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How far away can you hear WLFM-LP 87.7 now that analog TV Ch. 6 is off?

S

stormy01

How far away can you hear WLFM-LP 87.7 (really 87.75) now that analog TV Ch. 6 has been turned off?

We know of the one DXer that has a 50 foot tower and, I think a 13 element FM antenna (I don't recall if he uses a preamp or what kind receiver he uses) down in Charleston, IL. What kind of sound quality are you getting, can you lock in Stereo? Have you seen the RBDS/RDS moniker "WLFM"? Have you heard the ID's "WLFM-LP, Chicago"

Perhaps if enough people ask WLFM via email [email protected] to go omnidirectional, they may do it, especially when the commercial revenue picks up and the Arbitron ratings come out next time. I recall someone in SW Michigan trying to get WLFM-LP and can't because of their current directional antenna - there are no longer any Analog TV stations on Channel 6 to protect in Milwaukee or Lansing, MI.
 
stormy01 said:
How far away can you hear WLFM-LP 87.7 (really 87.75) now that analog TV Ch. 6 has been turned off?

We know of the one DXer that has a 50 foot tower and, I think a 13 element FM antenna (I don't recall if he uses a preamp or what kind receiver he uses) down in Charleston, IL. What kind of sound quality are you getting, can you lock in Stereo? Have you seen the RBDS/RDS moniker "WLFM"? Have you heard the ID's "WLFM-LP, Chicago"

Perhaps if enough people ask WLFM via email [email protected] to go omnidirectional, they may do it, especially when the commercial revenue picks up and the Arbitron ratings come out next time. I recall someone in SW Michigan trying to get WLFM-LP and can't because of their current directional antenna - there are no longer any Analog TV stations on Channel 6 to protect in Milwaukee or Lansing, MI.
Click to expand...
The Charleston,IL DXer saw the WLFM-LP video the other morning...yet, he has NEVER seen WBBM DT. Are they actually IDing now? If so, at the top of the hour?
 
DeadElvis said:
A DXer in Louisiana heard them twice over the weekend.
DE
Click to expand...

That's great!

The Charleston,IL DXer saw the WLFM-LP video the other morning...yet, he has NEVER seen WBBM DT. Are they actually IDing now? If so, at the top of the hour?
[/quote]

Yes, I have heard WLFM-LP identify as WLFM-LP at the TOH. At other times throughout the hour it has been WLFM or "The L". WBBM-DT on Channel 12 neither? Many knew Ch.3 was horrible. WBBM-DT on 12 is coming in great here 40 miles NW of the TX.
 
WLFM-LP comes in okay at my location in Buffalo Grove, not great, but okay. The shutdown of channel 6 in Milwaukee helped a little, but not that much. Aside from that religious translator on 100.7, it's the weakest FM signal from downtown Chicago, by far. None of my radios have any difficulty getting it in stereo (it's the same system as a standard FM station) - but it has a marginal signal here.

However, the interesting thing (to me) is that the walkman-type radios that I have which feature VHF-TV sound also decode the stereo in that mode - though the stereo indicator never turns on when it's on TV band! It does turn on when I listen to it on FM band. Just a funky thing that's inherent in the designs of these radios, I guess.
 
BRNout said:
WLFM-LP comes in okay at my location in Buffalo Grove, not great, but okay. The shutdown of channel 6 in Milwaukee helped a little, but not that much. Aside from that religious translator on 100.7, it's the weakest FM signal from downtown Chicago, by far. None of my radios have any difficulty getting it in stereo (it's the same system as a standard FM station) - but it has a marginal signal here.
Click to expand...

That's odd that WLFM-LP comes in worse closer in...both Buffalo Grove and Rolling Meadows, and it does not appear than either of you are in the null of the directional antenna: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX1200648.html

I can't even hear the translator on 100.7 since WKKV from Racine is very strong here near Crystal Lake. I have only been able to hear the 100.7 translator up into the Niles area going north or over to Franklin Park going west and then WKKV started overtaking it.
 
stormy01 said:
BRNout said:
WLFM-LP comes in okay at my location in Buffalo Grove, not great, but okay. The shutdown of channel 6 in Milwaukee helped a little, but not that much. Aside from that religious translator on 100.7, it's the weakest FM signal from downtown Chicago, by far. None of my radios have any difficulty getting it in stereo (it's the same system as a standard FM station) - but it has a marginal signal here.
Click to expand...

That's odd that WLFM-LP comes in worse closer in...both Buffalo Grove and Rolling Meadows, and it does not appear than either of you are in the null of the directional antenna: http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/FMTV-service-area?x=TX1200648.html

I can't even hear the translator on 100.7 since WKKV from Racine is very strong here near Crystal Lake. I have only been able to hear the 100.7 translator up into the Niles area going north or over to Franklin Park going west and then WKKV started overtaking it.
Click to expand...

It comes in with a signal that's comparable (from here) with Y103.9. Which is to say that you can listen to it on a good radio, but there are certain rooms in the house where it doesn't come in well. Also, with a walkman, you have to adjust your earbud wires (antenna) to a certain position for a clear signal. Most of the other Chicago signals come in well no matter where the earbud wires are.

WKKV is dominant here too; however, it has some good days and bad days. On the bad days, I can hear that translator from certain portions of the house - if I try. Odd that My 99.1 is the strongest Milwaukee market signal here; it always comes in. WKKV should come in better, but it doesn't.

The 100.7 Chicago translator seems to be a waste of electricity. WHLP has NINE translators, most are in areas that should get the original signal well and are within the commercial FM band; one is actually in California! Another religious broadcaster being a frequency hog - what a shocker. Don't get me started on that subject, WFRN in South Bend has a 50 kw signal that even makes it here sometimes, yet they feel the need to have commercial band translators in South Bend and Elkhart and in 10 other cities within the local grade of its main signal at 104.7. An excess that should never have been permitted by the freakin' FCC.
 
stormy01 said:
DeadElvis said:
A DXer in Louisiana heard them twice over the weekend.
DE
Click to expand...

That's great!

The Charleston,IL DXer saw the WLFM-LP video the other morning...yet, he has NEVER seen WBBM DT. Are they actually IDing now? If so, at the top of the hour?
Click to expand...

Yes, I have heard WLFM-LP identify as WLFM-LP at the TOH. At other times throughout the hour it has been WLFM or "The L". WBBM-DT on Channel 12 neither? Many knew Ch.3 was horrible. WBBM-DT on 12 is coming in great here 40 miles NW of the TX.



[/quote]Apparently he wasn't aware that they moved to 12...thanks for the tip! Word travels slowly in the sticks...
 
BRNout said:
The 100.7 Chicago translator seems to be a waste of electricity. WHLP has NINE translators, most are in areas that should get the original signal well and are within the commercial FM band; one is actually in California! Another religious broadcaster being a frequency hog - what a shocker. Don't get me started on that subject, WFRN in South Bend has a 50 kw signal that even makes it here sometimes, yet they feel the need to have commercial band translators in South Bend and Elkhart and in 10 other cities within the local grade of its main signal at 104.7. An excess that should never have been permitted by the freakin' FCC.
Click to expand...

I have a hard time imagining that someone who has been listening to WHLP on 89.9 is going to switch over to 100.7 to listen to the same programming driving up to Chicago... has anyone heard them? yawn...borrrring...I can see translators in underserved rural areas where the primary signal can't reach but not in urbanized areas where there should have been LPFM's...If anyone needs a translator downtown it would be the former '9FM' group of stations, now Chicago's Progressive Talk, since 92.7 and 99.9 don't really cover the city of Chicago well.

A group of people should get together and petition the FCC to examine where translators are not needed - there must be some kind of legal way to force the unnecessary translators off the air without having to build a full power station. The latest trend of daytime only AM stations or 'daytimers' who are only licensed very low power at night and get a translator is another way the FM band is getting mucked up with translators. I can only imagine that in WFRN's case they are claiming multipath distortion or overload and other lame excuses for translators...do their listeners really need a local grade signal in their towns when they could have just put up an FM antenna on the roof? Oh well, they would lose reliable mobile reception...
 
I've heard WLFM-LP from here in Coldwater, MI. This is with a 6 element antenna at 32 feet. They actually serve as a 'beacon' of sorts for me. If WLFM-LP is in, then I shouldn't have a problem hearing the full-powered Chicago stations. If WLFM-LP is POUNDING in, then I have a chance at some of the weaker Chicago stations such as WONC and WNUR.

Does anybody know how many watts they are running? I don't think they would technically be like a traditional LPFM station (maximum power of 100w from a max HAAT of 100 feet).

About the WFRN translators, they typically have done a good job with spacing the translators in the more rural areas around here. I have a WFRN translator here at 101.1 and it does a great job filling some of the holes in the primary coverage area. Other fringe areas like Marshall and Kalamazoo have them, too. I think those are good spots for their translators. Having so many translators IN Elkhart and South Bend is a little overkill though, although one of those translators (W287BL-105.3) is actually an FM simulcast of AM 1270. Maybe 96.1 or 96.5 in South Bend can switch over to 1270's programming as well.
 
Lawppy said:
Does anybody know how many watts they are running? I don't think they would technically be like a traditional LPFM station (maximum power of 100w from a max HAAT of 100 feet).
Click to expand...

Supposedly WLFM-LP is running 3kW ERP http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/tvq?list=0&facid=128239 - but 3kW ERP is in the azimuths that are not protected. In other words, where the signal is being nulled you're not getting 3kW ERP in those directions. On another thread someone mentioned that LP-TV stations don't have to have an aural power that is 20% maximum as their full power analog counterparts did. So theoretically WLFM-LP is running 3kW for 87.75, though this is somewhat doubtful since many, if not most TV transmitters usually have their aural transmitter built to operate at between 10 and 25% of the maximum visual power. Actually the FCC record shows that WLFM-LP has a minus offset, and the offset for TV is 10kHz, so WLFM-LP is operating at 87.74 MHz. If WLFM-LP is running considerably less than 3kW ERP, I would never guess, they are a really strong signal for me 40+ miles away.

Somewhere I have also read that someone is already petitioning the FCC to allow LP-TV stations to transmit the analog FM carrier at the same time that a digital signal is being broadcast. My understanding is that the digital carrier does not occupy the entire 6MHz channel, so it is possible to have both at the same time, though the FCC rules would need to be changed in order to allow this.
 
You know, I was just checking WLFM because someone on another board was claiming that it was in mono (it's not), and the signal is honestly pretty crappy from where I live. In stereo, it's really staticky. And that was on a radio where I could actually tune it to 87.75 MHz. Looks like I may have even oversold it in my previous posts.

It's not much better here than My 99.1 is from Racine, WI. Weak.
 
I've emailed WLFM about the signal - Pat Kelley who is the one person who speaks for WLFM and has posted on the radio-info.com boards says they are working on the signal - I am sure that the signal holes would clear up if WLFM goes omnidirectional. It still strikes me as odd that the reception is worse at closer in places like Rolling Meadows and Buffalo Grove, yet if lines are drawn from the Hancock Center out to Crystal Lake, Wauconda or Dundee, where I am getting good reception mobile, some of those same lines cross over Buffalo Grove and Rolling Meadows which are closer in and along the same path. It must be anomalies in the transmit antenna and/or the terrain in the path. WLFM definately needs to get on a cellular application like Pandora or iHeart Radio, to supplement their dial position (since not everyone can tune down to 87.7) that seems to be the wave of the future for radio...
 
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