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I know ALT 103.7 (KVIL) hasn't ever had great ratings, but a 1.1?!?!?

The one source to which I have access suggested the station billed close to $6 million in 2020, but I think that number is likely an overestimate and probably indicative of 2019 levels. My educated guess is 2020 billing was in the ballpark of $3.5 million to $4 million.

David Eduardo on another regional forum here on R-D indicated billing is off "well over 50 percent" versus the Breeze.

I don't disagree that Soft AC can be a tough sell in terms of agency business. Alternative can also be a tough sell.
 
I don't disagree that Soft AC can be a tough sell in terms of agency business. Alternative can also be a tough sell.

Which is why KITS has now flipped to variety hits. And perhaps that will be an option at some point for Detroit.

As I said, the group of songs a station can play that will attract a consensus audience is shrinking.
 
I would love Adult Hits from Audacy in my home market. It would likely need to be more rhythmic leaning than usual, though, and probably more 90s - 00s - 10s focused, to avoid stepping on WOMC's toes too much.

In this part of the country, the format usually features a lot of 80s pop and rock, and that material (especially rock) is a cornerstone of WOMC's current sound. WOMC is also playing a decent amount of 90s Modern AC material these days.

I will say Alt 98.7's music has certainly improved in the past 30 days. I am listening more. The self-promotional clutter has been eased, too. The format just has a shaky track record in my market.
 
When was the 103.7 frequency last successful in DFW? I remember the ratings being bad under CBS in the late 2000s and then things got worse with all of the format segues (AC - Hot AC - CHR) before it finally went to Alt where the ratings have continued to be lower.
 
Some version of Rhythmic AC seems like the best available open format, but can anyone see Audacy considering a Reggaeton format to sell alongside 107.5?

They have experience in Houston with Mega 101.
 
As I recall, the AC format was still top 10 in revenue when KVIL went full tilt Hot AC.

I want to say they may have been as high as seventh or eighth during their last full year as Adult Contemporary. I remember reading that stat on this very website a number of years ago.

Anyone know for sure?
 
As I recall, the AC format was still top 10 in revenue when KVIL went full tilt Hot AC.

I want to say they may have been as high as seventh or eighth during their last full year as Adult Contemporary. I remember reading that stat on this very website a number of years ago.

Anyone know for sure?
If that’s true, why did CBS so badly want to blow up KVIL? I know they screwed with some of their AC’s in the early 2010s (KEZK STL, WDOK Cleveland) but quickly snapped them back to the mainstream AC formula that worked. They kept screwing with KVIL, I guess trying to cut in to KDMX? The destruction of Lite FM then KVIL almost seems intentional…I know it wasn’t, but it was a station that didn’t have to die.
 
Some version of Rhythmic AC seems like the best available open format, but can anyone see Audacy considering a Reggaeton format to sell alongside 107.5?

They have experience in Houston with Mega 101.
Didn't CBS try Mega after failing with Movin? And I don't recall Mega ever having phenomenal ratings.
 
If that’s true, why did CBS so badly want to blow up KVIL? I know they screwed with some of their AC’s in the early 2010s (KEZK STL, WDOK Cleveland) but quickly snapped them back to the mainstream AC formula that worked. They kept screwing with KVIL, I guess trying to cut in to KDMX? The destruction of Lite FM then KVIL almost seems intentional…I know it wasn’t, but it was a station that didn’t have to die.

KVIL had seen its ratings decline after Ron Chapman moved down the hall. AC was also having trouble defining itself when KVIL went through the series of changes that eventually led to Amp. If you were AC, you had to decide if you wanted to skew young or old. KVIL decided to go young. KDGE became Star right afterward, which likely made going back to AC a nonstarter for KVIL.

Didn't CBS try Mega after failing with Movin? And I don't recall Mega ever having phenomenal ratings.

Yes. CBS tried Mega after Movin, and it didn’t do much, if any, better.
 
i got a idea, but i don't think Audacy would go for it, why not move KLUV's format and everything to 103.7, and sell 98.7 to EMF along with the KLUV calls and KLUV IP they own so they can have K-Love on KLUV while KVIL can be reborn as oldies radio KVIL.
Since KLUV is currently doing quite well for Audacy, why in the world would they want to do that? And moving KLUV's format and music mix to a station called KVIL wouldn't make a lot of sense, as that music mix really isn't targeted at former KVIL listeners. In particular, while KVIL was number one through most of the eighties, their music mix was quite a bit softer than the 80s stuff that is making KLUV so successful right now.
 
Since KLUV is currently doing quite well for Audacy, why in the world would they want to do that? And moving KLUV's format and music mix to a station called KVIL wouldn't make a lot of sense, as that music mix really isn't targeted at former KVIL listeners. In particular, while KVIL was number one through most of the eighties, their music mix was quite a bit softer than the 80s stuff that is making KLUV so successful right now.
because at the end of the day, this is still a business and corporations don't care about heritages or want to care in a half-a** manner.
 
I can only imagine the marginal cost of running alternative on KVIL is pennies compared to what Entercom/Audacy used to spend prior to the flip. The only reason radio exists, save for public broadcasting, is selling ads. And let's face it, as an advertising-vehicle, radio was circling the drain even before COVID was a thing. Even the strongest ratings now yield mere fractions of the advertising dollars they used to. So as revenues drop, costs must also decrease. The fallacy that several folks on this thread seem to be doing is comparing KVIL's ratings to stations where iHeart spends many multitudes more than Audacy spends on KVIL. The ratings for KVIL might not look like much, but if it can help sell nationwide ads for Popeye's chicken out of a consolidated New York City sales office then the format isn't going anywhere. Especially not when the "alternative" to alternative is an expensive staff-heavy station that would involve tons of customization.

Having said that, I will never understand why they tweaked the format since the launch of alternative. When the format launched, it was a very female-friendly / almost "Alternative AC" format that harkened back to the days of Modern AC. There was more AAA and acoustic rock like Flora Cash "You're Someone Else", even some pop/EDM sprinkled in between songs such as Mr. Probz "Waves". It was a fun, current-leaning format. The unknown-to-me female voiceovers and liners were a great match.

Then, a little over a year ago, Audacy abandoned everything that made the station an earlier success and went the other direction, to a very hard male-leaning / aggressive modern rock lean -- complete with an aggressive 90's era Modern Rock station voiceover/liner package. It didn't work for iHeart's 102.1 The Edge -- why on earth would they want to emulate that direction? They copied everything that bothered me about The Edge -- the annoying modern rock covers of 80's music on heavy rotation (e.g., Alien Ant Farm's "Smooth Criminal", Ataris "Boys of Summer"), an over-reliance on Blink 182, Linkin' Park, and the harder side of the alternative format that is commonly heard on KEGL. Plus -- the younger listeners (especially), who the alternative format depends on, are already aware of a *commercial free* version of the Edge resurrected on 102.1 HD2. I've noticed several Lyft/Uber drivers with that station on. It just doesn't make any sense to me why they would move that direction.

My guess is that it gets back to what I said earlier. They look at the spreadsheet and figure the loss of a few listeners is worth purging the payrolls of a music director who would tailor the playlist to what works in Dallas. I understand the business side of this -- they are running this station on the cheap and must be satisfied enough. But as an alternative fan who enjoyed the first iteration of "Alt 103.7" when it launched, the current version is a mess.
 
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If Audacy wanted to launch "The Bet" in DFW they could just buy a basket case AM and place it there, much as iHeart did with 970/1630 for BIN.

Audacy has "The Bet" on KIKK 650 in Houston, which recently replaced the national CBS Sportsradio feed. Being in Houston I would have preferred CBS Sportsradio to have continued here, as it was a nice fallback alternative when the local shows on other sportstalkers veered into nonsense.
"The Bet" is now on 100.3 HD3. They ditched Urban "V100.3" and moved the Classic Country to 100.3 HD2
 
"The Bet" is now on 100.3 HD3. They ditched Urban "V100.3" and moved the Classic Country to 100.3 HD2
i'm surprise it's on 100.3 HD3 and not 105.3 HD3, but then again, they can't get rid of 1080 AM KRLD as a HD substation on 105.3 HD2 as it's sharing the KRLD calls with it's newsradio AM sister station.
 
These days it’s more about clearing a market for syndicated programming (Thus they can say “This show is on in this market” to agencies) and being cheap to operate. If they had good local programming throughout the day, they could probably improve those numbers but I don’t see that happening.

Doing things cheaply seems to be how they are running things lately. The low ratings do not seem to bother them much because otherwise they wouldn’t keep piping things in. It’s not limited to this particular format. They’ve been doing it with CHR and I’ve been watching some stations start to tank. Aside from the format itself, they’re not giving people a good reason to listen. What are they giving people that is better or more local and unique than be heard on Spotify or even their own app? Nothing.

If they flipped to another format, the music would be different. Depending on the demand for whatever format they flip to, the ratings could be a little better, but I doubt much else would be.

Basing things on KVIL’s 6+ numbers, they probably would have already flipped it to Adult Hits by now if KJKK didn’t exist. Running a format without any airstaff at all anywhere is the ultimate cost saving format aside from plugging in a 24/7 Talk or Sports network feed. The height of cheap. Can also generate some of those 35-54 numbers without having to do all that much.
 
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Doing things cheaply seems to be how they are running things lately.

It depends. The people doing the syndicated shows get paid a lot of money. The talk show hosts get paid a lot of money. Morning shows get paid a lot of money. We used to joke that every time the morning show gets a renewal on their deal, they get paid more money, and the station had to fire one more staffer. That's the trade-off. Radio is getting more expensive, but they can't add any more commercials or raise their rates. So they have to keep the budget flat.
 
Plus -- the younger listeners (especially), who the alternative format depends on, are already aware of a *commercial free* version of the Edge resurrected on 102.1 HD2. I've noticed several Lyft/Uber drivers with that station on. It just doesn't make any sense to me why they would move that direction.
I actually heard a commercial today on KDGE-HD2. I listened for a few hours. So it's 99% commercial free anyway.
 
Well it looks like Audacy is starting to flip underperforming stations around the country, and I would hazard a guess that this station will flip very soon.
 
Some version of Rhythmic AC seems like the best available open format, but can anyone see Audacy considering a Reggaeton format to sell alongside 107.5?

They have experience in Houston with Mega 101.

CBS tried the "Mega" format before it flipped to La Grande and it was mediocre at best. Besides, both Mega's in Houston and Dallas were reggaeton at first but that format died like 10 years ago and switched over to Latin Pop. Don't forget that Casa 106.7 was a thing back in 2005 and even though it had quite an audience, it didn't work well either. Univision's La Kalle/Latino Mix format probably did better. I wouldn't think Audacy would bring back Mega.

Well it looks like Audacy is starting to flip underperforming stations around the country, and I would hazard a guess that this station will flip very soon.

But to what format? We have said Urban AC or perhaps Rhythmic AC would be the better choice (Rhythmic AC being like 80's/90's and maybe a touch of 70s and early 2000s, not that mess that Movin' once was. Star 94 in Atlanta is perhaps a good example). I doubt they would go back to CHR or Hot AC. Active Rock might be a choice considering that KEGL is adding more talk during the day and has the rights to airing the Mavericks games but probably wouldn't be successful. Country/Classic Country is a no go. Neither is AAA, Classic Rock, Rhythmic CHR, or talk radio. A simulcast of KRLD maybe.
 
CBS tried the "Mega" format before it flipped to La Grande and it was mediocre at best. Besides, both Mega's in Houston and Dallas were reggaeton at first but that format died like 10 years ago and switched over to Latin Pop. Don't forget that Casa 106.7 was a thing back in 2005 and even though it had quite an audience, it didn't work well either. Univision's La Kalle/Latino Mix format probably did better. I wouldn't think Audacy would bring back Mega.
Spanish CHR today is basically reggaeton. Having said that, there's a slim chance Audacy would try Mega again.

But to what format? We have said Urban AC or perhaps Rhythmic AC would be the better choice (Rhythmic AC being like 80's/90's and maybe a touch of 70s and early 2000s, not that mess that Movin' once was. Star 94 in Atlanta is perhaps a good example). I doubt they would go back to CHR or Hot AC. Active Rock might be a choice considering that KEGL is adding more talk during the day and has the rights to airing the Mavericks games but probably wouldn't be successful. Country/Classic Country is a no go. Neither is AAA, Classic Rock, Rhythmic CHR, or talk radio. A simulcast of KRLD maybe.
An Urban AC or throwback hip-hop station would be the best choices, as of now. I don't think Active Rock is the best choice considering KEGL's ratings. Country, only a handful of Audacy stations are winning over their competitors (WYCD, for example). KRLD isn't billing enough to justify a simulcast, certainly not like WINS, KYW, or WTOP.
 
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