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Denver Colorado Public Radio moves away from the term "migrant"

When the Pilgrims came here, there was "No long and tedious process" (Except crossing the Atlantic by ship).
Keep bending reality for your narrative.

There has always been a racial fear attached to "immigrants". Some places once had signs "No Irish need apply". The "Border Crisis" is overblown to a degree. It's great propaganda to stoke hate and fear among the populace especially in an election year.

Businesses in America cannot find workers. Very few Americans want to pick lettuce or apples in the blazing sun nor do landscaping in the Texas heat. Employers exploit immigrants because they know they cannot file a grievance.
In an alternate reality I might be doing those jobs, but my government chose to print trillions of dollars out of thin air leading to rampant inflation. You know how to improve the economic situation of our nation and keep illegal imigrants from being exploited? Enforce our existing border and immigration laws so that they become citizens and contribute taxes toward the services that they are consuming. This does not take any new laws.

Seasonal agricultural workers used to do this. Come up from Mexico, on a work visa, harvest, make a ton of money, pay tax on it, and head on back to Mexico for a better life.
The hypocrisy by most of the people on the Far Right is despicable.

As for the terminology -- Birds are migrants. Humans are just seeking a better life by immigrating. That's no different from the Pilgrims. Of course, Native Americans had to be slaughtered and displaced to achieve the American Utopia...
Borders, language, and culture define a country. What happened to the Roman Empire? Oh yeah.... Fall of the Western Roman Empire - Wikipedia
 
In an alternate reality I might be doing those jobs,
Oh come on.
my government chose to print trillions of dollars out of thin air leading to rampant inflation.
Prices go up because the companies that make and sell the products raise the prices. Not because of the government.

Enforce our existing border and immigration laws so that they become citizens and contribute taxes toward the services that they are consuming. This does not take any new laws.
Even under Trump, they needed new laws. He couldn't fix the border either. They need more border police.
Seasonal agricultural workers used to do this. Come up from Mexico, on a work visa, harvest, make a ton of money, pay tax on it, and head on back to Mexico for a better life.
Then they unionized, got higher wages, and the farm owners couldn't afford to pay them anymore. Farm owners prefer this situation, and they don't have to worry about any left wing union coming in demanding more money.

These people are coming here because there are jobs. You want to stop them? Enforce the employment laws. Lock up employers who hire illegals. But then who will do all the jobs they're going? Oh yeah, hire 14 year olds and screw them over instead of immigrants.
 
In an alternate reality I might be doing those jobs, but my government chose to print trillions of dollars out of thin air leading to rampant inflation. You know how to improve the economic situation of our nation and keep illegal imigrants from being exploited? Enforce our existing border and immigration laws so that they become citizens and contribute taxes toward the services that they are consuming. This does not take any new laws.

Seasonal agricultural workers used to do this. Come up from Mexico, on a work visa, harvest, make a ton of money, pay tax on it, and head on back to Mexico for a better life.

Borders, language, and culture define a country. What happened to the Roman Empire? Oh yeah.... Fall of the Western Roman Empire - Wikipedia
America doesn't even guarantee Health Care to its citizens, however you can get unlimited quantities of assault weapons. The laws you mentioned are easily exploited. Millionaires know the loopholes to avoid paying taxes. Citizens and Undocumented immigrants both pay sales tax when they buy groceries. Employers exploit immigrants because it's easy and cheap. Why aren't these Labour Laws enforced?

Yes, the Roman Empire collapsed. The US is still an infant nation that may not survive. Immigration won't be the reason it falls apart...
 
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For anyone wanting to minimize the border problem, go live there a while. I'm all for welcoming those who want a better life and I think we have an obligation to help as we can individually. I know many exceptional people who came here through the proper channels. My first job was in a town that was 97% Hispanic, 2% Mix and 1% Anglo. I could look out at the right to the lights in homes across the river. I thought that was so cool. There are laws on the books to deal with this issue. I have a soft spot for the immigrant but not for those who make the choice to break our laws.

The good people are not the problem. The problem is the bad and the good who are so desperate because the criminal aspect has robbed them blind just to get here. When you have decent people having to steal to survive, that can be understood but it should not be happening. On the ranch my father-in-law managed, those crossing illegally frequently would come up to the house and turn on the water faucet for water as some would mill around looking for something they could steal in order to sell for food, shelter and so forth. When there's 40 or 50 around your house, it's a bit scary because you don't know their intentions. I know it happened while I was there visiting with my wife all too frequently. Cattle were killed and fences torn down among other things. Anything not locked up was taken. On more than one occasion people tried to break in. Everybody in the ranch house was always armed just in case. When they broke a window my father-in-law stuck his shotgun out the busted window and fired away from the people and they ran off. Ironically there were always a few Border Patrol units on the sprawling ranch but only a fraction every got caught. Then there were the small planes landing and unidentified vehicles that met them, mostly at night.

By the way, the Pilgrims came here the land now known as the United States had no government. There were tribes of native inhabitants who had internal government. That's surely apples and oranges. Eventually some saw the opportunities and came here, established colonies and British rule.

As a matter of fact, the early settlers were comprised of those seeking religious freedom, were criminals or debtors. Europeans saw an opportunity to rid themselves of those less desirables. Amazingly, as disadvantaged as we were, we created a remarkable nation. We literally changed the world from government to advances in knowledge and it's associated results. My distant relatives came here by sea and had to work for the host family many years before being free and with little more than the clothes on their backs. I'm sure some families began paying some so they could build a life.
 
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For anyone wanting to minimize the border problem, go live there a while.

Then again, this is supposed to be the Denver board. The migrants in Denver were bussed there by the governor of Texas:

Texas has sent 15,700 people to Denver since May. Initially, many were Venezuelans applying for asylum who had “Temporary Protected Status” under a federal program that allows people from some crisis-hit countries to live and work legally in the United States for a period of time. The city was able to help get the migrants on their feet and soon, they were self-sufficient members of the community, Johnston said.
 
By the way, the Pilgrims came here the land now known as the United States had no government. There were tribes of native inhabitants who had internal government. That's surely apples and oranges. Eventually some saw the opportunities and came here, established colonies and British rule.
The way of life for the Native Americans changed dramatically by the invading Pilgrims. The history of how the US was built is complex and bloody. The body count was quite high.

Most of the crime in America is being committed by Americans. The narrative that dangerous Illegals are overrunning the Country is absurd. There are MAGA people who want another Civil War to create separate countries. That has nothing to do with immigrants...
 
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The way of life for the Native Americans changed dramatically by the invading Pilgrims. The history of how the US was built is complex and bloody. The body count was quite high.

Most of the crime in America is being committed by Americans. The narrative that dangerous Illegals are overrunning the Country is absurd. There are MAGA people who want another Civil War to create separate countries. That has nothing to do with immigrants...
My Tennessee Senators assure me that we are being overrun by scary brown people, but everything looks the same. Couple of guys speaking Spanish at Wal-Mart but that's normal. I'm more afraid of our "everyone should have a gun in the passenger seat" mentality. The GOP got almost everything they wanted but alligator moats. If Trump gets in, let's see how deporting everyone who even looks Hispanic works for inflation.
 
When the Pilgrims came here, there was "No long and tedious process" (Except crossing the Atlantic by ship).
Keep bending reality for your narrative. Many Americans don't want immigrants coming in legal or otherwise.

There has always been a racial fear attached to immigrants. Some places once had signs "No Irish need apply". The "Border Crisis" is overblown to a degree. It's great propaganda to stoke hate and fear among the populace especially in an election year.

Businesses in America cannot find workers. Very few Americans want to pick lettuce or apples in the blazing sun nor do landscaping in the Texas heat. Employers exploit immigrants because they know they cannot file a grievance. The hypocrisy by most of the people on the Far Right is despicable.

As for the terminology -- Birds are migrants. Humans are just seeking a better life by immigrating. That's no different from the Pilgrims. Of course, Native Americans had to be slaughtered and displaced to achieve the American Utopia. Climate Change will force people to flee to other places. It's time for people to wake up to the fact that the Earth doesn't recognize borders or nations...
We are getting away from radio or TV related subject matter.

While you make some interesting points, what we want to see here on RadioDiscussion is how broadcaster are (or "should") address this and other controversial news subjects.
 
My Tennessee Senators assure me that we are being overrun by scary brown people, but everything looks the same. Couple of guys speaking Spanish at Wal-Mart but that's normal.
I've mentioned this incident before, but it is relevant to this discussion:

Some years back, I was with one of the talk hosts at KTNQ as we checked out some items from a supermarket deli section to take back to the station. We were talking in Spanish. A "gringa" (in the pejorative context of this word) in a dress that looked like it had lived a prior life as a curtain at a bordello said to us "you'll never get a good job if you don't learn English".

I turned towards her, and with my best English, said, "Ma'am, I speak five languages fairly well and my job is based in part on that. How many languages do you speak?"

She made a haughty grumping noise and turned away.

There is no vaccine against ignorance.
I'm more afraid of our "everyone should have a gun in the passenger seat" mentality. The GOP got almost everything they wanted but alligator moats. If Trump gets in, let's see how deporting everyone who even looks Hispanic works for inflation.
Actually, I am seeing a significant change among traditionally moderate Democrat Hispanics to the Red site. The main reason is considerable opposition to and rejection of virtually wide open borders.
 
While you make some interesting points, what we want to see here on RadioDiscussion is how broadcaster are (or "should") address this and other controversial news subjects.

The fair and objective way is unacceptable to people who have already (rightly or wrongly) formed their opinions.

That's what this thread has proven.
 
I would actually love to have that discussion. It's one we should be having more, and I am very sympathetic to the challenges CPR and other media outlets face.
If we could keep people from being distracted by wannabe keyboard warriors, but you and I both know that was a problem in the Usenet days and it hasn't changed.


How many reporters were covering Denver 30 years ago? The Post and the Rocky probably had 100+ people in each of their newsrooms. Now the Rocky is gone and Alden has cut the Post to shreds. Maybe there were 15-20 street reporters at each of five TV newsrooms then, plus whatever KOA had.
I wish I knew, but the newspaper archive sites I subscribe to have major holes in coverage in Colorado. I do have access to some Newsbank text-only articles through the Denver Public Library, which indicate that the Post was actually in some financial distress 30-35 years ago. So this may not be a new problem. The new part is Alden's determination to squeeze the last drop of blood out of the skeleton that remains of the Post...and then what?

I'll admit to not having bought a Post since I got here. Based what I see at Safeway or King Soopers in the late afternoon, with the newspaper racks far from empty, I'm not the only one avoiding a newspaper purchase. The same cast of characters that ran the Oakland Tribune East Bay Times into the ground have done the same here. Commercial radio coverage is confined to brief headlines at best. TV is a whole other topic but is probably in the best shape, for some value of "best", right now.

You can also see the stresses in Westword, the alternative newspaper. The website is good, but I suspect there are difficulties in getting direct support of that web presence. The print edition is supported by marijuana ads. Shades of Max Media, at least until the Pillar sale closes.

Alone among traditional media, public newsrooms have at least generally held their own or grown in size while everyone else has been shrinking, but that's never enough. Even if CPR were still KCFR and still focused only on greater Denver, it's still a painful series of daily choices to figure out what you can reasonably cover with a fraction of the reporters any newsroom used to have.
I think that's true of any newsroom. Even in the days when I ran a small-market news department with three other full-timers plus part-time staff, we had to make choices. That operation is down to one person so you can imagine that it's a shadow of its former self.

Then you have the public radio sensibility that says you don't take some of the shortcuts commercial media takes - the stuff you or I would have spent an hour or less per story working on back in our commercial news days, grabbing two quick bites over the phone and moving on to what's breaking next? I still know how to do that pretty well, but it's not what public newsrooms are built to do. Longer stories with more audio and deeper perspectives take longer and so you get less overall productivity from any given size of newsroom, which means you can cover even less overall.

And then you get to the statewide expansion of CFR and the task starts to look impossible. If you can't begin to wrap your arms around greater Denver and all that it includes, how do you do any justice to a sprawling state with completely different audiences on the far side of the Rockies?

From what I can see from a distance, they were at least smart to try to keep KRCC in the Springs as a somewhat separate operation. It's certainly its own distinct community and politics and I'm sure it's much better served by continuing what KRCC had been doing, instead of merging Springs coverage into Denver.

It's a setup that's all but guaranteed to fully please nobody, though. I know there are far too many voids in my newsroom's coverage of the million or so people in our coverage area. I can't imagine what it must be like trying to cover a much more diverse population more than five times that size.
I've noticed several philosophies of coverage among radio stations that engage in local reporting. I'll use Bay Area examples because I'm familiar with them over 20+ years of listening.

There's the reactive, spot-news heavy approach. This is the station you tune to when the ground shakes at 3:30 in the morning, in this case KCBS. There's no equivalent in Denver (leaving the earthquake example aside). KOA is a headline service, and not much of one. Oddly, co-owned KHOW actually seems to have more complete newscasts.

There's the approach of going more in-depth, not entirely ignoring the news of the day, but either providing more context to that news, or making an effort to uncover overlooked stories. I would call this the KQED approach.

There's the approach of explicitly not covering what others are covering, even if it's big news of the day, instead developing features that other stations are not likely to be interested in. That's the KALW approach.

There's the approach of just making stuff up to get people enervated. That's the modus operandi of most commercial talk stations.

I would place CPR between the KQED approach and the KALW approach. There is some coverage of the news of the day, particularly in the Morning Edition and ATC inserts, but there's also an emphasis on features - sometimes very long features that are of limited interest to general audiences - on programs such as "Colorado Matters" and a tendency to avoid covering more mundane topics. While I say those topics are "mundane" they often are exactly the kinds of things that are needed to get sense of one's community.

I'm interested in specific examples of where you think CPR falls short, or where the "typical public radio mindset" gets in the way of fuller coverage of a story or community. I've spent a lot of time in my 20 years in public radio with those ups and downs - for as much as my newsroom has changed to include more viewpoints and voices and community connections since I started there, there's always so much more yet to be done.
I obviously don't hear or see all of CPR's output, so I may be giving examples that aren't exactly fair to CPR. But here's one: the immigrant situation. Denver is leasing or buying hotels in order to house some of them. It so happens that most of those hotels are in the old Stapleton Airport area and are becoming a bit tattered. Problem is, this also concentrates the burden of solving the problem on one neighborhood, which, outside the actual area of Stapleton redevelopment is more of a lower-middle-class area. Wealthier areas in other parts of the city - Washington Park is an often-cited example - haven't been called upon to share the burden by having shelters or tiny houses or whatever in their neighborhoods. The potential for opposition is obvious, and has been realized in other neighborhoods. The councilwoman for the former Stapleton neighhborhood has pointed this out, repeatedly. Her message is basically: We've stepped up and done our part; now it's your turn. Not much changes. I haven't heard much coverage - or any, really - of this aspect of the immigrant housing crisis on CPR.

There are others, quite Denver-specific, starting with the deficiencies in public transit with RTD, the Regional Transit District (a/k/a "Reason To Drive") and expenditures on a forthcoming BRT (bus rapid transit) project on Colfax that appears likely to satisfy no one. At an open meeting a couple of months ago, I asked an RTD transit planner if they saw what happened with the Central Avenue BRT project in Albuquerque, which turned out to be a big mess, and took any lessons away from it and I got an evasive answer. It seems RTD is going full-steam ahead on an expensive, disruptive project that in the end may well fail to meet its objectives. Possibly CPR has covered this, particularly before I got here, but it's going to be an ongoing issue, especially once construction starts this spring, and I haven't heard any coverage of it recently.

And then don't get me started about DIA. It's growing way beyond expectations and the administrative bureaucracy of the airport just doesn't seem to know to keep up with that grow. For example: try finding parking that isn't located halfway to Kansas.

Yes, I know CPR isn't a Denver-only operation. But Denver is the largest city in the state - Colorado Springs is second, followed by Aurora - so spending time on in-depth features on obscure topics, while sometimes of interest, may not be the best use of its limited resources.

(And we're the lucky ones - unlike CPR and so many others, we have been spared newsroom staffing cuts so far.)
To be fair to CPR, Stuart Vanderwilt, the CEO, made it very clear that a goal of the recent restructuring was to avoid newsroom staffing cuts; the podcast operation took the brunt of the cuts. I think there is a recognition that CPR is filling some of the voids of news coverage that exist around here - but I still find myself somewhat frustrated with what I hear. I suppose you could wave it away and ask, "what did you expect, Roberts? Another KCBS? (Or, for TV, Another KTVU?)" Since it doesn't exist here, and given the current state of the radio business, I know I'm not going to get that. I just would like to get a better sense of the community I've chosen to retire to. That's actually been a great move for us, but the quality of the news media could stand considerable improvement. CPR is a part of the problem; they do help solve it somewhat, but I feel they could be doing more by altering their approach more toward the KQED mindset on news.
 
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We are getting away from radio or TV related subject matter.

While you make some interesting points, what we want to see here on RadioDiscussion is how broadcaster are (or "should") address this and other controversial news subjects.
The first post on this thread was about Colorado Public Radio and their approach to the subject. Some people obviously bristled at the idea that "Immigrants" should be humanized in any way. It's interesting that some folks want people in Gaza to get humanitarian aid. (Why doesn't their own government help them? Oh forgot -- The government are terrorists in Gaza.). Many folks object to helping immigrants on US soil because it's the old "Not in my backyard" mentality...


Link to Genesis "Illegal Alien" above for levity or more controversy...😑
 
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Time to give multi-quote a workout.

If you actually take the time to read CPR's explanation for its change of style, it makes a tremendous amount of sense and fits with what I have always considered a journalistic obligation to treat the least powerful humans with the most sensitivity and compassion. ("Comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable" and all that.)

Even if you don't agree with CPR's choice, at least recognize that they're doing something few outlets other than public media do, which is to take the time and trouble to carefully explain what they're doing and why. (I would love to see examples from other media... prove me wrong!)

True, they are giving their reasoning. Somehow I think that the people who wrote that explanation have had very little contact with illegals.

Really, David? That seems at odds with what CPR sets out as its own reasoning:

"But one distinguishing feature we feel sets our coverage apart is how hard we've worked to talk to the people arriving, getting a sense of their hopes and dreams, what they want to do and how they want to contribute to the U.S. We are proud of the work we've done in humanizing this newcomer population."

You're certainly entitled not to take them at their word, but it seems pretty clear to me that the drive behind the linguistic shift at CPR came in large part because their reporters are actually spending time in these communities and listening to the human beings in them. And unless your goal is to avoid seeing or treating them as fellow humans, that seems like a pretty decent thing to me.

That is sort of like journalists flying in to talk with the survivors of an earthquake. They can quote them, interview them and photograph them, but they will never know the feelings that those survivors went through during the disaster and after seeing the destruction and loss of friends afterwards.
Immigrants are being bused to Denver. They are here. There's no fly-in or network correspondent bigfooting involved. CPR is covering the story on a day-to-day basis. I feel they could do a better job of it at times, but they are out there doing it, as they should be. There is no insincerity in their explanation, in fact considerable decency in it, and it's obnoxious and wrong for you to imply that they are being insincere. But I guess you've never had the experience of being part of a sometimes oppressed community, so you can sit smugly at your keyboard and render all sorts of judgments that bear no relation to the reality in Denver. I find those judgments to be disgusting.

I've been critical of aspects CPR in this very thread, but I admire their commitment to transparency.
 
The fair and objective way is unacceptable to people who have already (rightly or wrongly) formed their opinions.

That's what this thread has proven.
One of the hardest (and uncompensated) tasks for the moderators here is determining how far away from actual radio and TV threads like this can wander. None of us, individually or collectively, can read all the posts all the time, making "policing" the site rather fuzzy.

Your point is naturally correct. Our opinions are jaded by the color of the lens we view things through.

I´ll repeat again my enlightening experience in Ecuador. Whenever there was an event locally that was widely reported in international media and news services, a group of us that included local journalists and stringers/reporters for outside news agencies and publications would meet and discuss or dissect the articles appearing in France Press, Reuters, TASS, Prensa Latina, AP, Time, and several European news magazines.

Events that got mentioned were generally "normal" presidential elections, various coup d'etat occasions, the discovery of oil in the rain forest areas, etc.

Our conclusion was that every article reported accurately what had happened. But the way each event was seen widely varied. TASS would highlight the un-proletarian causes of a coup, Time would focus on how the United States would be affected by the event... and so on.

While one group might find an event to be negative, another might find it close to being a new Wonder of the World.
 
The fair and objective way is unacceptable to people who have already (rightly or wrongly) formed their opinions.

That's what this thread has proven.
To reinforce your point, and to bring Hot-Button-Issue Number Two into the picture since this has already been about as much fun as a root canal, I'll recount a story from my time as a news director.

One of our reporters would go out and cover a protest against abortion restrictions. We would get a call from a local pro-lifer asking why we were promoting abortion and why we were so one-sided.

Then one of our reporters would go out and cover a pro-life protest. We would get a call from that same pro-lifer asking why were were promoting abortion and why we were so one-sided.

Yes, you read that right. No matter what we were covering and what we did with our coverage on the issue, that listener objected to it.
 
Your point is naturally correct. Our opinions are jaded by the color of the lens we view things through.

And opinions of the news media are equally jaded by the color of the lens. Which is how some come up with the view that removing prejudice from a story is leftist.

For example, you said we currently have ''virtually wide open borders. GOP senators say over 80% of the people are getting in. The people doing the work at the border put the actual figure around 50%. Here's a story you won't see reported by Fox News:


How do you cover a news story when people can't agree on basic facts or even terminology?

For example, listeners to AM talk radio object to hearing TOH newscasts from CBS or ABC. If it's not Fox or Salem, they will complain to the station.

Yes, you read that right. No matter what we were covering and what we did with our coverage on the issue, that listener objected to it.

Which leads some to say: The news media is the enemy of the people.
 
For example, you said we currently have ''virtually wide open borders. GOP senators say over 80% of the people are getting in. The people doing the work at the border put the actual figure around 50%. Here's a story you won't see reported by Fox News:

The story affirms that more "returns" than ever are made. But that is actually, in percentages, a much lower number than in prior to Mayorkas' tenure because so many less people in total crossed the border.

This is sort of like the station that says "we doubled our audience last month" because they went from a 0.1 to a 0.2 share. I recall the local Pacifica station bragging about that... without any understanding that in a survey a 0.1 is a 0.2 is a 0.4 is a 0.3.
 
The story affirms that more "returns" than ever are made. But that is actually, in percentages, a much lower number than in prior to Mayorkas' tenure because so many less people in total crossed the border.

But as the article says, there were fewer crossings in 2020 because of covid. That situation has now changed.

Then again, there is a large group of people who believe covid didn't happen. Everything was wonderful.

That same group doesn't accept that ANY returns have been made. The number doesn't matter to them.
 
But as the article says, there were fewer crossings in 2020 because of covid. That situation has now changed.

Then again, there is a large group of people who believe covid didn't happen. Everything was wonderful.

That same group doesn't accept that ANY returns have been made. The number doesn't matter to them.
Again, this is the difference between real numbers and percentages. And worse, journalists who can't distinguish between "average" "mean" and "median".
 
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