So if it's not working, why are they still on the air, broadcasting classic hits? It's certainly no KRTH, but for them, it has to be working, right?
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It's 2015! Time to get rid of the '70s.
- Thread starter CurtisNEPA
- Start date
So if it's not working, why are they still on the air, broadcasting classic hits? It's certainly no KRTH, but for them, it has to be working, right?
Everything's relative. Some people stay in marriages their whole lives, completely miserable. Some people run stations as a labor of love, regardless of the reality. There was a guy who ran a classical music station like that. Then one day he died, and his family sold the station. Now it's playing something else. So don't be surprised when that day comes.
Actually Avid, all classic hits station studios have immediate access to thousands of songs. They are ALL accessible via computers and the like (or the vault or simply, the library). They only air the positive ones, you know, about 400 of them.
It's not like a station has shelves of LP's and 45's or even broadcast loop carts anymore.
A
Avid Listener
Guest
You didn't read my post, did you?
The sentence about the library was just added as secondary. It has nothing to do with your post, I know.
And yes, I misread you post initially.
Carry on....
That's not true. Generally the digital storage terminal in the studio only has access to the songs scheduled on the music logs.
The program director may have more songs in a separate directory. If the station is part of a larger company, any songs not being used in programming are more likely to be on a central audio asset server from where they can be transferred if needed at the times that the library at the station is updated.
Again, your effort to make broadcasters out as stupid incompetents is going to fail.
My point was that if additional songs are inserted in a station's playlist, they will be songs that did not "pass" the music test selection criteria and thus will likely have some negative data points that would cause loss of specific audience groups.
Irrespective of how many songs are tested, the results are not implemented based on rank position. Implementation starts with the viewing of many columns of data and reviewing the characteristics of each song on multiple data points. Those might be, in a hypothetical format, men, women, 25-34, 35-44, core 28-41, P1 listeners, P2 listeners, Heavy P1 listeners, and various columns of clusters derived from factor analysis.
We'd start by eliminating songs that are below neutral on any of the key columns. Then we would look for songs that have lower positives but have strength in certain subsets, and decide which of them would be of value, perhaps as fill songs. Then the remainder of the songs, using the same multi-faceted profile, are assigned to different rotation categories. The songs with the most favorites and highest across the board scores get played the most.
Most songs on a test are songs that are already being played, so there will be a majority of songs scoring in the highest two quintiles. While a few songs may be found to have moved below the cutoff level, generally the changes in score are primarily used to adjust up or down the rotational frequency.
Some songs have amazing staying power and continue to test well after decades, while others decline as they age. Each song's appeal and useful life in a classic hits or other gold based format has different characteristics and will behave differently.
No, because there is no gold-based format where there were that many real hits in the age range a station might decide to play. But over the course of a number of years, a station might test over 2000 different titles.
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A
Avid Listener
Guest
And there's the nub of the whole problem. You all are so slavishly wedded to the concept of an ultra tight playlist that you'll start with a meager sampling of only 2,000 songs. And regardless of what various permutations of mathematical chicanery you go through to extract the "best" 400, you're stuck with inflicting a tight list of only 400 songs on us. So you test 2,000 and only play the top 20% of them. I submit that if you were to test 10,000, you could limit your playlist to only the top 10% (which means only the very highest testing songs) but we'd get to hear 1,000 different songs!
That's an improvement, but still a "few drops in the bucket".
But, by testing 10,000 songs, say the late 60's to mid 80's time period, you are getting into some lower charters that frankly, may have or have not been heard since they were released, you know the songs that peaked below position 30 or 40 on Billboard, the real "stiffs".
I'd say, test about 3000 to 5000 of mainly top 15's and play about 40% of those, but of course that won't happen either.
That's what I said in an earlier post and you downplayed it. So basically, if a station keeps testing most songs over and over that have been played, then that's what we'll hear, the same songs, over and over, because nearly all will test positive again.
Listeners have gotten used to most songs, so that's what they will like, effectively blocking other songs from entering the rotation. If a station wants to rotate 400 or 600 songs, and the auditorium group "passes" the usual 400-600 songs, then there is really no room to add other lower-positives or simply stated.......the lesser played hits.
I believe a PD has a say in how many songs ultimately should be played. On one station out west, they were playing about 800 songs. Then when a new PD took over recently, that suddenly dropped to around 400, with many 60's and early 70's being eliminated but with very few replacements for them. All that remained were the highly tested hits of the late 70's and 80's with no elbow room.
The cycle........has cycled and cycled.
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And what was the result in terms of ratings and revenue?
A
Avid Listener
Guest
That's the second half of the errant argument. The assumption that the only reason that people listen to a station that plays "vintage" music is nostalgia is just, plain wrong. There are lots of us who enjoyed hearing new songs on the radio back in the day, as long as they were good songs and they fit the genre we wanted to hear at the time. Given the arbitrary selections by the suits in radio and the suits in the record industry of which songs at any given time are selected to be pushed and promoted into hits, and which ones were left to languish as album "deep cuts", there is a potentially huge inventory of music from the olden days that people would enjoy hearing mixed in amongst the familiar.
In a market with only one station specializing in Adult Contemporary music, the argument that someone who likes the first tier level hits of any given artist would switch over to the hip-hop or heavy metal station just because they heard a second-tier hit from that same artist is absurd. It makes absolutely no sense at all. It is simply too incredibly ridiculous to believe, regardless of who makes the claim.
That's not to say that some songs should be in higher levels of rotation that others. But don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. Only an idiot would fall for such an absurdity.
It really doesn't matter. You're arguing about how sausage is made. You either like it or you don't. That's really the end of the discussion.
You're assuming that if a test was changed to suit you, that the results would also favor what you like. There's no reason to believe that. We're talking about popular taste here. You can give people thousands of choices, and they'll usually pick the one that's most familiar. You can play that game with anything from food to clothes to the type of women they like.
You guys are arguing about extremely successful radio stations that have a lot of listeners. Most of them are among the most popular in their market. And you don't like them. Too bad. Find something else.
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Hey hey, one of the classic hits stations I listen to (and they have expanded their library a bit) is at an 8.0 and #2.
Not bad!
https://tlr.arbitron.com/tlr/public/market.do?method=loadAllMarket
Just select market: Pueblo
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And we're at that point now where there's enormous potential for many of the hits to be brought back again as we heard them on Top 40 radio. The mid 70's through the 80's was a huge period in music, but yet.....only about 10% of them are ever played, if that.
That wasn't the question I asked. You gave an example, and I asked you a question. What's the answer?
It's not radio's job to play all the songs ever released. That's not what we do, it's not what the music industry wants, and it's not what the FCC wants. It's also not what the majority of the listeners want.
They are at (drum roll......) stuck at #4, with a 4.5
M
Music Lover
Guest
Many of the web-only soft AC's I've been checking out are run by people that have been DJ's or Programming Directors. This station's on air talent is an example: http://www.channelztheedge.com/_html/main/mainMic.html
Others are through networks offering a variety of genre channels. Examples: www.181.fm, www.sky.fm, www.bigrradio.com, www.accuradio.com, www.radioio.com
I prefer the ones run by the DJ's and Programming Directors best because it's more personal. You can email them and chat with them about the music.
Others are through networks offering a variety of genre channels. Examples: www.181.fm, www.sky.fm, www.bigrradio.com, www.accuradio.com, www.radioio.com
I prefer the ones run by the DJ's and Programming Directors best because it's more personal. You can email them and chat with them about the music.
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M
Music Lover
Guest
The mix on that station is half mellow, half edgy. Besides some country, most of the current music I've heard so far is the guitar-driven (but still sort of quiet) sounds that were popular on Soft AC/AC/HAC in the early and mid 00's. Songs such as "You And Me" by Lifehouse, "Home" by Daughtry, "My Immortal" by Evanescence, "Here Without You" by 3 Doors Down, "I'm With You" by Avril Lavigne.
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