EMF: K-Love and Chrisitian Radio Fundraising (Moved from Buffalo Board)

[EddieTheRapFan]

NPR's donations aren't based on fantasy.

Do not listen. It's as easy as that.

I mainly listen to K-Love on my way to church. I'm Catholic but since it's mostly music you could say it's as non-denominational (am I saying it right?) as possible. Used to prefer Air1 but since it's now praise and worship and I don't seem to get Radio U, well...

 

[tall_guy1]

While this does not necessarily conform with my view on the legality, morality or timing considerations about abortion, I will state how I see the argument... and how devoid of logic your assertion is.

Society agrees that taking other people's stuff is a crime, and punishes it. Society agrees that killing other people is improper and castigates anyone who does it. Society has rules about how people who live together as a community and nation have to behave to coexist and, hopefully, prosper.

People have differing feelings about when life begins and that affects their views on abortion. Because society in general believes that taking another person's life is generally wrong, we have an argument about when life begins. And thus, abortion boils down to "when is a fetus a person". There is disagreement here, and much of it is based on the moral decision about what "a life" is.

So, for those who believe in life beginning shortly after conception, abortion is murder. We don't condone murder among adults except in self defense or war. So how do we, as a society, establish rules for the murder... or not... of a fetus. We, as individuals, don't get to decide what is and what is not murder. Our leaders, lawmakers and our beliefs establish uniform rules.

This is a societal decision based on the taking of a life. The question is "when does life begin". This is not a "private" decision as humanity, by definition, is not private as humanity is societal.

The problem is a lot of people (religious right) take the pro life position ONLY in connection with their church/pastor. A lot were in favor of the invasion of Iraq in 03, favor the death penalty and supported Ted Cruz who was in favor of carpet bombing nations. Ted Cruz smiled interviewed by Steven Crowder and said he on his bucket list would like to shoot feral hogs from a helicopter with an AR 15 (which get left to rot after shot and not eaten.) I know that is a problem for farmers, but there have been other more humane soutions proposed. The head of the NRA goes trophy hunting as do Don Jr and Eric Trump. The side as a whole is not very "pro life."

 

[tbolt909]

While this does not necessarily conform with my view on the legality, morality or timing considerations about abortion, I will state how I see the argument... and how devoid of logic your assertion is.

Society agrees that taking other people's stuff is a crime, and punishes it. Society agrees that killing other people is improper and castigates anyone who does it. Society has rules about how people who live together as a community and nation have to behave to coexist and, hopefully, prosper.

People have differing feelings about when life begins and that affects their views on abortion. Because society in general believes that taking another person's life is generally wrong, we have an argument about when life begins. And thus, abortion boils down to "when is a fetus a person". There is disagreement here, and much of it is based on the moral decision about what "a life" is.

So, for those who believe in life beginning shortly after conception, abortion is murder. We don't condone murder among adults except in self defense or war. So how do we, as a society, establish rules for the murder... or not... of a fetus. We, as individuals, don't get to decide what is and what is not murder. Our leaders, lawmakers and our beliefs establish uniform rules.

This is a societal decision based on the taking of a life. The question is "when does life begin". This is not a "private" decision as humanity, by definition, is not private as humanity is societal.

Murder is a crime, but that doesn't stop the mass killings. Try to make your argument to the gun lunatics. They say gun ownership is a "private" matter with no ill effects on society. Other countries don't have the daily carnage caused by automatic weapons. They've done something to make society better by removing them. There's no point continuing this thread...

 

[davideduardo]

Murder is a crime, but that doesn't stop the mass killings. Try to make your argument to the gun lunatics. They say gun ownership is a "private" matter with no ill effects on society. Other countries don't have the daily carnage caused by automatic weapons. They've done something to make society better by removing them. There's no point continuing this thread...

Of course, when confronted by the argument of "when does life start" a lot of people have to evaluate their stance on abortion. Lots of subjects that are not binary in response options do that to all of us

Some of my family live in Ecuador, including a daughter and two grandchildren. In the port city of Guayaquil, the drug smuggling using "banana boats" has gotten so bad that there have been over 1,000 gun assaults and crimes in just 5 months. Civilian ownership of weapons as highly restricted, similar to Mexico in regulation.

But the criminals have guns, and have diversified into things like "quicknapping" where well-to-do people are abducted and held for small, easily attainable amounts like $5,000 to $10,000 dollars. If the money is not forthcoming, fingers are cut off and sent as proof. If payment does not come in the same day, the victim is found dead.

Vehicles are being taken from drivers on less transited roads, particularly routes to rural haciendas where the owner can be grabbed for money.

And so on. And that's a country with strict gun laws.

So, you see, everything is not as simple and, to say it again, binary as you make it out to be.

 

[bigdonho]

When I first got into the biz I worked at a station that had a religious block in the morning and all day Sunday. All of the preachers had a pitch for money. I think what bothered me the most was that some of the people who sent in money were forgoing spending on their medication or other needs to send some yahoo five bucks. I realize it was their choice to send in the donations, but somehow still feel like they were being scammed and were the ones who could least afford it.

 

[tbolt909]

David is right. There is no crime in the United States at all.
Uvalde was just another false flag like Sandy Hook. There's something inherently evil and sick about a country that wants to control womens bodies, but casually accepts the wholesale slaughter of children by automatic weapons...

 

[gr8oldies]

The problem is a lot of people (religious right) take the pro life position ONLY in connection with their church/pastor. A lot were in favor of the invasion of Iraq in 03, favor the death penalty and supported Ted Cruz who was in favor of carpet bombing nations. Ted Cruz smiled interviewed by Steven Crowder and said he on his bucket list would like to shoot feral hogs from a helicopter with an AR 15 (which get left to rot after shot and not eaten.) I know that is a problem for farmers, but there have been other more humane soutions proposed. The head of the NRA goes trophy hunting as do Don Jr and Eric Trump. The side as a whole is not very "pro life."

It's about fundraising and controlling women. Once the "precious unborn" become "born" they don't care.

 

[gr8oldies]

The problem is a lot of people (religious right) take the pro life position ONLY in connection with their church/pastor. A lot were in favor of the invasion of Iraq in 03, favor the death penalty and supported Ted Cruz who was in favor of carpet bombing nations. Ted Cruz smiled interviewed by Steven Crowder and said he on his bucket list would like to shoot feral hogs from a helicopter with an AR 15 (which get left to rot after shot and not eaten.) I know that is a problem for farmers, but there have been other more humane soutions proposed. The head of the NRA goes trophy hunting as do Don Jr and Eric Trump. The side as a whole is not very "pro life."

Not to mention, "Jesus gives us a right to spread Covid"

 

[gr8oldies]

Of course, when confronted by the argument of "when does life start" a lot of people have to evaluate their stance on abortion. Lots of subjects that are not binary in response options do that to all of us

Some of my family live in Ecuador, including a daughter and two grandchildren. In the port city of Guayaquil, the drug smuggling using "banana boats" has gotten so bad that there have been over 1,000 gun assaults and crimes in just 5 months. Civilian ownership of weapons as highly restricted, similar to Mexico in regulation.

But the criminals have guns, and have diversified into things like "quicknapping" where well-to-do people are abducted and held for small, easily attainable amounts like $5,000 to $10,000 dollars. If the money is not forthcoming, fingers are cut off and sent as proof. If payment does not come in the same day, the victim is found dead.

Vehicles are being taken from drivers on less transited roads, particularly routes to rural haciendas where the owner can be grabbed for money.

And so on. And that's a country with strict gun laws.

So, you see, everything is not as simple and, to say it again, binary as you make it out to be.

What the gun nuts do here is proclaim the second half of the Second Amendment calls for unlimited guns for every man, woman and child in all places at all times with no restrictions whatsoever, or we're not "free". I don't feel that free, I feel more like a hostage. We just had a family be murdered by the husband and father (in Chattanooga). Even with a protective order, he had 60 guns. A Red Flag law would have taken them away, at least temporarily. There's a proposal for a special session to address gun violence, which includes a red flag law, but will probably be defeated because :"ABSOLUTELY NO GUN REGULATION WHATSOEVER". They'd rather 9-year-old be carrying loaded guns into class because "more guns more guns more guns" is the solution to anything. Permitless carry floods the state with guns and people who don't know how to use or store them.

 

[gr8oldies]

Actually, if you think about creation, the complexity of the Universe and everything right down to atomic particles, for many of us it is a very tough and impossible argument.

The complexity of the universe makes me not believe in the always-angry Evangelical God

 

[briancraig]

I never understand what triggers people across the spectrum.

If you don’t like K Love, don’t listen and don’t give them money. If you don’t like someones’s religion, don’t attend their church.

Likewise, if you don’t like drag queens then don’t attend drag shows. If you don’t like a certain book in the library, don’t read it.

 

[gr8oldies]

The problem is a lot of people (religious right) take the pro life position ONLY in connection with their church/pastor. A lot were in favor of the invasion of Iraq in 03, favor the death penalty and supported Ted Cruz who was in favor of carpet bombing nations. Ted Cruz smiled interviewed by Steven Crowder and said he on his bucket list would like to shoot feral hogs from a helicopter with an AR 15 (which get left to rot after shot and not eaten.) I know that is a problem for farmers, but there have been other more humane soutions proposed. The head of the NRA goes trophy hunting as do Don Jr and Eric Trump. The side as a whole is not very "pro life."

Evangelicals didn't care about about abortion until Christian broadcaster Jerry Falwell could no longer overtly sell segregation. He and the fledgling religious right chose abortion, 5 years after Roe vs. Wade, chose that as the issue to get the donations and votes coming in. In a few years being anti-abortion was almost as important as belief in the Resurrection, to the congregations. The politicians and preachers knew how reliable abortion was to raise funds, while they got other agendas passed. That was why Evangelicals took the Devil's Bargain with Trump. I don't know how many times I was told "Trump's going to save the babies!" They got what they wanted, though it came with a full insurrectionist movement.
Dobbs came, the dog caught the car and draconian abortion laws came. We see most people didn't want the based on polling and elections held since then.
Then there's the issue, does the state own a woman's body during pregnancy? If we're using the full police power of the state to force a woman (even a 10-year-old rape victim) to carry to term, is she just a broodmare with fewer rights than a corpse?
Not every religion believes life begins at conception, so in the red states, the population is forced to live by a narrow, but well-funded, interpretation of Christianity.

Body politics: the secret history of the US anti-abortion movement | Sarah Churchwell

The overturning of Roe v Wade is part of a wider movement entangled with nativism and white supremacy

www.theguardian.com

 

[TheBigA]

Of course, when confronted by the argument of "when does life start" a lot of people have to evaluate their stance on abortion.

That's a personal discussion. The question is should the government be used to impose a system of beliefs on the people, and the first amendment says no. The reason is that different religions have different views on the subject.

Bringing this discussion back to radio, the makers of CCM and the owners of EMF have been very careful to avoid politics. The musicians and broadcasters recognize that it's not their place to take a side in this issue. I know the host of a popular religious radio show, and he never engages artists in controversial issues such as abortion. He also stayed away from vaccinations.

 

[tbolt909]

If you don’t like K Love, don’t listen and don’t give them money. If you don’t like someones’s religion, don’t attend their church.

Likewise, if you don’t like drag queens then don’t attend drag shows. If you don’t like a certain book in the library, don’t read it.

Unfortunately, it's not that simple. Some people don't like certain books, so they don't want anyone to read them. Hitler burned books. Others don't want gay people to have equal rights (the right to marriage). When religious groups have wealth and political power, you see the results...

 

[Kelly A]

Unfortunately, it's not that simple. Some people don't like certain books, so they don't want anyone to read them.

Including themselves. Many of the books irate parents are concerned about, they couldn't tell you specifics of what their concerns are because they never even read the books they're objecting-to. Usually they just reply with generic concerns about sex, sexuality, or sexual orientation. In other words, the "S" word isn't allowed.

Hitler burned books. Others don't want gay people to have equal rights (the right to marriage). When religious groups have wealth and political power, you see the results...

Honestly, I take issue with either side of the fence using Hitler as some sort of mean-spirited weapon. Over the ages there have been countless dictators, local government leaders, and community members advocating for eliminating literature that they don't agree with. It doesn't put them in the same category as a brutal tyrant as Adolf Hitler. I get it, it's Godwins Law:
Godwin’s law is the proposition that the longer an internet argument goes on, the higher the probability becomes that something or someone will be compared to Adolf Hitler.
To me, there are better, more intellectually sound ways of objecting to an argument, than falling into the trap of accusing people of being Hitler.

 

[tbolt909]

Including themselves. Many of the books irate parents are concerned about, they couldn't tell you specifics of what their concerns are because they never even read the books they're objecting-to. Usually they just reply with generic concerns about sex, sexuality, or sexual orientation. In other words, the "S" word isn't allowed.

Honestly, I take issue with either side of the fence using Hitler as some sort of mean-spirited weapon. Over the ages there have been countless dictators, local government leaders, and community members advocating for eliminating literature that they don't agree with. It doesn't put them in the same category as a brutal tyrant as Adolf Hitler. I get it, it's Godwins Law:
Godwin’s law is the proposition that the longer an internet argument goes on, the higher the probability becomes that something or someone will be compared to Adolf Hitler.
To me, there are better, more intellectually sound ways of objecting to an argument, than falling into the trap of accusing people of being Hitler.

And far too many people say the Holocaust was a hoax. Hitler also built the Autobahn, so he did some good stuff, right? The line gets blurred pretty easily when a former President says "good people on both sides" referring to people carrying Nazi flags and spewing nonsensical vitriol...

 

[Kelly A]

And far too many people say the Holocaust was a hoax. Hitler also built the Autobahn, so he did some good stuff, right? The line gets blurred pretty easily when a former President says "good people on both sides" referring to people carrying Nazi flags and spewing nonsensical vitriol...

Hitler did far worse to humanity than ever good. So much worse that I just don't think people should compare other's with him.

 

[Mikey Radio]

Do these recent posts count as an invocation of Godwin's Law?

 

[Theater of My Mind]

And that's the biggest ruse of all...

Please explain or I will start deleting your posts.

Not a good look. he already explained his point of view in this thread quite clearly. If we're going to have a debate about religion then all opinions should be allowed without the threat of censorship. That's a role that should be reserved for the church since they're the pros at it.

 

[davideduardo]

David is right. There is no crime in the United States at all.
Uvalde was just another false flag like Sandy Hook. There's something inherently evil and sick about a country that wants to control womens bodies, but casually accepts the wholesale slaughter of children by automatic weapons...

I did not say that and you know it.

What I did say is that the belief that gun violence is restricted to the United States and somehow related to political party affiliation is a concept founded in a total lack of knowledge of what goes on in other countries and cultures. And I gave an example... and could give many more based on just my experiences and those of my friends in the countries where I have worked during my career.

I suppose I could write a paragraph or two about how the shallow network and local news coverage has become in the US, and point a finger at how uninformed the average person is since the FCC dropped news and public affairs quotas, but then, today, we'd find all the eyes and ears moving even faster too vacuous streaming sources...