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An Open Letter to WBRF-FM 98.1: now is the time to go all Oldies!

  • Thread starter GoodTimesandGreatOldies
  • Start date

RadioOCD said:
Oh boy, here we go again. Amos, help me out here.
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playing charlie brown's "on the beach" does not make them a condender for changing format, no matter how unusual it might be.
 
WBRF is a heritage country station, remember. It's not like it's a two-bit 3,000 watt hick station. They have carried Wake Forest sports for years, and still carry CBS News every hour on the hour. They also have Aunt Eloise in the morning, who used to be on WTQR.

They also carry almost every CBS News and NASCAR feature available. No way is this going to become an oldies station.
 
tothedj said:
After reading what Kevin said in regards to the "Oldies" format, i like his strategy, is this station online?
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We are not streaming at the present time. However, that could happen before the end of the year.

We're owned by a local Village, and we're talking with them about the possibility of allowing us use of the building's internet they use (since their capacity is pretty good). If everything comes in within the bandwidth we'd need (since we're looking at more than just streaming) it's all possible.

I'll tell you a little more about the station. If you haven't guessed by now, we're an LP-FM. (100 watts). We just installed a new digital audio processor to the station, and we're getting about 4-5 miles of "solid" coverage (which does cover the immediate local lake area and resort areas), and our city of license. If you can put up with a little (or a lot of) static, we have been heard 10-14 miles away from the transmitter. We can put our antenna up a little higher (they ran out of money when they were building the station, I'm told.), and we plan to do so this summer, thanks to the increase in underwriting.

And I don't mind saying: this is a project for me. I agreed to volunteer my time and expertise, because I believe in the notion of "community broadcasting". Wherever possible, I use local voices to do our spots and features (though I'm fortunate in that the folks at the station I work for during the week help me, as do students at the local broadcasting college at which I teach).
So many LP-FM's end up getting programming like they're "the owner or manager's personal i-Pod",
run like the "anti-radio", etc. I just wanted to see what would happen with one of these things if they were programmed professionally and based on sound programming principles.

It's a work in progress, but so far...so good.
 
nuffsaid said:
Kevin! One of the best post I have read in a long time. Seems we have a real programmer on the board that is talking programming and has knowledge of music and rotation. A programmer would be hard pressed to find 5,000 tunes that could be classified as "hits" or favorites of a particular demo. If you look at it this way .. 5,000 tunes relates to 250 tunes per year if you are covering a 20 year period of time. I am not sure there are 250 "favorites" for each year. I found your post to be refreshing and very much on target.
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Thank you for your kind words, Nuff...and to put in the language you use, we're picking songs from 30 years of music...at 5,000 tunes in library, that would be around 200 or so. Most year end countdowns are 100 or less, so just how many songs could possibly be "hits" or "favorites"? It would certainly be less than 100 for each year. (Though about anything in that 100 might make a position in a "library" or "universe".)
 
Brian said:
Regarding the technical angle, many of the area's radio stations are short-spaced, meaning that the FCC allowed them to operate too close to each other with taller towers, higher power than they should be allowed, etc. Basically, this is because we're at the edge of two zones, one affecting VA, the other NC. The rules on power, tower height, etc. conflict where the zones meet. Bottom line though, the FCC won't let you worsen a short-spaced problem.

Right now, WBRF doesn't quite put a "city grade" signal over Winston, much less Greensboro. In addition, as already mentioned, 98.3 and 98.1 tear each other up in many areas. WBRF is restricted from moving closer to Greensboro and Winston by both WIST and WSMW (98.3 is second adjacent to 98.1, 98.7 is third adjacent). FWIW, 98.7 and 98.3 are short-spaced with each other, too (by many miles). Both are short-spaced with 'BRF, so 'BRF can't get any closer.
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I'd say WBRF must also protect adjacent channel 97.9 WPEG in Concord. If WBRF ever wanted to move to a larger market, I'd guess it would be Roanoke.
 
I respect Kevin's experience, but I AM the listener who will "hang on" breathlessly to the 5000 song playlist,
wondering what will be next. Sure do hope it's not Red Rubber Ball!
The deeper you dig, the longer I'll listen. Yes, I know I'm weird.
There was a breif window when XM seemed to be doing that, and the few times I had a rental car with XM, it was fun.
But then they got a Ritalin prescription like the rest of radio and now they can behave like an adult.
 
Tom Wells said:
I respect Kevin's experience, but I AM the listener who will "hang on" breathlessly to the 5000 song playlist,
wondering what will be next. Sure do hope it's not Red Rubber Ball!
The deeper you dig, the longer I'll listen. Yes, I know I'm weird.
There was a breif window when XM seemed to be doing that, and the few times I had a rental car with XM, it was fun.
But then they got a Ritalin prescription like the rest of radio and now they can behave like an adult.
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Tom: I never said folks like you don't exist. I've talked to a number of people such as you over the years.

I only respectfully suggest you are in the minority of radio listeners. That doesn't make you weird, either.

There is a station like that here in my area. Another LP - they do show up in the ARB, generally less than a half a share point 12 plus. OK for them, and that's fine (it at least proves someone is listening). My personal opinion: they'd crack a one if they streamlined a bit, which would help them increase their cume and TSL. But, some stations don't have to play to ratings in this arena and I wish them well. Certainly, they do better than an AM nearby which tried to play 5,000 songs...it never even showed in the ARB...ever. (And they needed to, because they were a commercial station.)

However, just ask yourself: Why did XM change? Answer: focusing the music made more people listen...They're a business too...they learned that after a failed business model which had them positioning themselves as the "anti-radio". Even they had to have some channels which tightened the lists down to attract audience.
 
I find it very difficult to believe that the good folks at 98.1 FM are ignoring this great, free advice. This is what's wrong with radio. You could pay a consultant (you listening, Kabrich) thousands of bucks and never get the brilliance shown here.

(somewhere I departed the sarcasm highway and the truth seeped in a little bit)
 
As an individual, you don't own the airwaves. Kevin, the AM station to which you referred rotated about 2200 songs..still way too many. The other LPFM has about 6000.
 
gr8oldies said:
As an individual, you don't own the airwaves. Kevin, the AM station to which you referred rotated about 2200 songs..still way too many. The other LPFM has about 6000.
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Gr8t:

It's Kevin under a different log-in. (Didn't intend to do it..I typed in an old password by mistake tonight.)

You know me well enough now to know I realize I don't "own the airwaves". And I didn't mean to rub anyone the wrong way (that's why I didn't mention call letters, people or cities, including mine). I appreciate your acknowledgement that 2,200 songs is "way too many". And, if you read back to my first post, you'll notice that I mentioned that I, too...tried, and failed to do that. My mention of 5,000 songs came from a comment made to someone I know from the original Program Director of that station, who said his intention was to download "5,000 songs".
None of us were aware if he ever got there. So, that's the reason my number was off.

So, if 2,200 hundred is way too much, logic dictates 6,000 is beyond the pale. I rest my case.

But, as an American, I still have the right to an opinion. And I know you know that. My opinions are based upon a 35 year career, of which I have learned much by trial and error. I'm just now at the point in my career where I don't mind expressing my opinions. And, at least a good part of the time, I'm right...or, at least logical in my thinking. Anything I express, opinion-wise, should be taken for what it is. And nothing more. My apologies if you took anything I said too personally.
 
Hi all-

Oldies playlists are funny... market to market, station to station, none are the same. When I was PD at Oldies 93 WMQX in Greensboro, I had round 800 songs in the playlist. Our average much test tried about 1,500 songs. We were the number 3 oldies station in America by 12+ market share and were frequently #1-3 25-54 in the market. After moving to Raleigh to take the same reigns at Oldies 100.7 WTRG, who had very low ratings & round 300 songs rotating, we increased the number to about 450-500. That and a great staff of pros moved the ratings to points where we were alwaya top 5 25-54 til I left.

I believe with many that you gotta play the big smashes over and over as our audeince doesn't want to wait too long for their favortie songs to come back around.... but I also believe that two, three, maybe four times an hour, you have to have an "oh wow" song come along. After all, the listener of this format comes to the station for memories of years gone by.... not always memories of a few hours ago when you last played that tired old Cyrkle song. Play a song they love that they forgot and they will worship you.

Let's not forget that many of the syndicated shows add to our playlist number when they drop in their own "oh wow" cuts.

We had fun back then. Both of those stations were amazing to work at. Now, I operate 5 popular and very profitable iTunes/net stations... with one of them branding itself as "Modern Oldies" - IE 70s, 80s & 90s - complete with jocks (some from both WMQX & WTRG) and Tony Griffin jingles. That station calls the Carolinas home and plays round 600 songs.... all hits and all memorable... to the best of my memory (lol)... 5,000+ friends on Myspace all 35-54 located in either NC or SC. We ain't doing too bad...

This was fun reading. In my next oldies related venture, maybe I can bring some of you guys into the discussions. What passionate oldies consultants! All of you have good points and it's such a pleasure running into lovers of NC/SC oldies all in one place!

Keep up that chat!


Dave Solomon - former PD WMQX/WTRG & more... much more....
Positive Peak Radio Network
"We like oldies too.... now where is that Supremes song?"
 
When WIST was playing standards, a News and Record article said they had 2000 songs in their playlist. The article described it as oldies, but still, it was an unusual station.

I heard WBRF in a restaurnat which the previous time I was there, and most times I was there, they had on Sirius 70s. That was some pretty amazing stuff. I hope I get lucky after WIST changes. I'm going to keep a button for 98.3 because when I go to the beach, and even in a couple of places near where I live, that's standards/easy listening. REAL old people music. 98.1 will be one click over. All those good songs I heard, especially one REALLY OLD sounding song, seemed to be requests. But most of my experiences with WBRF messing up WIST haven't been good ones.

I wouldn't mind Rush but he's not on much of the time I'm in the car when I'm in the area. Glenn Beck is, and I sure won't put up with his garbage. I do have a button for that station but it's beautiful music a few miles west of where I live. Unfortunately, Bill Flynn usually drowns that out, and it gets worse as the day continues.
 
An earlier post suggested that WBRF might move to Roanoke WZZU 97.9 is already operating in the Roanoke-Lynchburg market so I would think that would be unlikely.
 
carolinaradio said:
vchimpanzee, would you be talking about WMUU? I've always wondered if you liked their beautiful music. They are pretty popular I think.
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Well, I've tried to. It leans too classical, really. Plus there's too much Christian music, but that's the Christian music I would listen to if I wanted to. But it can sound good.
 
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