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Just installed the dual XHD6425 radio in my truck today
- Thread starter jras20
- Start date
R
rbrucecarter5
Guest
jras20 said:My radio had the DX light on, so I assume it was on DX. If it was local then Austin reception would go completely out about 35 miles. I can usually get Austin at least 65-70 miles away with a decent radio.
The 100.7 that used to be known as KASE had a monster signal that I could hear in Midland, TX. Not that I cared about the format. Besides the Dallas / Ft. Worth Monsters and a couple of signals from San Antonio, it was one of the strongest and most dependable signals from 300 miles out.
If that station still exists in some form and runs HD, I'd like an estimate of how far their HD goes in comparison to analog.
KASE 101, still around. They are one of the strongest stations in Austin, to from what I did on my results was that little past Luling, about 45 miles out of Austin, all the HD signals start to crap out, and not even listenable. They keep breaking up constantly. Even KBPA's HD is out about to about Gonzales which is about 35 or so miles from the tower?..
Jras20,
I bought the JVC radio in 2006 and am satisfied with the FM performance. I can pick up the HD signals relatively dropout free to about the 55-60 db contour, and spotty to about the 50 db contour. The performance is good despite the fact that the FM band in the Cincinnati area is crowded with low powered signals. I can also receive a few out of market HD signals from Dayton. Many posters here believe there is a problem with mobile reception, but I see a problem with in house reception in that HD reception is good only to about the 65 db contour. As the NPR study indicated, a 10 db increase will improve indoor reception to about 85% of the analog signal, and will make mobile reception better than analog. Occasionally, skip caused by temperature inversions in the summer cause the comparatively weak HD signal to fail. Higher power will make the HD signals more resistant to skip from distant signals.
I bought the JVC radio in 2006 and am satisfied with the FM performance. I can pick up the HD signals relatively dropout free to about the 55-60 db contour, and spotty to about the 50 db contour. The performance is good despite the fact that the FM band in the Cincinnati area is crowded with low powered signals. I can also receive a few out of market HD signals from Dayton. Many posters here believe there is a problem with mobile reception, but I see a problem with in house reception in that HD reception is good only to about the 65 db contour. As the NPR study indicated, a 10 db increase will improve indoor reception to about 85% of the analog signal, and will make mobile reception better than analog. Occasionally, skip caused by temperature inversions in the summer cause the comparatively weak HD signal to fail. Higher power will make the HD signals more resistant to skip from distant signals.
Two things about this, Len: one, I don't believe - and many others agree - that the proposed digital increase of from 6 to 10 dB is going to make a dramatic improvement in most real-world listening scenarios. The minimal testing done thus far has been under ideal conditions and lots of technical deck-stacking fiddling with the NRSC mask. 6 dB more in hillier terrain, such as places like the Smoky Mountains or in Pittsburgh, is going to mean little. Besides, very few broadcasters are going to completely rebuild transmitter sites and double their power bills to improve HD reception for the laughably small digital audience.
Two, even if the digital increase improves things somewhat, you don't get a "do-over" when it comes to consumer products. If the product gets rolled out when it's not ready and the early adopters get burned - as they decidedly have with HD Radio - they won't be back to buy Dual car radios or Insignia personal portables.
What's the marketing positioner?? "C'mon back to HD Radio! THIS TIME, we promise - it really works!!"
Two, even if the digital increase improves things somewhat, you don't get a "do-over" when it comes to consumer products. If the product gets rolled out when it's not ready and the early adopters get burned - as they decidedly have with HD Radio - they won't be back to buy Dual car radios or Insignia personal portables.
What's the marketing positioner?? "C'mon back to HD Radio! THIS TIME, we promise - it really works!!"
The remaining HD pushers are like the religious fanatics (I'm not talking about regular believers, I mean the over the top crazys): They are blinded to the truth because of their fervor or fear or both, it must be nice to be able to continue to believe in something despite every indication that it is, has been and will continue to be: A FAILURE.
Bob, you present a well reasoned argument about the merits, or lack thereof, of HD radio, but I must respectfully disagree on a few of your points. If some posters on this board wish to call me an HD zealot, that fine. I just call it as I see it. With respect to hilly terrain, Cincinnati has several hills within 15 miles of the Ohio River which causes multipath distortion in some areas that are within 2 miles of the tower. Before HD radio came on the scene, I accepted the multipath as one of the problems associated with FM. On HD stations, the digital signal provides a clean signal in areas where the signals are strong but plagued with multipath. In areas where the signal is weaker, the digital signal fails under those circumstances. If fact, when the HD signal is off, I can readily tell the difference. Intuitively, a ten fold increase in power should nearly double the distance to where the signal is reliable, although reception will still be a challenge in some areas. All in all, the performance at the 1% injection level works fine for mobile devices in that most of the populated area is served. Indoor reception is where HD radio is problematic. I think a 10 db increase will fix this.
As far as HD radio succeeding, only time will tell, and I admit it doesn't look encouraging now. Allowing only a 1% injection will seal its fate- which I'm sure will make most of the posters here happy. There are many challenges facing radio in general, and the posters here that are both for and against IBOC are fighting over the crumbs.
As far as HD radio succeeding, only time will tell, and I admit it doesn't look encouraging now. Allowing only a 1% injection will seal its fate- which I'm sure will make most of the posters here happy. There are many challenges facing radio in general, and the posters here that are both for and against IBOC are fighting over the crumbs.
Is little or no multipath worth the hissing and whooshing and reduced coverage? If as you say there are many challenges facing radio dividing the radio populace into two camps certainly isn't helping the situation. HD radio is not helping the situation either by raising the noise floor on AM which WILL happen to FM also with the ten time increase in signals that are too wide for their slot, FM will become a hissathon just like AM is now. Watch out you may get what you want and that'll really be the death of HD.
Len, I appreciate your reasoned/reasonable comments and candor. I don't think you are an "HD zealot" but are a person who sees merit in HD Radio - an opinion which I value highly. We don't have to agree on everything to be able to do this.
The smart money is saying these days that 10 dB digital isn't going to happen - at least, not "across the board," but OTOH I recall prior to 9/14/07 the same "smart money" was betting that the Commission would require HD-AM stations to drop digital injection to 25% or 50% of daytime power at sunset - kind of a "digital pattern change." As we know, the FCC didn't do this (likely because everyone knew the digital wouldn't work at all at that level.) It's the FCC - and as we know, they do whatever the hell they want.
So: we could get surprised, but right now I'm thinking we're gonna see -14 dBc (a 6 dB increase.)
If what we're trying to fix here is multipath, wouldn't some other less destructive system be appropriate? Seems like causing co-channel losses in mobile listening and harmful adjacent-channel interference isn't worth the "fix."
The smart money is saying these days that 10 dB digital isn't going to happen - at least, not "across the board," but OTOH I recall prior to 9/14/07 the same "smart money" was betting that the Commission would require HD-AM stations to drop digital injection to 25% or 50% of daytime power at sunset - kind of a "digital pattern change." As we know, the FCC didn't do this (likely because everyone knew the digital wouldn't work at all at that level.) It's the FCC - and as we know, they do whatever the hell they want.
So: we could get surprised, but right now I'm thinking we're gonna see -14 dBc (a 6 dB increase.)
If what we're trying to fix here is multipath, wouldn't some other less destructive system be appropriate? Seems like causing co-channel losses in mobile listening and harmful adjacent-channel interference isn't worth the "fix."
My JVC digital radio gets good digital and analog reception. The analog has DSP which I love.
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