• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

Are 'hip' people really less likely to wear people meters?

S

Steenman

In kind of a related post to some of what's been posted here, a rep at a local station who's 'tweeking' their format told me one of the factors is that 'people who listen to our station (read: hip people) just won't wear people meters'. This is an interesting claim to make I'm not sure if it is substantiated in some way it well could be- but absent that information - I'd like to throw this open to the brain trust here to comment on. If this is true (and maybe it is) then shouldn't KPLU have low ratings, or KIRO-FM or any station that appeals to upper income, upper demo types that don't need the $50 a month or whatever they pay you to wear a meter? I'd perhaps even argue the other way 'hey I'm passionate about my music and my radio station - so heck yeah I'll wear a meter if it helps them" or would people contacted by ARB to participate even understand that?

So the question: Are hip people really less likely to wear a people meter (or is this b.s)? Have at folks... :D
 
I think on the whole, yes.

Think about it. For example, KMTT. Do you think the average, higher income, educated adult listeners of KMTT would be the type by and large to undertake the obligation of a PPM carry? So the hipper portion of the audience doesn't and KMTT goes more classic rock as a result.

The whole debate would be much different if it were an Iphone app instead of a meter. But I doubt the people who don't carry the meters know what effect that has on their favorite station. It's likely they simply are too busy and there's not enough reward for doing it, and many of them just don't want to carry another gadget (which they might be suspicious of anyway.)
 
Ah, the PPM debate. If Arbitron is to be believed, their methodology and sample is valid.

There was a debate similar by Indie 103.1 supporters a few years back as it left the terrestrial airwaves in Los Angeles. They said their core audience didn't like the idea of the wearing a PPM device. Thus, Indie's awful numbers in the PPM. They further argued PPM was flawed because Arbitron couldn't get a proper sample of their audience.

Indie's problem wasn't PPM, in my opinion instead more based on limited signal and a niche playlist. If part of the Los Angeles sample can't receive Indie clearly and those people were in their prime demos - you bet they aren't going to show up. They can't hear it!

Hipsters refusing wear the device is a red herring. Arbitron is after their sample. If someone doesn't wish to participate in the proper demo, they move on to someone else. Eventually they will find willing participants who fit the sample they want and agree to wear the PPM. It's pretty simple. You might argue their methodology. You might argue how they get there. Arbitron stands behind their samples are accurate representations of the surveyed market's listening patterns.

It's easy to blame PPM for this and that. I'm not really into that. It's all about what people are exposed to: consciously or not.
 
Probably a lot better odds that 'hip' people (however you figure out a way to define that) are more likely to use an electronic device than fill out a paper diary properly every day for a week.
 
To answer the question, less likely than others to wear the ppm. But also less likely to listen to radio. More likely to use alternate means to get news, information, music. I know many of these so called hip people
and most are too good turn on a radio or TV. I know thats BS!
 
The alternative comment is interesting, but then shouldn't KNDD here in Seattle have poor ratings? Or is the implication that a bunch of broke young people listen that need the money and will wear a device. If it's about wearing a device to get paid, and we're going to go with stereotypes, then shouldn't the Hispanic station be number one? I'm being over the top here on purpose so that you see my point. Let's ask the question another way: is there any information out there that shows that listeners of a certain type of format are MORE or LESS likely to wear a PPM device. Think of it as 'indexing' for instance Country, Hispanic and Easy Listening might way over index while News, and Indie music might under index. Is there any information to support this kind of thinking, or is it just an excuse a radio station is using because they really don't have the listeners and this is a way to 'blame arbitron' (funny I never hear a station 'blame arbitron' when they have a great book, only when they have a bad one).
 
Most every time i've heard this argument it was in reference to "urban" leaning stations.

I think the OP was probably being PC when he referred to "hip people." Meaning blacks who like their bling or those who emulate blacks who like the big shiny bling.
 
I tend to think for the most part that indie leaning, triple A, alternative/modern and public radio music stations often are truly underrepresented.

Here's a question. KEXP. Their ratings are never great. Yet the station obviously has an impact. Ask people playing shows, and doing events KEXP is involved with, look at the listeners that directly contribute to the station, etc.

Is KEXP well rated? No.
Does KEXP get results within its mission and purpose? Absolutely.

That's why I'm concerned with people basing their view of a stations success or lack thereof on PPM numbers. You can have a viable product that just doesn't produce in PPM. But that's no reason for them to flip to CHR tomorrow.
 
JimmyJames said:
I tend to think for the most part that indie leaning, triple A, alternative/modern and public radio music stations often are truly underrepresented.

Here's a question. KEXP. Their ratings are never great. Yet the station obviously has an impact. Ask people playing shows, and doing events KEXP is involved with, look at the listeners that directly contribute to the station, etc.

Is KEXP well rated? No.
Does KEXP get results within its mission and purpose? Absolutely.

That's why I'm concerned with people basing their view of a stations success or lack thereof on PPM numbers. You can have a viable product that just doesn't produce in PPM. But that's no reason for them to flip to CHR tomorrow.
Click to expand...

There are certainly people who won't answer the phone to talk to Arbitron, let alone wear the meter. Hip or not. But it's a tough generalization to say that a certain format's listeners won't to the degree that it causes the station to suffer more than any other format. AAA's problems are deeper than a very lousy measuring system. The AAA audience is an aging, shrinking part of the larger radio universe. In the November book there were only 3 AAA stations in the top 10 in their respective (medium to major) markets. Most were 15th - 20th. Not a rank that works for most owners in the current business climate. And, in the current business climate, being 17th IS a reason to flip formats tomorrow. Or, fire most of the staff and run it on autopilot until who knows when. KEXP's impact is on a small sub-group of the larger population that is visible to the media community. Concert goers, etc. But, KEXP would not survive if it had to produce revenue as most commercial stations are expected to.
 
I'd wear one but no one has asked me - I'd tell people it was a medical device that fed me my life saving drugs that keep me from shrinking into oblivion.

On the one hand, they are clearly a more accurate measure, on the other it mainly shows what people have settled on as least offensive in the work place / public places.

How else do you explain the high ratings of stations that play "holiday favorites"? Dori Monson is a BILE FILLED GAS BAG (don't stand next to him with a sharp object) and Ron & Don? Well, what can one say. At least I don't have to listen to that Fat Man... As for me, I take in Dave Ross in the AM and quickly move to KOMO in the PM. I'd listen to Tom Leykis over Dori!

I'm mystified at why KIRO keeps Dave Ross, though I'm happy they do. Must be his CBS bona fides. Long live Dave Ross.
 
JimmyJames said:
Is KEXP well rated? No.
Does KEXP get results within its mission and purpose? Absolutely.
Click to expand...

What does "well rated" mean?

To some it may mean "reaching / being accepted by their demographic". That's *NOT* your business manager's definition.
 
I wonder how many C89.5 listeners wore / wear meters, and how often that station even gets recognized. I noticed not one person has spoken about C89.5 so far within the four pages of this portion of the boards I've checked. Meanwhile, quite a few people in L.A. and New York have been consistently begging for that type of format. I kind of wonder how a C89.5 format would do in Atlanta on one of their many college stations. ... And how did Seattle, out of all places, manage to get a station like that?
 
Arty Ziff said:
... and Ron & Don? ...
Click to expand...

LOL, so THAT'S where they went to?

Takes me back to the old KZZP in 1999 when Backstreet Boys, Brandy, Smash Mouth, Jennifer Lopez, Venga Boys, Usher, Christina Aguilera, Will Smith, NSYNC, Next, LFO, Lauren Hill, Britney Spears, Tal Bachman, Sugar Ray, Goo Goo Dolls, 702, Lou Bega, Ricky Martin, TLC, Santana, Marc Anthony, Cher, Destiny's Child, and Whitney Houston etc. were the hits!

Ron & Don in the morning! ..on Arizona's Hit Music Station, 1999! ...Always talking trash about the "yo yo yo" station that was at the other end of the dial Where Hip Hop Lived! I miss that time of Mainstream CHR vs. Rhythmic Hip Hop battling. That was silly. Talking trash about the hip station, then afterwards, Sixpence None The Richer would come on. Oh man...  :D

Well flash forward to today and ClearChannel owns KZZP now, and according to the relatively new PPM ratings, they're no longer Arizona's #1 Hit Music Station. I'll just say; You've gotta love CBS and their local talent chr stations!
 
I work with a bunch of people who rock cell phone holsters and to whom $50/month would be eagerly accepted.

The "white socks, black shoes" demographic. ;)
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom