ESPN Radio affiliation should be moved to WPEN 950 AM ASAP

[Jul]

In my opinion Greater Media needs to buyout 920 AM WPHY and shut that station down and hire the entire staff and most importantly get rights to air the ESPN radio and the ESPN radio play by play and other local/national play by play that WPHY has the rights to and air it on WPEN 950 AM, if WPEN has any chance to last a long time as a sports station or otherwise throw in the towel on sports on 950 AM. ESPN Radio's Philadelphia affiliate should not be on a Trenton stick.

 

[oaktree]

[EDIT]

Problem is, WPEN has no PPM numbers. No cume No AQH. No TSL. Nada.

What network in their right minds would want to affiliate at WPEN now?

I hear Adult Standards in the air...


[EDIT-inflammatory]

 

[Bill_W]

[EDIT]

Problem is, WPEN has no PPM numbers. No cume No AQH. No TSL. Nada.

What network in their right minds would want to affiliate at WPEN now?

I hear Adult Standards in the air...


[EDIT-inflammatory]

And WPHY probably has less Philly numbers.

Julius, do you have dial up or high speed internet? ESPN radio streams at http://sports.espn.go.com/espnradio/player

 

[oaktree]

However, the stream does not provide play-by-play sports, ie: horse racing.

 

[John1]

Right - only 10 months until the next Kentucky Derby! I'm surprised this topic has never come up before! (lol)

Seriously, are there numbers from any other market that show that an ESPN affiliate doing well, especially against an all-local station like WIP? I haven't seen any. Compare WFAN to WEPN, which apparently exists only so they can claim a NYC affiliate. The age old question remains - what can WPEN do to attract a listening audience in the post-adult standards era?

 

[Jul]

Right - only 10 months until the next Kentucky Derby! I'm surprised this topic has never come up before! (lol)

Seriously, are there numbers from any other market that show that an ESPN affiliate doing well, especially against an all-local station like WIP? I haven't seen any. Compare WFAN to WEPN, which apparently exists only so they can claim a NYC affiliate. The age old question remains - what can WPEN do to attract a listening audience in the post-adult standards era?

They need to carry the ESPN Radio play by play like MLB baseball right now while the season is still going on, it would be a great time for them to do that and maybe get the rights to air NASCAR play by play from XTU but what is holding 950 AM back from doing this of getting rights to air play by play sports during the summer months. I hate to say this but ever since Gregg Henson left, I stopped listening to 950 AM.

 

[Captain Obvious]

They need to carry the ESPN Radio play by play like MLB baseball right now while the season is still going on, it would be a great time for them to do that and maybe get the rights to air NASCAR play by play from XTU but what is holding 950 AM back from doing this of getting rights to air play by play sports during the summer months. I hate to say this but ever since Gregg Henson left, I stopped listening to 950 AM.

Maybe because I am a fan, but NASCAR sounds much better on an FM station.

 

[MarcB]

Maybe because I am a fan, but NASCAR sounds much better on an FM station.

I also could've sworn I read somewhere a couple years ago that MRN was requiring all of its AM affilaites that had an FM sister station to carry the races on FM as well. (Tho in Danbury, CT they're not doing this. As the race is only on ESPN Danbury (940/1510) and no longer on its 50KW FM Sister Station I-95. ESPN Danbury is 760 watts daytime only on 940. And I believe 1000 Watts daytime only on 1510).

 

[pbf1]

??

I also could've sworn I read somewhere a couple years ago that MRN was requiring all of its AM affilaites that had an FM sister station to carry the races on FM as well.

Not true.

 

[BRNout]

Seriously, are there numbers from any other market that show that an ESPN affiliate doing well, especially against an all-local station like WIP? I haven't seen any. Compare WFAN to WEPN, which apparently exists only so they can claim a NYC affiliate. The age old question remains - what can WPEN do to attract a listening audience in the post-adult standards era?

Great point! The mouse grabbed the 50 kw 1050 frequency in NY and basically ruined it with ESPN Radio - merely for presige and not to attract listeners. WFAN absolutely KILLS WEPN in the ratings. In fact, just about every New York station does. They barely show up at all in the ratings - which is a complete waste of a 50 kw signal. As you've said, I do not know of any ESPN radio affiliates that garner enough listeners to make the slightest splash in their respective markets. The programming is not getting any traction and most of the affiliates are merely throwing unnecessary RF interference into the ether while wasting copious amounts of electricity.

Unless it's a pretty big event (such as an NFL game or an MLB game), sports on the radio just isn't very compelling. Personally, I do not understand the draw of sports talk on the radio - but it can draw listeners......if well done and local. That's the case in Boston (WEEI) and New York (WFAN). I suppose the local example is WIP. Beyond the leading local sports talker, there just isn't any oxygen left in the room. And, second tier sports talkers tend to feature canned bird feed (like ESPN Radio or the late SNR) which just does not attract an audience. Truly boring radio.

As for programming on WPEN, I don't understand why they don't just go back to standards or "real" oldies. An old demo is surely better than no demo at all. At least you can sell some snake oil.

 

[atlsportsnut]

ESPN Radio is affiliated in Atlanta with 680 The Fan. 790 The Zone is the all-local affiliate with Fox at night.
680 is the top station in the marketplace. They have a local morning show that is beating the 790 morning show and then they run Colin Cowherd and two hours of Dan Patrick against all local offerings down the dial. Strangely, in afternoon drive they both have local shows and those are the two highest rated shows with Men 25-54 in the market. Buck and Kincade are the #1 show in the market and they are followed by the Two Live Stews on 790 as the second rated show in town. The Stews are also syndicated with a deal that puts their show in a lot of markets on low level AM affiliates. The Stews have a TV deal with ESPN and do First Take. The one co-host on 680 in afternoon drive is John Kincade, who has a radio deal with ESPN nationally that includes his own show on the weekends and fill-in duty for Cowherd, Patrick and Greenberg. Our market is one where the ESPN affiliate beats out the all local 6am-7pm option.

 

[BRNout]

ESPN Radio is affiliated in Atlanta with 680 The Fan. 790 The Zone is the all-local affiliate with Fox at night.
680 is the top station in the marketplace. They have a local morning show that is beating the 790 morning show and then they run Colin Cowherd and two hours of Dan Patrick against all local offerings down the dial. Strangely, in afternoon drive they both have local shows and those are the two highest rated shows with Men 25-54 in the market. Buck and Kincade are the #1 show in the market and they are followed by the Two Live Stews on 790 as the second rated show in town. The Stews are also syndicated with a deal that puts their show in a lot of markets on low level AM affiliates. The Stews have a TV deal with ESPN and do First Take. The one co-host on 680 in afternoon drive is John Kincade, who has a radio deal with ESPN nationally that includes his own show on the weekends and fill-in duty for Cowherd, Patrick and Greenberg. Our market is one where the ESPN affiliate beats out the all local 6am-7pm option.

Ummmm, not sure how you define 'top station in the marketplace,' but WCNN (680) has a 12+ rating of 1.3 for an overall showing of 23rd place in the Atlanta market. Hardly impressive for a 50 kw/10 kw signal. And, 790 WQXI recently garnered an 0.9 rating to take 25th place with their 28,000 watt day signal (1 kw at night). Let's see, the lowest rated station in the market is number 28 - so neither station would break an arm if they fell to the bottom. To contrast this, the top AM signal in the market is WSB with a rating of 8.2 for a second place showing.

Granted these are 12+ numbers, but they are so low that neither station could be doing very well with men 25-54. Unless Atlanta is about 92% female - which would be really cool! If the Atlanta ESPN affiliate is a success story, I'd hate to see a failure. But, you've made my point for me. Thanks.

Oh, and the ESPN affiliate in Atlanta even has a local programming component - which probably snuck them past #24-rated religious rimshot WVFJ-FM. An ESPN affiliate in Philly may not even have that luxury.

 

[eatspaste]

In my opinion Greater Media needs to buyout 920 AM WPHY and shut that station down and hire the entire staff and most importantly get rights to air the ESPN radio and the ESPN radio play by play and other local/national play by play that WPHY has the rights to and air it on WPEN 950 AM, if WPEN has any chance to last a long time as a sports station or otherwise throw in the towel on sports on 950 AM. ESPN Radio's Philadelphia affiliate should not be on a Trenton stick.

(a) Play-by-play of out-of-the-area teams (especially after 7PM) on radio doesn't do squat for a station's ratings. How many people in Seattle want to hear the Phillies? How many people in Philadelphia want to hear a Seattle team?

(b) I think you'd have a better chance of seeing ESPN move to 640 (and still get no ratings) than see ESPN move to 950 (and still get no ratings).

(c) Speaking of ESPN and ratings, it's on a 100KW FM signal in Dallas and it pulls a mid-1 12+.

(d) Successful sports radio stations have big signals, local talent, and local play-by-play of teams that people actually care about.

 

[Jul]

Why would XTU get rid of Nascar? They make a ton of money on it. For more information on this post please go back in time 6 months ago

I'm not happy with the coverage because they don't carry postponed NASCAR races that takes place on a Monday and they don't even air the Brickyard 400.

 

[Dancerev889]

You need to understand the corporate side of radio. Just because you dont like something, doesnt mean they are going to change it.

The majority of listeners in Philly dont care about sports besides Philly sports. Its a fact. You want a station that is not doing well in the ratings to take on another stations programming that isnt doing well either.

 

[Rockin Rob]

Call me in the minority, but I love WPEN for the mere fact they are the FSR affiliate for Philly. I think "the four letter network" is an also-ran, it lacks its lustre. It is sooooooooo 90's. In fact, I wish they'd pick up more. The Third Shift with Jorge Sedano (weekends with Big Ben Maller) comes to mind. No PBP, just straight up sports talk, with an attitude. JT the Brick is perfect for this town, he speaks his mind and Philly fans can hate him for being a stinkin Giants fan!!!!!!

I'd say WPEN, lose Jim Rome, pick up the last hour of Bruno, dump the overnight jabroni for FSR.

 

[atlsportsnut]

Did you actually quote 12+ numbers when discussing sports radio?
12+ numbers don't mean anything to the sales forces for sports radio stations.
They sell off of one number nationally and locally, MEN 25-54.
Both of the stations in afternoon drive in Atlanta routinely crack the top 5 shows with MEN 25-54.
That is all that the sports radio advertisers care about.
12+ numbers? Do you actually work in radio?

 

[HarveyBrowning]

ESPN Radio in Atlantic City actually does pretty well 12+ and with men. In fact Mike and Mike was the #2 rated morning show in the market men 25-54. Not to mention the rest of their day parts all scored at least a 2.0 share, which for AM radio on that size signal is pretty impressive. They also have a local PM Drive show which does a decent job ratings wise.

And Yes, you can pick up WIP and WFAN down in AC, so they do have something to compete with in terms of listnership, not ratings.

 

[BRNout]

Did you actually quote 12+ numbers when discussing sports radio?
12+ numbers don't mean anything to the sales forces for sports radio stations.
They sell off of one number nationally and locally, MEN 25-54.
Both of the stations in afternoon drive in Atlanta routinely crack the top 5 shows with MEN 25-54.
That is all that the sports radio advertisers care about.
12+ numbers? Do you actually work in radio?

Do you? Or do you just like to argue for a living?

Somehow I knew you'd try to dispute the 12+ thing. Well, its all I could come up with on short notice. I'll openly admit - your argument works great when the 12+ numbers are mediocre. Because, you could theoretically have a high percentage of your 12+ audience being right in the P1 bullseye.

Unfortunately, in this case, the 12+ numbers are so very low for both of the stations you cited that you cannot hide behind them. There is no way that either station is tops with Men (or anyone else) 25-44 with miserable 12+ ratings like these. Too few listeners overall for that to work. Even if 100% of the listeners are men 25-54, WCNN is still only pulling mid 2's in the demo - at best. And, the other station would be lower still (1's).

Not to mention that AM skews old in every major market (almost all listeners are 40+). So, I'm being generous with that 'mid 2's' remark. Odds are good that a decent slice of your 12+ audience is older than 54 and out of consideration. That's even an issue for top rated AM stations like WSB, so it's a killer for cellar dwellers like these Atlanta sports talkers.

Show me the data and prove me wrong. A 1.3 (12+) rating on an AM station doesn't allow for an 8.0 (or a 6.0) in the 25-54 male demo. It simply doesn't add up.

 

[BRNout]

ESPN Radio in Atlantic City actually does pretty well 12+ and with men. In fact Mike and Mike was the #2 rated morning show in the market men 25-54. Not to mention the rest of their day parts all scored at least a 2.0 share, which for AM radio on that size signal is pretty impressive. They also have a local PM Drive show which does a decent job ratings wise.

And Yes, you can pick up WIP and WFAN down in AC, so they do have something to compete with in terms of listnership, not ratings.

AC is an odd case because it is a smaller market and a gambling town. What that means is that there is a lot of interest in sports (thanks to betting, legal and otherwise) which transcends the usual local team talk. Sports radio is a really good seller in Vegas too - for the same reason. New Jersey is also uniquely sited between 2 big sports markets (NY and Philly), which cannot hurt. Yes, I know AC is closer to Philly - but it has its share of New York cultural influences too.

Additionally, being a smaller market, the pie is split between fewer stations in Atlantic City. That also leads to better numbers among the local stations. Most Philly stations can be picked up in the market, but the local stations come in better and seem more relevant. Hence, the better support.

In a bigger market, birdfeed is no substitute for live and local. Local sports talk will clobber ESPN Radio's generic approach almost every time. It sounds like this is working in Atlantic City too.