Family Stations Will Sell 94.7FM WFME Newark

[fybush]

Scott, I predict that 94.7 WILL move to Empire as a full non-directional class B FM station.

94.3 in Smithtown already receives tons of destructive co-channel interference from stations in New Haven, CT and Asbury Park, NJ. All the new owner of 94.7 has to do is show that their second adjacent interference happens where you can't get Smithtown anyway and the FCC will grant a waiver.

I don't see any wiggle room for a waiver like that under 73.215(e):

(e) The Commission will not accept applications that specify a
short-spaced antenna location for which the following minimum distance
separation requirements, in kilometers (miles), are not met:

A to B second-adjacent requires 63 km, and it's 59.2 km from Empire to WIGX. If I'm reading 73.215(e) correctly, the FCC can't even accept an application for WFME at Empire in order to grant a waiver.

94.7 in Enfield will not be a factor due to the fact that they are a grandfathered station with facilities far below maximum class B due to 94.5 in Boston.

There's some wiggle room under 73.213, certainly. But what would once have been a slam-dunk - reducing WMAS-FM to a B1 or an A6 if it's Cumulus buying WFME - is now hugely complicated by WMAS-FM's COL change. As it stands, WMAS-FM had to use Longley-Rice to demonstrate 70 dBu over Enfield from its downtown Springfield tower site, so there's not really any room at all that I see to reduce WMAS-FM's signal toward WFME without a move that would lose Springfield coverage entirely.

So you somehow have to meet the criteria in 73.213(a)(2), which requires a showing that the "total area and population subject to co-channel or first-adjacent channel interference, caused and received, would be maintained or decreased..." and, "In addition, the showing must include exhibits demonstrating that the area and the population subject to co-channel or first-adjacent channel interference caused by the proposed facility to each short-spaced station individually is not increased."

If you can't downgrade or directionalize WMAS-FM without losing the "sole local service" (sorry, I'll stop laughing now) to Enfield, how do you move WFME 11 km closer to Springfield while at the same time demonstrating no increase in WMAS-FM/WFME interference?

 

[wgliradio]

But, again, in 1964 this pair of stations was fully spaced according to the new mileage table:

94.7 Newark NJ - 94.3 Smithtown NY (then, presumably, on one of the 740 towers)

Actually in 1964 (as WQMF) 94.3 was on one of the (wait for it)... WGLI towers. Couldn't resist.

 

[badjef]

But, again, in 1964 this pair of stations was fully spaced according to the new mileage table:

94.7 Newark NJ - 94.3 Smithtown NY (then, presumably, on one of the 740 towers)

Actually in 1964 (as WQMF) 94.3 was on one of the (wait for it)... WGLI towers. Couldn't resist.

Well, said! On paper, that's difficult!
This move to Manhattan will be made. I see the rules as they are and this is certainly made much more difficult as a result of the way Family has treated the signal over the years.

We can equate it to taking a hike and turning left instead of right at the last fork in the road. The longer you go down the road, the harder it will be to get back on the main road. You may have to make your own path.

In radio, that is why the attorneys get the big bucks.

94.7 is devalued due to the 107.5 situation more than it is the "economy". Since 107.5 is a well established full market signal, it is more desirable than 94.7 at this time. It is the "low hanging fruit".

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[WNTIRadio]

They may very well find a way to squeeze it in somehow. But don't expect a full B in Manhattan. As per the rules, which there are plenty addressing this, and the other stations, a full B can't be put in Manhattan on 94.7. B1 maybe with some creative purchases and shuffling of other stations.

No attorney can create new rules, though. They can bend them and find loopholes, but this situation has a lot stacked against it, and pretty solid rules. If the FCC breaks these rules for 94.7 via a waiver, then all hell can break loose across the country with spacings and move-ins.

 

[Barry]

Since there are now apparently no obstacles now to putting a commercial format on WFME, and Family Radio apparently is in need of funds, I wonder whether a sale could take place rather quickly. Perhaps a new format may be put on there relatively soon using an LMA arrangement?
Once again, with regard to WBLS, the folks in control of the liquidation of owner Inner City Radio have indicated they want to sell all their stations together (with the possible exception of one in San Francisco) to a single buyer. That and the strong possibility of an outcry resulting from dropping the heritage urban format would seem to make it very difficult to simply buy WBLS and flip it to fill a local format hole. I would be surprised if the ultimate owner makes any major changes to WBLS' programming. After all, the current format at WBLS continues to get decent ratings, particularly during mornings.

 

[badjef]

No attorney can create new rules, though. They can bend them and find loopholes, but this situation has a lot stacked against it, and pretty solid rules. If the FCC breaks these rules for 94.7 via a waiver, then all hell can break loose across the country with spacings and move-ins.

Not true.

Where do you think the 6kw for class "A"'s in the first place.

History lesson: Press had 94.3. After 107.1 increased their height in Long Branch to 450ft, they did the same thing in Tinton Falls. They wanted the 3kw back. So, they petitioned the FCC for Class "A" to 6kw. They sold 94.3 before the rule went through but they bought 101.5 instead.

The rest is history.

Where do you think the B1 came from?

Remember, technology changes as well. The radio designs have improved over the years. The fourth adjacent spacing only applies because of intermod. Otherwise, I'm sure we'd have been seeing more 3rd adjacent spacing. Scott has noted that on his NERW numerous times.

I would imagine there will be found a sentence that is reserving a space for 94.7 on Empire. It will be found during negotiations. It will not be a change in the rules, it will be a fulfillment of the rules.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[JerseyDude]

Since there are now apparently no obstacles now to putting a commercial format on WFME, and Family Radio apparently is in need of funds, I wonder whether a sale could take place rather quickly. Perhaps a new format may be put on there relatively soon using an LMA arrangement?
Once again, with regard to WBLS, the folks in control of the liquidation of owner Inner City Radio have indicated they want to sell all their stations together (with the possible exception of one in San Francisco) to a single buyer. That and the strong possibility of an outcry resulting from dropping the heritage urban format would seem to make it very difficult to simply buy WBLS and flip it to fill a local format hole. I would be surprised if the ultimate owner makes any major changes to WBLS' programming. After all, the current format at WBLS continues to get decent ratings, particularly during mornings.

Hey Barry, What are WBLS' 25-54 numbers. Cant seem to find them anywhere.

 

[Barry]

JerseyDude, during the recent "Holiday" ratings, 'BLS was #8 during mornings.
I will try to find 25-54.

 

[davideduardo]

JerseyDude, during the recent "Holiday" ratings, 'BLS was #8 during mornings.
I will try to find 25-54.

25-54 in the 6 months before the Holiday book: WBLS anywhere from 5th to 11th, with it being 9th in June, 5th in October and 11th in December. Considering there are 8 stations within 0.5 shares of a 3.7, the ups and downs in rank are actually not that severe.

 

[WNTIRadio]

Not true.

Where do you think the 6kw for class "A"'s in the first place.

History lesson: Press had 94.3. After 107.1 increased their height in Long Branch to 450ft, they did the same thing in Tinton Falls. They wanted the 3kw back. So, they petitioned the FCC for Class "A" to 6kw. They sold 94.3 before the rule went through but they bought 101.5 instead.

The rest is history.

Where do you think the B1 came from?

Remember, technology changes as well. The radio designs have improved over the years. The fourth adjacent spacing only applies because of intermod. Otherwise, I'm sure we'd have been seeing more 3rd adjacent spacing. Scott has noted that on his NERW numerous times.

I would imagine there will be found a sentence that is reserving a space for 94.7 on Empire. It will be found during negotiations. It will not be a change in the rules, it will be a fulfillment of the rules.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

Okay, fine. The rules can be changed through a petition. I know that, and have witnessed that happen. What you seem to be missing here is that there are other stations affected by a potential move, that are not currently or may not be owned by the company that winds up with 94.7. Do you think they will easily give up coverage or accept interference just because the new owner "wants to move it there"?

And where will this magical sentence be found? A hidden passage in the Bible? Don't you think, again, if such a provision were there and it could have been easily plugged in to the master antenna at Empire, it would have been done? Even Family Radio would have moved it if it were that simple and an allocation was held for 94.7 to be in NYC.

Bottom line. Even though the area covered is similar, this is a NEW JERSEY licensed station with the allocation falling to that particular spot in NEW JERSEY where the TX is located. There isn't some hidden sentence in the constitution that mandates 94.7 go to the Empire State Building. Even if they filed 73.215 to voluntarily short space, there are still minimum distances that must be met (which aren't from ESB) before contour spacing can be applied.

But for some reason, you have this idea that 94.7 can magically move to NYC with zero consequences. And the idea that there is an allocation for 94.7B that was assigned to be on the Empire State Building.

 

[mrbrightside]

Okay, fine. The rules can be changed through a petition. I know that, and have witnessed that happen. What you seem to be missing here is that there are other stations affected by a potential move, that are not currently or may not be owned by the company that winds up with 94.7. Do you think they will easily give up coverage or accept interference just because the new owner "wants to move it there"?

And where will this magical sentence be found? A hidden passage in the Bible? Don't you think, again, if such a provision were there and it could have been easily plugged in to the master antenna at Empire, it would have been done? Even Family Radio would have moved it if it were that simple and an allocation was held for 94.7 to be in NYC.

Bottom line. Even though the area covered is similar, this is a NEW JERSEY licensed station with the allocation falling to that particular spot in NEW JERSEY where the TX is located. There isn't some hidden sentence in the constitution that mandates 94.7 go to the Empire State Building. Even if they filed 73.215 to voluntarily short space, there are still minimum distances that must be met (which aren't from ESB) before contour spacing can be applied.

But for some reason, you have this idea that 94.7 can magically move to NYC with zero consequences. And the idea that there is an allocation for 94.7B that was assigned to be on the Empire State Building.

The sale of WFME will give North Jersey its first non-religious class B station. NYC has enough stations... Would be nice to have 1 station to serve the area.

 

[luperm]

The sale of WFME will give North Jersey its first non-religious class B station. NYC has enough stations... Would be nice to have 1 station to serve the area.

First of all, WHTZ (100.3) is licensed to NJ (however it does transmit from NYC).
Second of all, 94.7 will likely end up being nothing other than a NYC focused signal. The only differerence is that it will likely stick with a NJ based transmitter. A NJ focused station that ignores millions of listeners across the Hudson River is silly from an economic standpoint.

 

[ansky212]

I don't see how the current NYC stations "serve" NYC any more or less than NJ.

 

[badjef]

And where will this magical sentence be found? A hidden passage in the Bible? Don't you think, again, if such a provision were there and it could have been easily plugged in to the master antenna at Empire, it would have been done? Even Family Radio would have moved it if it were that simple and an allocation was held for 94.7 to be in NYC.

No, as I mentioned before, as far as they were concerned, 94.7 was no more than a translator for Oakland. In West Orange, they had no rent to pay. They felt it wasn't worth the price and commitment for an Empire signal.

We all know what the 20 commercial allocations for the New York Market is/are worth. Family never cared. That may have changed, due to the sales of the stations in other markets so far, and, reading between the lines, that might be their thinking for moving the license to commercial.

The LMA is sounding like a very real scenario.

Wouldn't it be funny if a deal is struck to move the intellectual property of WFME and call letters to 970?

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[badjef]

The sale of WFME will give North Jersey its first non-religious class B station. NYC has enough stations... Would be nice to have 1 station to serve the area.

First of all, WHTZ (100.3) is licensed to NJ (however it does transmit from NYC).
Second of all, 94.7 will likely end up being nothing other than a NYC focused signal. The only differerence is that it will likely stick with a NJ based transmitter. A NJ focused station that ignores millions of listeners across the Hudson River is silly from an economic standpoint.

There is also WPAT, COL: Patterson.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[mrbrightside]

The sale of WFME will give North Jersey its first non-religious class B station. NYC has enough stations... Would be nice to have 1 station to serve the area.

First of all, WHTZ (100.3) is licensed to NJ (however it does transmit from NYC).
Second of all, 94.7 will likely end up being nothing other than a NYC focused signal. The only differerence is that it will likely stick with a NJ based transmitter. A NJ focused station that ignores millions of listeners across the Hudson River is silly from an economic standpoint.

There is also WPAT, COL: Patterson.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

Yes, I'm quite aware that Z100 (WVNJ at the time) and WPAT were once NJ signals, or at least licensed to NJ. Every time the case is made for a rock or country station to come to NYC, it is told by people on this board that it is a SUBURBAN format. Well here is a SUBURBAN stick, it's NJ's, and should serve NJ. The NYC stations serve NYC with the 1,546 rhythmic formats.

 

[badjef]

The sale of WFME will give North Jersey its first non-religious class B station. NYC has enough stations... Would be nice to have 1 station to serve the area.

First of all, WHTZ (100.3) is licensed to NJ (however it does transmit from NYC).
Second of all, 94.7 will likely end up being nothing other than a NYC focused signal. The only differerence is that it will likely stick with a NJ based transmitter. A NJ focused station that ignores millions of listeners across the Hudson River is silly from an economic standpoint.

There is also WPAT, COL: Patterson.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

Yes, I'm quite aware that Z100 (WVNJ at the time) and WPAT were once NJ signals, or at least licensed to NJ.

still are licensed to New Jersey.

Every time the case is made for a rock or country station to come to NYC, it is told by people on this board that it is a SUBURBAN format. Well here is a SUBURBAN stick, it's NJ's, and should serve NJ. The NYC stations serve NYC with the 1,546 rhythmic formats.

+-3db.
Of course, there is the "NOT New York, NOT Philadelphia, NEW JERSEY ONE O ONE POINT FIVE." And the emphasis is the fact that it is a NJ stick (with a great signal in Pennsylvania.)
- But I consider that a "609er". And your criteria was a Northern "B".
I mention that station because they do not want to associate across the Hudson.

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[Ai4i]

The fourth adjacent spacing only applies because of intermod.

Intermod from the mouths of station owners who wish to suppress competition.
Vacuum tube receivers drifted and were the proverbial, broad as a barn!
Protectionism, plain and simple.

 

[badjef]

The fourth adjacent spacing only applies because of intermod.

Intermod from the mouths of station owners who wish to suppress competition.
Vacuum tube receivers drifted and were the proverbial, broad as a barn!
Protectionism, plain and simple.

So, do you think the receiver designs are good enough for 2nd or 3rd adjacent spacing?

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

 

[nd2023]

The fourth adjacent spacing only applies because of intermod.

Intermod from the mouths of station owners who wish to suppress competition.
Vacuum tube receivers drifted and were the proverbial, broad as a barn!
Protectionism, plain and simple.

So, do you think the receiver designs are good enough for 2nd or 3rd adjacent spacing?

Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!

Yes, the receiver designs are good enough now to ignore 2nd and 3rd adjacent spacing. If every radio had the same quality as the Insignia portable or the Sony XDRF1HD, it would be possible to ignore 2nd adjacent spacing requirements. If HD fails, the 1st adjacent spacing requirements can be tightened. How come the FCC approved HD radio which increases interference to the first adjacent stations, rather than setting a minimum design standard for receivers