Ashland WI residents rally to Packers instead of Vikings

[nomadcowatbk]

Ashland is small town in the Duluth DMA
http://www.ashlandwi.com/opinion/letters/article_6f44d5e8-fa67-11e3-8427-001a4bcf887a.html

 

[blizzard59]

You cross the Minnesota-Wisconsin state line and you pretty much cross the Vikings-Packers fan boundaries as well. This can be a problem in the 12 counties of Wisconsin that are either in the Minneapolis-St. Paul or Duluth, MN-Superior, WI DMA. The former is the home market of the Vikings while the latter has more Minnesota households than Wisconsin households so will show Vikings games over Packers games when there is a scheduling conflict. The only area of Minnesota where the reverse can be a problem is the far southeastern counties of Houston and Winona. They are in the La Crosse-Eau Claire, WI DMA, which naturally gives preferential treatment to the Packers over the Vikings.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

You cross the Minnesota-Wisconsin state line and you pretty much cross the Vikings-Packers fan boundaries as well. This can be a problem in the 12 counties of Wisconsin that are either in the Minneapolis-St. Paul or Duluth, MN-Superior, WI DMA. The former is the home market of the Vikings while the latter has more Minnesota households than Wisconsin households so will show Vikings games over Packers games when there is a scheduling conflict. The only area of Minnesota where the reverse can be a problem is the far southeastern counties of Houston and Winona. They are in the La Crosse-Eau Claire, WI DMA, which naturally gives preferential treatment to the Packers over the Vikings.

If the station was located in Superior of Duluth, would they be getting the Packers instead of the Vikings? Could Ashland succeed into another DMA? Could the management just has a Vikings bias being in Minnesota?

 

[ftballfan]

The Upper Peninsula has a similar dilemma, but between the Packers and the Lions. The local FOX affiliate (WLUC-DT2) takes the Packers over the Lions. UP-based stations have traditionally taken the Packers over the Lions, except when WMQF was the FOX affiliate and WLUC-DT2's first two years or so. Before WMQF signed on, WGKI/WFQX (and WWUP when NFC games were on CBS) were on most cable systems in the Upper Peninsula. During this entire time, WLUK from Green Bay was found on the local cable systems, allowing WMQF or WLUC-DT2 to air Lions games in cases of conflict. A couple years back, WLUK was dropped from the cable systems (yet still has an owned translator [in digital!] in the market) and WLUC-DT2 has shifted to taking the Packers.

 

[Mr Tony]

I find it funny honestly. Its only been going on for what 50 years?

The northern part of Wisconsin is the Duluth DMA. There are no other stations nearby. In previous years the NFL TRIES to schedule as few Packers/Vikings games at same time/same network so that the two states can show as many games as possible locally. Apparently this year isnt the case

There is no way around it if the schedule is like it is.

 

[Mr Tony]

If the station was located in Superior of Duluth, would they be getting the Packers instead of the Vikings? Could Ashland succeed into another DMA? Could the management just has a Vikings bias being in Minnesota?

nope. TECHNICALLY KBJR (the NBC) is licensed to Superior, WI but its transmitter/station/studio is in Duluth (downtown/canal park area)
The FOX station (KQDS) does show Packer Pre-season games as the Vikes are on ABC WDIO

 

[nathannah]

I find it funny honestly. Its only been going on for what 50 years?

The northern part of Wisconsin is the Duluth DMA. There are no other stations nearby. In previous years the NFL TRIES to schedule as few Packers/Vikings games at same time/same network so that the two states can show as many games as possible locally. Apparently this year isnt the case

There is no way around it if the schedule is like it is.

The problem is Fox's 'one affiliate' to a market contractual obligation that has kicked in over the last few years. In the past, you could easily have KQDS, Wausau's WFXS and WLUK co-exist to serve Ashland and Northern Wisconsin/the UP easily without any issues (Equity's terrible Fox affiliate in Marquette was pretty much a sideshow until it was put out of its misery in 2009 by the digital transition and got transferred to another party). But now you have WLUC-DT2 and Sinclair basically declaring they're exclusive and Fox is telling WLUK they have to remove their UP carriage (I lost it here too where I lived a couple years back). WFXS's radius is non-existent in the area, so now you have KQDS and WLUC-DT2 trying to deal with the fanbases of three teams in Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan and not really able to satisfy anybody.

And even if KQDS was licensed to Superior, it's still within the Vikings market. At least in the MSP-La Crosse area KMSP and WEUX/WLAX are easily received via antenna...it's much harder in that northern area of the state.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

The problem is Fox's 'one affiliate' to a market contractual obligation that has kicked in over the last few years. In the past, you could easily have KQDS, Wausau's WFXS and WLUK co-exist to serve Ashland and Northern Wisconsin/the UP easily without any issues (Equity's terrible Fox affiliate in Marquette was pretty much a sideshow until it was put out of its misery in 2009 by the digital transition and got transferred to another party). But now you have WLUC-DT2 and Sinclair basically declaring they're exclusive and Fox is telling WLUK they have to remove their UP carriage (I lost it here too where I lived a couple years back). WFXS's radius is non-existent in the area, so now you have KQDS and WLUC-DT2 trying to deal with the fanbases of three teams in Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan and not really able to satisfy anybody.

And even if KQDS was licensed to Superior, it's still within the Vikings market. At least in the MSP-La Crosse area KMSP and WEUX/WLAX are easily received via antenna...it's much harder in that northern area of the state.

even if KQDS didn't have exclusivity, would Charter even want to pay retrans fees to WFXS or WLUK? Could Ashland residents with a Dish use an address in Green Bay to get WLUK?

 

[nomadcowatbk]

If a cable system has two or more CBS or Fox affiliates and they're each airing different NFL games, do SYNDEX laws apply? Would KQDS care if the 8000 views in Ashland WI were put into a different DMA?

 

[nathannah]

They might not, but Fox does. WLUK posted an FAQ after they lost their OOM Charter viewers explaining that if someone watched a Fox show on an OOM station, it didn't get Nielsen credit at all, which is why Fox would tell cable systems to apply SYNDEX to the out-of-market station so they could get as much Nielsen credit as possible. Since few cable providers actually have the manpower (or local office) to blackout the OOM stations during network time, they just choose not to carry them altogether. CBS and ABC as far as I know leave it as an affiliate decision to apply SYNDEX, but it's mandatory for Fox affiliates under their agreements.

Also, yes, Charter was willing to pay retrans to the OOM stations and had done so for LIN/WLUK for years until the new Fox affiliation agreement and Charter retransmission agreements came together, along with WLUC's demands to carry their DT2 exclusively (the situation in the Milwaukee market where I'm at was a lot more 'we don't really want this especially in the cross-viewership areas on the significant viewership list, but Fox said so' between WLUK and Local/Tribune's WITI; their ties are very collegial as fellow Fox affiliates and 1994 switchers). Fox superseded anything Charter and LIN wanted, and WLUK went away except in-market on cable.

 

[ftballfan]

They might not, but Fox does. WLUK posted an FAQ after they lost their OOM Charter viewers explaining that if someone watched a Fox show on an OOM station, it didn't get Nielsen credit at all, which is why Fox would tell cable systems to apply SYNDEX to the out-of-market station so they could get as much Nielsen credit as possible. Since few cable providers actually have the manpower (or local office) to blackout the OOM stations during network time, they just choose not to carry them altogether. CBS and ABC as far as I know leave it as an affiliate decision to apply SYNDEX, but it's mandatory for Fox affiliates under their agreements.

Also, yes, Charter was willing to pay retrans to the OOM stations and had done so for LIN/WLUK for years until the new Fox affiliation agreement and Charter retransmission agreements came together, along with WLUC's demands to carry their DT2 exclusively (the situation in the Milwaukee market where I'm at was a lot more 'we don't really want this especially in the cross-viewership areas on the significant viewership list, but Fox said so' between WLUK and Local/Tribune's WITI; their ties are very collegial as fellow Fox affiliates and 1994 switchers). Fox superseded anything Charter and LIN wanted, and WLUK went away except in-market on cable.

I wouldn't be surprised if DirecTV subscriptions have gone up in areas like these, mostly for Sunday Ticket. To add to this mess, WLUK still operates a digital translator in WLUC-DT2's territory. In Ironwood, BOTH KQDS and WLUC-DT2 are carried (but it's in the Duluth market). There are quite a few communities in Central Lower Michigan that get WFQX along with either WBKB-DT2, WSMH, or WXMI (they usually carry the same games anyway).