In a future filled with electric cars, AM radio may be left behind (off-topic)

[Daryl Lynn L.A.]

We see occasional stories about a dog that has raised an abandoned kitten. That is an exception to the rule, and that's why it's a good news story. There are few exceptions to the "angry old white male" definition of talk radio listeners.

And we are not going to change the demos on a majority of AM radio talk stations... younger demos are not going to use such sources no matter what. So stations focus on the existing available audience.... angry, old, white males.

When I was young, conservative talk show hosts that were prominent included Ray Briem at KABC radio or William F. Buckley who hosted "Firing Line" on tv. There was also Louis Rukeyser on "Wall Street Week" on PBS. They were thoughtful, informed, and listened well to divergent opinions.

But, as Ray Briem explains in the clip below, when L.A. talk personalities like Joe Pyne or Wally George arrived on the scene, they created a combative climate where they told listeners to get off the phone, or they hung up on them, or they fomented conspiracies about the federal govenment. Ray talks about the Fairness Doctrine and how public officials who were personally attacked had the right to respond.

What concerns me about AM conservative talk radio is that commentators use the airwaves to create paranoia about conspiracy theories, or to anger listeners by making grievances against minority groups or women, or to frighten them by threatening that people unlike them are trying to take over the culture or destroy their way of life. An example of this would be Sean Hannity who recently testified that he "didn't believe it for a second" when the topic of the 2020 "stolen election" came up. Yet, that did not stop him from angrily bringing it up day after day on his program.

Radio is an intimate, powerful medium; and because it goes right into the listener's ear, it can be used to manipulate people's moods, feelings, and emotions. Stations have an obligation to use the airwaves responsibly. When talk radio is used to instigate listeners to fearfulness and anger, then it seems to me to be an unethical abrogation of the public trust. - Daryl

 

[TheBigA]

Ray talks about the Fairness Doctrine and how public officials who were personally attacked had the right to respond.

Mythology. You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube.

The Fairness Doctrine - FactCheck.org

Q: Is the fairness doctrine coming back, and would it shut down conservative talk radio? A: Obama has made it clear he opposes it. If it were revived, it probably would reduce the overall number of radio hours devoted to conservative talk shows. FULL QUESTION I hear Rush [Limbaugh] and others...

www.factcheck.org

 

[Daryl Lynn L.A.]

Mythology. You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube.

The Fairness Doctrine - FactCheck.org

Q: Is the fairness doctrine coming back, and would it shut down conservative talk radio? A: Obama has made it clear he opposes it. If it were revived, it probably would reduce the overall number of radio hours devoted to conservative talk shows. FULL QUESTION I hear Rush [Limbaugh] and others...

www.factcheck.org

Yes, I certainly agree with you ! I do not think the Fairness Doctrine is coming back at all. Quite the opposite. I think we've left the Fairness Doctrine far behind and will not see that again. -- Daryl

 

[wadio]

Well, I've learned a valuable lesson here.

I believe one of the components of wokeness is to respect others with regard to words or phrases that might trigger them. For example, the phrase "illegal alien" was retired years ago.

I now realize and admit that I'm triggered by the phrase, "angry old white men," but apparently the same courtesy doesn't apply to me.

One could justify the phrase "illegal alien" by defining each word and explaining how they are used together. That discussion could go on for pages and pages, but isn't it better to just show some courtesy and stop using phrases that make others uncomfortable? Isn't that what wokeism is about?

I thought it would be fun to have a non-political, non-ratings discussion about talk radio but apparently that's not possible so I won't start such a thread.

BTW, I applaud the moderators of this forum for not squelching this discussion. It's been an eye-opener for me. Maybe if people are given the freedom to express their views there will eventually be reconciliation. Or burnout! I know I'm burned out! 😵‍💫

Thanks!

 

[davideduardo]

One could justify the phrase "illegal alien" by defining each word and explaining how they are used together. That discussion could go on for pages and pages, but isn't it better to just show some courtesy and stop using phrases that make others uncomfortable? Isn't that what wokeism is about?

The fact is that your series of posts tends to show an intent to soften or cover reality.

An "illegal alien" is just that: a person not of the nationality / citizenship (not the same thing in most countries) of a place who has entered that place without permission. They are aliens, as they are not endowed with residency or citizenship, and they are illegal because they entered that place without authorization.

To me, "woke" does not involve covering up a person's status. That is usually called "lying".

I thought it would be fun to have a non-political, non-ratings discussion about talk radio but apparently that's not possible so I won't start such a thread.

Talk radio is almost entirely tied to social and political subjects, and all radio, even commercial, is dependent on listenership. Ratings are just a measure of that. A carpenter or an engineer need to know measurements of dimensions and weights and characteristics; radio people need to know the size of their listening public.

BTW, I applaud the moderators of this forum for not squelching this discussion. It's been an eye-opener for me. Maybe if people are given the freedom to express their views there will eventually be reconciliation. Or burnout! I know I'm burned out! 😵‍💫

Obviously, Frank and I encourage this kind of discussion since it is relevant and related to radio. But as moderators, we will sometimes agree and other times disagree. We discourage offensive language and ad hominum insults.

But there is no guarantee that people with different perspectives will ever come to agreement.

 

[vchimpanzee]

An "illegal alien" is just that: a person not of the nationality / citizenship (not the same thing in most countries) of a place who has entered that place without permission. They are aliens, as they are not endowed with residency or citizenship, and they are illegal because they entered that place without authorization.

I have seen houses with liberal messages out front, such as "People are not illegal", or something similar.

Getting back on topic, the radio station I listen to most was off the air again today. I happened to be going to the town where it is located, so I figured the translator would work. It did. Okay, I admit I am happier with the sound quality. I usually get good music with good sound quality only at Christmas. And I heard The Carpenters at one point. However, if I go too far away I won't pick up the translator and it is on the same frequency as the translator of the station I listened to yesterday and as I got close to home today. The stations are 30 miles apart. Plus I have plenty of AM buttons but not enough FM buttons. It just so happens the translator is adjacent to a station I like when I am in the area where it is located, which in turn is next to a translator for an NPR station in the mountains where the main signal won't reach.

The station I listened to yesterday played three 80s songs during the time I was listening today. In fact, "Southern Cross" by Crosby, Stills & Nash was before CBS News and "Dance Hall Days" by Wang Chung immediately after.

 

[TheBigA]

I believe one of the components of wokeness is to respect others with regard to words or phrases that might trigger them. For example, the phrase "illegal alien" was retired years ago.

This is not exactly true. You can use whatever language you want. In fact Dan Bongino continues to use the phrase as recently as a few days ago. The only area where it's changed is in the government:

US under Biden will no longer call migrants 'illegal aliens'

WASHINGTON (AP) — Employees of the two main U.S. immigration enforcement agencies were directed Monday to stop referring to migrants as “aliens,” a dated term that many people consider offensive.

apnews.com

And they still use "undocumented migrant" and things like that. "Illegal Alien" had become a dated term. It doesn't really apply.

The band Genesis had a song about illegal aliens back in the 80s:

 

[Mikey Radio]

By comparison, the ever lengthening MLB and pro football games consist of more long pauses and non-events every year, it seems.

It appears they're (finally) trying to shorten the MLB games this year. If I'm not mistaken the average 9 inning game last season ran an average of something like 3 hours and 6 minutes. Way too long for the attention spans of many in 2023, especially when there are 162 games in a regular season..That's nearly a game each day for most teams.

MLB Opening Day games 26 minutes shorter vs. last year’s average: How the pitch clock performed​

MLB Opening Day games shorter in new rules era

Only two of the first seven games completed on MLB's Opening Day were longer than the shortest game played on Opening Day last year.

theathletic.com

MLB’s 15 games on Opening Day averaged 2 hours and 45 minutes Thursday, 26 minutes shorter than last year’s average, indicating a successful regular-season start for the pitch clock introduced to shorten games as part of the league’s new rule changes

 

[TexasTom]

And they still use "undocumented migrant" and things like that. "Illegal Alien" had become a dated term. It doesn't really apply.

Over time, "illegal alien" turned into "illegal immigrant", and then into "undocumented immigrant/migrant" (as you note). We've seen the same thing with numerous other terms -- such as "cripple" turning into "handicapped", and then into "differentially abled".

My feelings are mixed on this. On the one hand, I think it is respectful to retire what are pretty obviously insulting terms such as "cripple". On the other hand, at some point it seems to turn into an effort to use language to obscure meaning, and when we start tossing around terminology like "differentially abled" I think it becomes off-putting.

In general, I lean pretty liberal but at some point I do think that we need to accept a reasonable balance between avoiding needlessly cruel terms and rendering everything into jargon that obscures meaning.

 

[wadio]

My feelings are mixed on this. On the one hand, I think it is respectful to retire what are pretty obviously insulting terms such as "cripple". On the other hand, at some point it seems to turn into an effort to use language to obscure meaning, and when we start tossing around terminology like "differentially abled" I think it becomes off-putting.

Interesting point. And there are nuances. Referring to someone as "crippled" could evoke sympathy, but calling someone "a cripple" is definitely an insult. I guess it depends on how language is used over time, and of course the context.

 

[anotherguyTN]

Disabled still sounds better.

 

[davideduardo]

Interesting point. And there are nuances. Referring to someone as "crippled" could evoke sympathy, but calling someone "a cripple" is definitely an insult. I guess it depends on how language is used over time, and of course the context.

And then we have one person out of every 7 in the US being foreign-born, most of whom have English as a second language. Do we think that such a person gets the nuances of "cripple" vs. "crippled"?

And 40% of Americans (plus or minus a few, based on how results were tabulated) never go to college at all, and 10% never finished high school.

 

[wadio]

So we strive for the lowest common denominator? OK. But I think most people know the difference between saying, "Hey, you cripple!" and, "My friend was crippled in a terrible car accident."

 

[vchimpanzee]

So we strive for the lowest common denominator? OK. But I think most people know the difference between saying, "Hey, you cripple!" and, "My friend was crippled in a terrible car accident."

Someone I went to church with as a teenager who posts on Facebook was in a rock band and I think he says they still play together occasionally. He says they're all disabled now in some way and he lists them describing their disabilities, calling himself the "cripple".

 

[Kelly A]

Yes, I certainly agree with you ! I do not think the Fairness Doctrine is coming back at all. Quite the opposite. I think we've left the Fairness Doctrine far behind and will not see that again. -- Daryl

Surprisingly, many of the original politically-focused talk shows were started because of the Fairness Doctrine. If you have a few minutes, have a listen to this podcast; The Divided Dial. In particular Episode 1 explains the history of how the Fairness Doctrine started, and the rise of talk radio: On the Media: The Divided Dial | WNYC Studios | Podcasts

 

[davideduardo]

From Slashdot today,

It's not just the Ford Mustang that's losing its AM radio. The Detroit Free Press reports: "We are transitioning from AM radio for most new and updated 2024 models," Ford spokesman Wes Sherwood told the Free Press. "A majority of U.S. AM stations, as well as a number of countries and automakers globally, are modernizing radio by offering internet streaming through mobile apps, FM, digital and satellite radio options. Ford will continue to offer these alternatives for customers to hear their favorite AM radio music, news and podcasts as we remove amplitude modulation — the definition of AM in this case — from most new and updated models we bring to market." Commercial vehicles will continue to offer AM radio because of longstanding contract language, Sherwood said....

"In essence, EV motors generate a lot of electromagnetic interference that affects the frequencies of AM radio and make it difficult to get a clear signal," said Mike Ramsey, an analyst with Stamford, Connecticut-based Gartner Research Group, which specializes in digital transformation and innovation. "It could be shielded, but given the diminishing listening habits to AM, the automakers haven't chosen to do it. Most of the content there is available through other means, including podcast and internet streaming. In my view, this isn't that different from automakers discontinuing 8-track players, cassette players and CD players. Technology has advanced. The idea that it is a critical safety channel is a bit suspect given that almost all critical communication now is sent through mobile phones...."

Veteran analyst John McEloy, host of "Autoline After Hours" webcast and podcast said automakers don't need to get rid of AM radio. "It's happening because automakers would love to get rid of the cost of an AM radio," he told the Free Press. "Some of them, like Ford, are using EVs as an excuse to get rid of it. GM shields its AM radios in its electric cars to they don't get any interference."
But the article also quotes a spokesperson for GM saying they're "evaluating AM radio on future vehicles and not providing any further details at this time."

Last month U.S. Senator Markey noted that seven more top automakers have already removed AM radio from their electric vehicles — BMW, Mazda, Polestar, Rivian, Tesla, Volkswagen, and Volvo.

AM Radio to Be Dropped in All Ford New Models Except Commercial Vehicles - Slashdot

It's not just the Ford Mustang that's losing its AM radio. The Detroit Free Press reports: "We are transitioning from AM radio for most new and updated 2024 models," Ford spokesman Wes Sherwood told the Free Press. "A majority of U.S. AM stations, as well as a number of countries and...

tech.slashdot.org

Here is the Free Press article, but it is firewalled.

Ford to drop AM radio in new models, except commercial vehicles

While AM radio will still be available in commercial vehicles, Ford will not offer it in new gas-powered and EV vehicles beginning in 2024.

www.freep.com

 

[cc333]

I may have said this somewhere before, but nobody seems to appreciate AM anymore. A well-run AM can still sound decent, and things can be done to improve the interference problems in EVs, but no one cares, citing this or that excuse. I get cost, but surely they can cut costs elsewhere? However, most cars didn't originally have radios at all (I don't think they were a standard feature until at least the 40s or 50s I think), so I guess we're coming full circle in a sense.

It's death by attrition. I'm sure there's things that could be done to get Gen Z interested in it, but nobody cares enough to try anything.

c

 

[Kelly A]

I may have said this somewhere before, but nobody seems to appreciate AM anymore. A well-run AM can still sound decent,

But as compared with FM and streaming options, 'decent' isn't good enough for consumers. That, and the vast majority of the programming is spoken word or occasional foreign language.

and things can be done to improve the interference problems in EVs, but no one cares, citing this or that excuse. I get cost, but surely they can cut costs elsewhere? However, most cars didn't originally have radios at all (I don't think they were a standard feature until at least the 40s or 50s I think), so I guess we're coming full circle in a sense.

The 40's or 50's were a long time ago. Technology, interests, and tastes change.

It's death by attrition.

No, it's death by age.

I'm sure there's things that could be done to get Gen Z interested in it, but nobody cares enough to try anything.

That sentiment is repeated often on this discussion board by non-industry folks: If only radio played more variety. Radio isn't bringing in younger people because there isn't the DJ/personality anymore, or my favorite; just play music on AM and young people will return.
All nothing more than nostalgia from when they were kids and radio was the only game in town. GenZ have literally hundreds of choices for news and entertainment today, not just radio.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

I may have said this somewhere before, but nobody seems to appreciate AM anymore. A well-run AM can still sound decent

Frankly, when someone says this, I wonder if they actually listen to AM radio.
AM Radio can sound decent if you have really high field strength and a decent receiver. When I worked at an AM whose studio and TX were co-located, I was impressed with the sound quality when I drove in. When I drove home, some 10 or 12 miles from a Class D AM, I was much less impressed.

I have a high end Sangean tuner, and there is not a single AM channel where I get noise-free reception on AM.
Even the worst streaming technology, circa 1997, sounds better than AM broadcast. Heck, someone holding a telephone up to their FM receiver sounds better than AM broadcast.

 

[BruceB]

Many electric car manufacturers are now no longer including am radios in the car and if you've ever been in an electric car and tried to listen to an AM station you know why.my question is what effect will this have on big AM stations like 700 WLW.