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KABC-TV and KMEX-DT Los Angeles (City of License)

R

RonaldMolina50

Guest
Can KABC-TV and KMEX-DT easily change their City of License to Santa Ana from Los Angeles?

Can KABC-TV and KMEX-DT easily moved their transmitter to Santiago Peak from Mount Wilson?

Since Los Angeles is already serving KCBS, KNBC, KTLA, KCAL, KTTV, KCOP, KWHY, KCET, and KLCS.
 
RonaldMolina50 said:
Can KABC-TV and KMEX-DT easily change their City of License to Santa Ana from Los Angeles?

Can KABC-TV and KMEX-DT easily moved their transmitter to Santiago Peak from Mount Wilson?

Since Los Angeles is already serving KCBS, KNBC, KTLA, KCAL, KTTV, KCOP, KWHY, KCET, and KLCS.
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Both stations certainly already provide a "city-grade" signal to Santa Ana from their existing Mt. Wilson towers. Since there are indeed plenty of other TV stations licensed to Los Angeles, loss of service would not be an issue.

I think an attempt by KMEX to move to Santiago Peak would run afoul of the allotment of channel 34 for a digital station in Tijuana. (indeed, isn't XHAS already operating a digital signal on 34?) A move by KABC might (or might not) run afoul of KFMB in San Diego on the adjacent channel. Haven't run the math.

Even if there is no technical challenge to the tower move, I see zero chance of it happening. It would be a huge investment that might bring a miniscule increase in audience in Orange County, but at the expense of a larger (but probably still miniscule) decline in audience in areas further north.

The change in city of license would be a lot less expensive and wouldn't cost any existing audience -- but it wouldn't gain any audience either. You won't be seeing this side of the change either.
 
KABC-TV, which transmits on DTV Channel 7 in Los Angeles, not yet filed an application for the next 10 years to replace its Harris TAV-6H CPV circularily polarized antenna in Mount Wilson, which it had been using for analog service prior to June 12, 2009, with a new Dielectric TCL-6A7 circularly polarized antenna, and a new transmitter in Santiago Peak. The new antenna will have a radiation center slightly higher than the old antenna and the ERP will decrease slightly—from 28.7 kW to 160 kW. The new transmitter will be moved from Mount Wilson to Santiago Peak. KABC-TV will be moved its city of license from Los Angeles to Santa Ana.

Another Channel 34, KMEX-DT in Los Angeles, not yet filed an application for the next 15 years to replace its Andrew ATW22HS8-ETC2L-34H elliptically polarized antenna in Mount Wilson, which it had been using for analog service prior to June 12, 2009, with a new Dielectric TUM20-O5-8/40U-2 elliptically polarized antenna, and a new transmitter in Santiago Peak. The new antenna will have a radiation center slightly higher than the old antenna and the ERP will decrease slightly 1000kW. The new transmitter will be moved from Mount Wilson to Santiago Peak. KMEX-DT will be moved its city of license from Los Angeles to Santa Ana.
 
RonaldMolina50 said:
KABC-TV, which transmits on DTV Channel 7 in Los Angeles, not yet filed an application for the next 10 years to replace its Harris TAV-6H CPV circularily polarized antenna in Mount Wilson, which it had been using for analog service prior to June 12, 2009, with a new Dielectric TCL-6A7 circularly polarized antenna, and a new transmitter in Santiago Peak. The new antenna will have a radiation center slightly higher than the old antenna and the ERP will decrease slightly—from 28.7 kW to 160 kW. The new transmitter will be moved from Mount Wilson to Santiago Peak. KABC-TV will be moved its city of license from Los Angeles to Santa Ana.

Another Channel 34, KMEX-DT in Los Angeles, not yet filed an application for the next 15 years to replace its Andrew ATW22HS8-ETC2L-34H elliptically polarized antenna in Mount Wilson, which it had been using for analog service prior to June 12, 2009, with a new Dielectric TUM20-O5-8/40U-2 elliptically polarized antenna, and a new transmitter in Santiago Peak. The new antenna will have a radiation center slightly higher than the old antenna and the ERP will decrease slightly 1000kW. The new transmitter will be moved from Mount Wilson to Santiago Peak. KMEX-DT will be moved its city of license from Los Angeles to Santa Ana.
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This makes no sense.
 
Michael Rivers Kramer said:
This makes no sense.
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I thought I remembered this poster. Back in 2007, he tried to tell us KTBN was changing affiliations from TBN to...MTV. We know how that turned out. ;D
 
I think there's some confusion. I'm no expert, but I don't believe transmitter location has anything to do with city of license. For example, KNTV, (city of license San Jose) became the Bay Area's NBC affiliate in 2001. Over the air viewers from San Francisco north often couldn't pick up KNTV's signal, and were without an NBC station for awhile.

So NBC moved the transmitter from Mt. Loma Prieta near San Jose to San Bruno Mountain between San Francisco and South San Francisco. But KNTV's city of license remains San Jose.

A radio example: KGO's (AM radio) transmitter is located in the SF Bay mud off the Dumbarton Bridge - considered within the Palo Alto city limits, I believe. But the city of license is San Francisco.
 
Lkeller said:
I think there's some confusion. I'm no expert, but I don't believe transmitter location has anything to do with city of license. For example, KNTV, (city of license San Jose) became the Bay Area's NBC affiliate in 2001. Over the air viewers from San Francisco north often couldn't pick up KNTV's signal, and were without an NBC station for awhile.

So NBC moved the transmitter from Mt. Loma Prieta near San Jose to San Bruno Mountain between San Francisco and South San Francisco. But KNTV's city of license remains San Jose.

A radio example: KGO's (AM radio) transmitter is located in the SF Bay mud off the Dumbarton Bridge - considered within the Palo Alto city limits, I believe. But the city of license is San Francisco.
Click to expand...

The transmitter must be located such that an adequate signal is provided across most of the city of license. More powerful stations with larger coverage areas can locate their transmitters further from the city of license. It's quite common for a station's transmitter to be located outside the city of license.

KNTV actually had to get a waiver to locate their analog transmitter on Mt. San Bruno: they couldn't quite provide the adequate signal across enough of San Jose. I'm not entirely sure why they didn't just change their city of license to something closer to San Bruno -- San Mateo, somewhere like that. With DTV the requirements are looser and a waiver is no longer necessary.
 
w9wi said:
Lkeller said:
I think there's some confusion. I'm no expert, but I don't believe transmitter location has anything to do with city of license. For example, KNTV, (city of license San Jose) became the Bay Area's NBC affiliate in 2001. Over the air viewers from San Francisco north often couldn't pick up KNTV's signal, and were without an NBC station for awhile.

So NBC moved the transmitter from Mt. Loma Prieta near San Jose to San Bruno Mountain between San Francisco and South San Francisco. But KNTV's city of license remains San Jose.

A radio example: KGO's (AM radio) transmitter is located in the SF Bay mud off the Dumbarton Bridge - considered within the Palo Alto city limits, I believe. But the city of license is San Francisco.
Click to expand...

The transmitter must be located such that an adequate signal is provided across most of the city of license. More powerful stations with larger coverage areas can locate their transmitters further from the city of license. It's quite common for a station's transmitter to be located outside the city of license.

KNTV actually had to get a waiver to locate their analog transmitter on Mt. San Bruno: they couldn't quite provide the adequate signal across enough of San Jose. I'm not entirely sure why they didn't just change their city of license to something closer to San Bruno -- San Mateo, somewhere like that. With DTV the requirements are looser and a waiver is no longer necessary.
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Thanks for providing a more knowledgeable answer, but it would seem to indicate that KABC and KMEX would not have to change their cities of license just because the transmitter changes location...within the coverage area, anyway.

I assume KNTV had no interest in changing their city of license because their branding has been closely connected with high-tech and Silicon Valley. Their main studios are on N. First Street in San Jose in a strip that includes many high-tech corporations like E-Bay. Though San Mateo is right next door to one of the biggest high tech companies - Oracle in Redwood Shores, it does not have the panache of San Jose. San Mateo and San Bruno are really suburbs of San Francisco, while San Jose is now the Bay Area's largest city.

KNTV has recently adjusted their branding to "NBC Bay Area."
 
Lkeller said:
Thanks for providing a more knowledgeable answer, but it would seem to indicate that KABC and KMEX would not have to change their cities of license just because the transmitter changes location...within the coverage area, anyway.
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It might be difficult in KABC's and KMEX's case because of the extensive geographic size of Los Angeles. They might find it difficult to cover the whole city from somewhere else. But I would suggest LA and Chicago are special cases that way. There aren't many other cities in the U.S. that are that geographically large.

I assume KNTV had no interest in changing their city of license because their branding has been closely connected with high-tech and Silicon Valley. Their main studios are on N. First Street in San Jose in a strip that includes many high-tech corporations like E-Bay. Though
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Well, you can really bury your city of license pretty well if you want. Channel 2 in the Bay Area is *not* a San Francisco station -- it's technically Oakland -- doesn't seem to faze anyone up there.

KNTV has recently adjusted their branding to "NBC Bay Area."
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Yep. I think with that branding they really don't care what their technical city of license is. (you could put up

"San Francisco KNTV San Jose"

on the screen, it'd be a legal ID and I don't think anyone on either end of the Bay would be offended)
 
w9wi said:
I think with that branding they really don't care what their technical city of license is. (you could put up

"San Francisco KNTV San Jose"

on the screen, it'd be a legal ID and I don't think anyone on either end of the Bay would be offended)
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And plus, it would meet FCC regulations of ID-ing themselves, as the COL immediately followed the calls. They don;t care what they put before the calls -- it's what follows them that counts.
 
azumanga said:
w9wi said:
I think with that branding they really don't care what their technical city of license is. (you could put up

"San Francisco KNTV San Jose"

on the screen, it'd be a legal ID and I don't think anyone on either end of the Bay would be offended)
Click to expand...

And plus, it would meet FCC regulations of ID-ing themselves, as the COL immediately followed the calls. They don;t care what they put before the calls -- it's what follows them that counts.
Click to expand...

Well, it's TV so the top of the hour ID only has to be visual - flashed at the bottom of the screen for about one second. So I doubt viewers even notice it.
 
So back on topic. If KABC were to move from Mt Wlison to Santiago, what happens to the SF Valley. Hollywood Hills would be a pretty good block. And I suspect that some of teh putlying areas to the east (san Bernadino) would be lost. Big gain for Temecula though :)
 
Even though I live in Denver, most if not all of the sticks for TV are on Lookout Mtn., or Mt. Morrison, which for the geographically-challenged, are located in Jefferson County...at least 15-20 miles from the City & County of Denver, but all are licensed to Denver.
 
recto101 said:
Wait I thought the studios of KABC are in Glendale why move it to Santa Ana.
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Who said anything about them moving their studios to Santa Ana? Again - city of license and studio location has very little to do with the location of the transmitter. You could be licensed to one city, have your studios in another city, and your transmitter in a third city.
 
Lkeller said:
recto101 said:
Wait I thought the studios of KABC are in Glendale why move it to Santa Ana.
Click to expand...

Who said anything about them moving their studios to Santa Ana? Again - city of license and studio location has very little to do with the location of the transmitter. You could be licensed to one city, have your studios in another city, and your transmitter in a third city.
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There is no point to this thread. It was started by someone who was spreading unfounded illogical information.

There is NO LOGICAL REASON for KMEX, or KABC or any Los Angeles licensed station (With Mt. Wilson facilities) to another city ( read suburb) in the market other than make brownie points with the FCC. In this case, I can't see it. I remember when then RKO General requested that the then WOR-TV Channel 9 (Now WWOR) city of license be changed to Secaucus, NJ from New York back in the 80's when the FCC gave an automatic renewal to any commercial TV station that would relocate to New Jersey. This bought RKO some time
with WOR-TV since they were already in trouble with the FCC.
 
Years ago when RKO was challenged by competing app's on a renewal for Ch.9 in L.A. part of the aggreement to get a renewal was changing the COL to Norwalk. After a number of years it reverted back to Los Angeles. Again it really meant nothing.
 
JON BRUCE said:
Years ago when RKO was challenged by competing app's on a renewal for Ch.9 in L.A. part of the aggreement to get a renewal was changing the COL to Norwalk. After a number of years it reverted back to Los Angeles. Again it really meant nothing.
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I noticed in the First 3 Years of KCAL9 it was Labled as California 9 Norwalk-LA until 1993 or 1994 when Young was about to get the station from Disney it was reverted to LA
 
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