anchors who remain listenable. Lynda Lopez, Kevin Rincon, Lori Madden, Budd Mishkin, Monique Coppola on the overnight is great. It's pretty much drive time that's the problem. Middays, evenings and the weekends are fine.

Now in the morning, Susan Richard is quite capable of being a very competent news anchor. But after 6 mins of hard news they go off the deep end. I am surprised she is doing this and suspect she is not thrilled. Scott Stanford does not belong there at ALL. The other day he made some reference to what people pick out of their nose, and then went into a story of someone who had something up his nose for years. This was supposed to be funny, or a medical story or I don't know what, but it just wasted my time.

I am reminded of all the kudos that Lee Harris received for his sterling coverage on 9/11. Anyone think, God forbid, something like that happened again, Scott Stanford would be able to handle it??

And in afternoon drive. I'm sorry, but friend Larry Mullins sounds like a court jester. He seems to feel that every story has to have some wisecrack in front of it, or during it, or after it, and that nothing can be read, simply as it was meant to be written and delivered.

Lori Madden, on the other hand, is a major pro and always has been. For some reason she doesn't feel the need to sound like a clown on the air, and I doubt she would ever allow herself to do so.

What I don't understand is, first, we were told that the station does not appeal to younger demos. Then we're told that trying to make things more lighthearted is aimed at attracting younger demos. But then we are told that younger demos are getting their news somewhere else, like cell phones. So why is the station allowing itself to destroy its once venerable reputation with garbage? In the quest for an unattainable demo?

What we hear on the air there during drive time is an insult to the high level quality we heard on WCBS 880.

Once again, I must wonder why other stations in the group like KNX, WBBM and KYW, all major market all-news stations, have nothing but regular anchors doing regular news. No clown shows. Aren't they looking for younger demographics in those markets too? Apparently not. Apparently, they realized that lowering the standards and quality of the air product, in an effort to go after an elusive demographic, is just not worth ruining the stations' reputations.

Why is New York being allowed to do this? It leads me to wonder about the management. And from my previous experience there, this management is sorely lacking.

There's literally no decent all news station to listen to during drive time in New York. I flipped over to WOR, not bad, to WABC, OK, and a lot of the time I listen to CNN audio and I just lament the loss of 880.

Perhaps, when the first book comes out for 1010WINS that is exclusively all WINS, minus the WCBS competition, and with these ridiculous adjustments to the drive time format, they will realize it's not working, and they will go back to a more serious posture.

In the meantime, New York has become a barren market for anything that resembles a serious all new station during morning and afternoon drive.
The main thing I get from all this "get off my lawn" complaining is a refusal to move forward with the times. And while there may be some validity to his comments, Ted and others on that board (and in a few FB groups) are still stuck in the past.

Educated comments, anyone?
 
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That guy sounds like the people who hated Stern so much they listened twice as much as people who loved him. Those kind of people are only happy when they’re unhappy about something.
 
Geez Audacy made the right decision to them protect 1010 WINS and 92.3 WINS.
Also we listed places either within the Audacy app and on AM/FM radio that are not exactly replacements to WCBS 880. It's where the majority is at today.
 
That guy sounds like the people who hated Stern so much they listened twice as much as people who loved him. Those kind of people are only happy when they’re unhappy about something.
You are absolutely right. When I had a relationship show on all talk KTNQ in the later 1990's, the program usually had to do with sexual subjects. I got lots of calls where someone would complain about what the show said "last night" and describe how awful it was. And then they would describe the show the previous night. And then the night before. And so on for multiple subjects about sex on many nights.

"If you don't like it, why do you listen?" got me nowhere. So I would just say, "I understand" until they finished their monologue and then they would be happy and hang up.
 
The NYRMB (aka "The Dentist's Board")
I am a bit "pissed" when I see that "Dentist's Board" reference.

Allan Sniffen, the moderator, is a dentist. Smartly, he studied a better career even though he loves radio. He was on the air in smaller markets and knows how the business works. He spends many hours a week maintaining his message board as well as his "oldies" stream where he has guests like Jon Wolfort and other "big names" from NY radio who occasionally join him in interesting events.

As someone who has spent tens of thousands of dollars on a radio tribute site, I admire Allan for his work. As moderator and the very (very, very) short term owner of this site, I know what this is about and I thank Allan for what he does in the very interesting NYC market. Validating this vote of admiration are all the big names of NY radio who post there with interesting insider comments.
 
These folks want news radio to sound old and stodgy, and can't understand why the audience is old & stodgy. They are killing the format they love when they don't listen. As I said in another thread, most of the comments bemoaning the loss of WCBS came from people who obviously hadn't listened recently. These are people who want radio to be a museum, and not a living, active business.

They also obviously don't know that they style of news delivery they love can be heard on WNYC. NPR uses the dry delivery they crave, with the depth in reporting they say they miss. But either they don't want to try something new, or they don't own FM radios.
 
You are absolutely right. When I had a relationship show on all talk KTNQ in the later 1990's, the program usually had to do with sexual subjects. I got lots of calls where someone would complain about what the show said "last night" and describe how awful it was. And then they would describe the show the previous night. And then the night before. And so on for multiple subjects about sex on many nights.

"If you don't like it, why do you listen?" got me nowhere. So I would just say, "I understand" until they finished their monologue and then they would be happy and hang up.
You hosted the show? Did it compete against Loveline?
 
You hosted the show? Did it compete against Loveline?
No, but I trained the announcer who did it, Alfredo Nájera. It was in Spanish, and actually beat Loveline.
 
Wow that’s awesome. How many years was it on?
About 4 or 5. When I moved to national programming, they could not find the right PD for the station and it reverted to a simulcast of HBC's "Recuerdo" adult hits format.
 
The NYRMB (aka "The Dentist's Board") currently has a thread on former WCBS Newsradio 880 reporters who have been absorbed by 1010 WINS. Apparently, the original poster was either unaware or forgot that the October 2022 contract between Audacy and SAG-AFTRA essentially merged the two newsrooms, allowing for anchors and reporters to be "cross-utilized" on both stations (and, of course, the arrival of WINS-FM and the eventual winding down of WCBS).

But, as is the norm, the thread has been hijacked by posters who continue to air their gripes and grievances about what they don't like now that WCBS is gone and WINS is the only all-newser in town.

The well-respected Ted David offered this somewhat biased, stinging critique of what he doesn't like about WINS today:

The main thing I get from all this "get off my lawn" complaining is a refusal to move forward with the times. And while there may be some validity to his comments, Ted and others on that board (and in a few FB groups) are still stuck in the past.

Educated comments, anyone?
What I don't understand is, first, we were told that the station does not appeal to younger demos. Then we're told that trying to make things more lighthearted is aimed at attracting younger demos. But then we are told that younger demos are getting their news somewhere else, like cell phones. So why is the station allowing itself to destroy its once venerable reputation with garbage? In the quest for an unattainable demo? - from Ted David's post that y'all taking pot shots at.

This has nothing to do with refusing "to move forward with the times"; it's more a matter of lamenting the dumbing down of a format in a futile attempt to attract listeners from a demographic that is just NOT interested.
 
This has nothing to do with refusing "to move forward with the times"; it's more a matter of lamenting the dumbing down of a format in a futile attempt to attract listeners from a demographic that is just NOT interested.

Humor isn't "dumbing down." If you want to hear dumbing down, listen to WABC.

WINS has always been more casual in its presentation. These folks want the return of Walter Cronkite.
 
The main thing I get from all this "get off my lawn" complaining is a refusal to move forward with the times. And while there may be some validity to his comments, Ted and others on that board (and in a few FB groups) are still stuck in the past.

Educated comments, anyone?

I wonder how many people commenting in this thread actually listen to WINS. I do, and I feel that those comments for the most part are accurate. The morning drive anchors spend much of their time trying to do comedy bits and the content skews heavily toward fluff instead of actual news.

These folks want news radio to sound old and stodgy, and can't understand why the audience is old & stodgy.

I don't know what those folks want, but news radio doesn't have to sound like a clown show in order to not sound old and stodgy. WINS anchor Scott Sanford was singing along badly to an Elvis Presley song this morning, it doesn't get much older than that. WTOP sounds great in the morning doing a solid news format, it doesn't sound old and stodgy doing so, and it's the top billing station in the nation.

They are killing the format they love when they don't listen.

There seems to be a belief among many on this forum that there's no difference between all-news radio stations and that former WCBS listeners should be happy with WINS because one is the same as the next. What we are seeing is that this is not true.

The two stations may seem interchangeable to a casual observer but their styles were very different from each other. Many former WCBS listeners are not happy with WINS. You can see it in the post above and across social media. You might as well say LITE FM listeners should be happy with K-Love instead since they're both pop music stations. Maybe some are, but many are certainly not.

As I said in another thread, most of the comments bemoaning the loss of WCBS came from people who obviously hadn't listened recently.

I don't think that's true. Do you have evidence to back up that statement? Because most of the comments I've seen are from people who seem like they were regular listeners. They can name their favorite anchors and describe in detail the qualities about the station they liked.

They also obviously don't know that they style of news delivery they love can be heard on WNYC. NPR uses the dry delivery they crave, with the depth in reporting they say they miss.

This is completely false. WNYC and NPR's style of news delivery sounds nothing at all like WCBS did. WCBS was full of musical sounders and high energy radio production values that were the polar opposite of WNYC's "dry delivery" and dead air segues. This is precisely the kind of remark I would expect to see from someone who obviously doesn't listen to the format.

But either they don't want to try something new, or they don't own FM radios.

Why so hyperbolic? WINS is not "something new" and everyone on the radio forums obviously owns an FM radio.

I am a bit "pissed" when I see that "Dentist's Board" reference.

David, I can't speak for the person who wrote that but it's a common reference here and perhaps it's not meant to be disrespectful. There's a certain level of trepidation about referring to a rival discussion board on this site so I think some people just call it that as a way to not mention it by name. FWIW I mostly agree with your assessment.
 
There seems to be a belief among many on this forum that there's no difference between all-news radio stations and that former WCBS listeners should be happy with WINS because one is the same as the next. What we are seeing is that this is not true.

I don't think I've ever said they're interchangeable. All I know is that WCBS isn't coming back. So you can complain about the alternative, but it doesn't seem to be very productive.

WNYC and NPR's style of news delivery sounds nothing at all like WCBS did.

I would hope not. One is non-commercial radio, and the other is supposed to be commercial radio. I'm just responding to the kind of radio Ted David wants. He doesn't like happy talk, and NPR has no happy talk. As I said, WCBS isn't coming back, and it sounds like WINS is unacceptable. I don't understand why they completely avoid mentioning WNYC as though it doesn't exist.

If they like former CBS reporters, I've heard former CBS News Radio anchor Steve Futterman on NPR lately. So they would hear a familiar voice.
Why so hyperbolic? WINS is not "something new" and everyone on the radio forums obviously owns an FM radio.

As I said, there's no mention at all of WNYC. So I can only assume they don't know it's there.
 
I made the "Dentist's Board" reference without intent of malice. I have posted on that board off-and-on for over 20 years under my real name and I personally have never had an issue with Allan Sniffen's background or expertise.

I know others don't share the same opinion, and I can understand and respect that. There's a FB group called "NY Radio and TV Board", where the mere mention of Sniffen and the NYRMB is frowned upon. The moderator and many posters there have all had their issues with Sniffen and stopped posting on his board.
 
There's a list we made that are not exactly going to replace WCBS 880 but that's where the audience is today. One had suggested WICC as the place to go to as the new place for suburban audiences to go to. Note I didn't consider that one specifically I ran with the majority statement on where former WCBS-AM listeners can go to like 92.3 WINS, 1010 WINS, 93.9 WNYC, 820 WNYC on the OTA side, CBS News Radio and CBS News TV audio, WCBS-TV News audio from the Audacy app. None of then can exactly replace WCBS-AM but that's where the audience is at today.


Connoisseur Media rebrands news/talk WICC Bridgeport, CT (600) to “The Voice of Connecticut” following the expansion of the station via a simulcast on the former rock “95.9 The Fox” WFOX, Danbury. WICC is also carried on the Bridgeport-licensed FM translator W297CP at 107.3.

Capitalizing on the recent demise of news WCBS (880), the station is positioning itself as Fairfield County’s premier source for news, talk, and information. The county is the most populous in the state and was previously served by the 50,000-watt 880 signal, which Good Karma Brands is now operating as “ESPN New York 880” WHSQ.
 
This is completely false. WNYC and NPR's style of news delivery sounds nothing at all like WCBS did. WCBS was full of musical sounders and high energy radio production values that were the polar opposite of WNYC's "dry delivery" and dead air segues.
And people on the NYRMB complained about that, too. How dare WCBS play a few seconds of "Riders on the Storm" after the weather report!? And God forbid they have a news anchor with a "cutesy" name! It's de-legitimizing the station!
 
Humor isn't "dumbing down." If you want to hear dumbing down, listen to WABC.

WINS has always been more casual in its presentation. These folks want the return of Walter Cronkite.
Would Walter Cronkite doing the news right now be a bad thing. Surely better than anything currently on CNN/MSNBC/Fox News.

I don't want to be entertained watching the news. I want the news.
 
Would Walter Cronkite doing the news right now be a bad thing.

Keep in mind that Walter was primarily a writer. Not a TV star. Before getting hired by CBS, he was at UPI, which at the time was viewed as "the first draft of history." So for him, it all begins with writing. That's also where it begins at NPR. People often complain about the NPR delivery, that it's dull or often not very polished. That's because the writing is more important than the delivery. So when people say the WINS presentation is too entertaining, then maybe they want NPR.
 


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