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KIRO's TBTL is the feature story in "The Stranger"

SeattleObserver said:
This probably should have been posted last week, but TBTL was the cover story for "The Stranger." Perhaps the best headline ever... "The best new radio show in Seattle is on... KIRO?!?"

Ron & Don were complaining because (of course) Don O'Neill feels they have the best thing on local radio, especially now that you're expected to give all four.

http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/beautiful-thing/Content?oid=830690
Click to expand...

Well, The Stranger is definitely the hip alternative weekly and if your station gets a favorable mention, you're pretty much in the same stratosphere of cool cred as KEXP and that in itself is worth a LOT. KIXI enjoyed a ratings spike soon after "Lounge 880" was reviewed in one issue in the '90s.

Don't blow it like KIXI......
 
I've flipped by maybe a dozen times so this is just a surface opinion but I found it a little too smug, self-referential and flat boring to hold my attention.
 
Over the years KIRO has, IMO, pretty much turned into an unlistenable mishmash, a signal with no identity. TBTL is the worst of the line-up. It just flat out blows. Which is probably why the Stranger article liked it.

As for The Stranger - ask not for whom the bell tolls. Since Weekly has hipped up a bit, I think The Stranger is losing its edge. Besides - I'm sure it's just my old school values - I'd be embarrassed if the Stranger staff liked what I did, not proud.
 
I have to disagree. The Weekly is a shell of it's former self after the purchase and has almost no news hole anymore. It is a very thin rag these days. They are trying to hip it up, but simply judging by editorial space and ads sold I don't think The Stranger is exactly quaking in it's boots. If the Weekly give you an endorsement, chances are you are white, 53, and a latte liberal.

TBTL is a real breath of fresh air and I commend KIRO for having the courage/ wisdom to do something different. We're always complaining on this board that no one is trying anything new, then we are the first to say how stupid something is when they do try something different. I think I am too old for their target demographic, but even I enjoy it. People of that age bracket are not going to listen to a Rush wanna be- who by the way is VERY smug, boring, and self-referential in his own way. I think this is a real step in the right direction for 97.3, but they have been hesitant to do much pub for TBTL. Maybe the Stranger article is the first step.
 
IMNSHO, TBTL is one of those shows that you don't like at first, until you get to know Luke. I am warming up to it. He's smart, very well read, quirky and a bit scattered but interesting.

I also didn't like Ron and Don, but instead of me warming up to them, I just think they are getting better. Evolving from the old angry male show to comfortable local community minded gabbers. No rocket science, but easy to listen to.
 
IndigoCoyote said:
I have to disagree. The Weekly is a shell of it's former self after the purchase and has almost no news hole anymore. It is a very thin rag these days. They are trying to hip it up, but simply judging by editorial space and ads sold I don't think The Stranger is exactly quaking in it's boots. If the Weekly give you an endorsement, chances are you are white, 53, and a latte liberal.

TBTL is a real breath of fresh air and I commend KIRO for having the courage/ wisdom to do something different. We're always complaining on this board that no one is trying anything new, then we are the first to say how stupid something is when they do try something different.
Click to expand...

I agree. KIRO SHOULD be commended for trying something different.

But KIRO should have done something like create a Seattle version of KSL's "Northside Project", not put on the air that sorry excuse for a radio program known as TBTL.
 
Re: KIRO's TBTL

I will agreed it is good to see some experimentation. I haven't found enough to latch onto but I am glad others have.
 
I'm not sure experimenting on a heritage station like KIRO once was in a market this size is really very smart. Maybe run it on weekends for a few months, see how it plays. TBTL sounds like something the aforementioned white guy in his 50's sippin' a latte would see as "hip" when, in reality, it sounds more like a podcast put on by a group of nerds from their basement.

It's called "mass media" for a reason. I like The Simpsons, my kid likes the Simpsons. I like The Mountain, my kid likes the Mountain. We both think TBTL is Too Goofy To Be Believed. It's an insular, smug and endless gabfest about minutae that only true fanboys will get excited by. When something "awesome" DOES happen - like this weather - and it intrudes in their little clubhouse, it's as awkward as radio can get. I'm guessing Burbank had a fan at KIRO and/or the NPR imprint on his rear-end sold them on thinking this is the real stuff. Unless they're happy with endorsements by The Stranger (I'm not thinking that pulls a lot of weight - there's a reason why it's free) and a 2 share, the show will be gone sooner, rather than later. One can only listen to overgrown pups adore themselves so long.

BTW - I know the Weekly is different and not all the changes are good but, IMO, I like it better these days. I know, I know - I'm a board crank so who cares? I really do think "Ask An Uptight Seattleite" is among the best writing in the city right now, week in, week out. I started out highly skeptical just by the slug line alone but it's truly well done. Maybe it's Vern Fonk in disguise.
 
Dudes this show ain't a factor. It has no ratings no audience and is pretty much a joke in most circles :p Aint no way it will survive beyond Spring when KIRO Am goes sports and the FM goes its news way. Being big in the stranger is like being king fly on a pile of poop, who cares ??? I think the show ranks 24th or 25th in demo and almost as bad 12+ puhleeeesssse. Ain't it the Stranger that thinks KPTK is hot or KEXP. Last time I look those dogs got no ratings bite either 8)
 
Well this is my first post here but I essentially said the same thing on "blatherwatch" ---

Burbank's predecessor, Frank Shiers, was (allegedly) paid peanuts, had no producer, no marketing effort behind him and no on-air promos.

In the last 12 months they have sunk (maybe double?) Shiers salary into Burbank, hired him a full-time producer, started running hourly promos on Dave, Dori and R&Ds shows, done live listener events and TBTL has had 3 newspaper and 1 magazine articles written about them.

The result? An increase from 2.0 to 2.2?

In other words, KIRO has sunk an extra, probably, $150 to $200K to pick-up 700 listeners?

I'm not an expert in this but is it good $ sense to spend $214 per listener? I know KIROs weekend morning news gets something like 60,000 listeners ... in other words, at TBTL rates KIRO should be spending $12,800,000 on just their Saturday morning newscast. Do they?

I actually don't "DISLIKE" TBTL (I can't say I like it) but it astonishes me that KIRO is making such terrible business decisions. If the rest of Bonneville is run that way, all the Prop 8 supporters can save their breath and stop protesting outside Mormon churches because that entire religion will be bankrupt in about 3 months.
 
I don't believe the "Mormons" are stupid...they have a pretty decent track record. Let's give this thing a little time and see what happens. With the ever shrinking AM audience, then the recent move to FM, who knows how terrible Shiers' numbers would've been. Comparing gross points is not always helpful..IF they replaced a lesser demo with a better one then it's money well spent. A 2.0 on KJR AM spends a load of dough; a 2.0 on KIXI already owns everything it could ever want, and they're not changing brands NOW, anyway. I am an outsider, but maybe Luke's audience is looking for wedding rings, a new car, a new house, and maybe they go out to restaurants. If KIRO wasn't getting that out of 7 to 10 pm before, then this is a win. DJDAN, do you have something to show I am on the right track, or am I just full of it?
 
I am an outsider, but maybe Luke's audience is looking for wedding rings, a new car, a new house, and maybe they go out to restaurants.

I could buy that if there had been a major shake-up in advertisers during this time but there doesn't appear to have been. I've only caught TBTL a few times but, when I've listened, it appears to be pretty much the same advertisers as they had before - with the exception of AT&T Mobile which is new. Other than that it's a bunch of PSAs and ads for erectile dysfunction.

And despite that their target is 18-34, they seem to be hitting a lot older, based on the listeners who've called in the few times they've taken calls. (Being in the 18-34 demographic myself I just don't find anything at all appealing about Luke's NPR-esque, PG-rated version of BJ Shea. And it's also a bit off-putting when he trashes other air talent in Seattle ... except KUOW air staff, which he fawns over ... just doesn't seem very professional, and rather makes him seem like a 12 year old in a 40 year old's body.)

Honestly, I think Luke's demeanor and style would be fairly well suited to TV; hosting on G4 or something like that. He doesn't really have the looks for TV but the delivery style might come across better because I think, if he had the opportunity to do a few takes and not have to "hit it" on the first try every time, and have a producer who could give directions and guidance instead of just laughing maniacally, he could actually be quite entertaining. I probably wouldn't watch him but I think there would be those who might, certainly at least more than 2.2, anyway.
 
TheOtherKevin - I think your takes on the Burbank snoozefest are accurate. Did you ever have one of those uncles who some see as full of life and peppy but most think is an embarrassment? The kind of 60 year-old guy at the wedding reception who guzzles alcohol and then hits the dance floor? To anyone watching, it's an embarrassing attempt to be cool as he shakes his paunch at some 22 yr old blushing young lady who desperately wishes she were elsewhere.

KIRO is that uncle. The media world is changing mighty quick and the guys in suits and wing tips have no flippin' idea what to do. But they're contacted by Burbank (who most likely wants to be here because of his daughter, no?), are dazzled by the NPR thing and while they think the whole idea sucks and what goes over the air at night might as well be someone reading Chinese math problems, they are convinced it is h-i-p.

KIRO is (rather, WAS) the NW's heritage talker with adults who discussed adult things and appealed the shrinking number of adults listening to AM. Now they're all over the place and no one knows what to make of them. IMO, it's a mess.
 
If I were programming KIRO I would fire the entire morning news operation - How expensive must they be? - plus the TBTL crew (they could probably get a gig on 92.5 pretty quick), move Michael Savage from where he's languishing on delay at KTTH to KIRO, then plug in Bloomberg in the evening. There's no way Bloomberg would get less than 2.2, plus it'd be free ... honestly, I think you could have static playing and get 2.2 in a city the size of Seattle.

Actually, this is, specifically, what I'd do:

6AM to 10AM - Dori and the Wake-Up Gang
(Dori Monson [host], New York Vinnie [sidekick], Phil Van Der Vort [producing], Tony Miner [headlines] + 1 hot Latina [entertainment news])

10AM to 1PM - Dave Ross

1PM to 3PM - Hebrew Hurricane with Mike Siegel & David Goldstein
[opening music would be the wedding dance from Fiddler on the Roof]

3PM to 6PM - The Savage Nation

6PM to 7PM - Bloomberg Taking Stock

7PM to 8PM - Bloomberg on the Economy

8PM to 9PM - Bloomberg Night Talk

9PM to 10PM - Bloomberg Rewind

10PM to 2AM - Coast to Coast AM

2AM to 6AM - Coast to Coast AM (R)
 
In answer to the ratings question KIRO nights is actually a bit down 25-54 compared to the year previous. In the October extrap, where KIRO-FM middays was number one 25-54, the night show was 25th on the FM and the AM registered a 0.3. From a ratings point of view the show is not growing and declining in prime demos. What is more interesting is the show is declining in the 35-64 demographic. The days of block programming are long gone. Stations have a brand and KIRO AM/FM brand is primarily 55+ and secondarily 35-64. Nights are used to "bring in" buys with added ratings points. KIRO buys will never be 20-40 year olds so running a night show aimed at the demographic makes little sales sense. Stations set an expectation with their audience/advertisers and when you violate that, the audience/advertiser goes away. For KIRO to run this program, and even Ron and Don to a degree based on recent numbers, would be like KRWM going alternative at night. Bad fit. TBTL may be a fine show, but on the wrong station. It might work better on the web or a station like KNDD. From a sales point of view it doesn't get ratings and doesn't fit the "sell" or "demo" of the rest of the KIRO AM/FM brand.
 
Then I stand corrected. I figured since they were moving to FM partly to shore up the younger base, maybe TBTL was a strategic move for that. Since your numbers show this is not working, why the heck are they keeping them going??? What purpose do you think they serve?
 
6AM to 10AM - Dori and the Wake-Up Gang
(Dori Monson [host], New York Vinnie [sidekick], Phil Van Der Vort [producing], Tony Miner [headlines] + 1 hot Latina [entertainment news])

10AM to 1PM - Dave Ross

1PM to 3PM - Hebrew Hurricane with Mike Siegel & David Goldstein
[opening music would be the wedding dance from Fiddler on the Roof]

3PM to 6PM - The Savage Nation

6PM to 7PM - Bloomberg Taking Stock

7PM to 8PM - Bloomberg on the Economy

8PM to 9PM - Bloomberg Night Talk

9PM to 10PM - Bloomberg Rewind

10PM to 2AM - Coast to Coast AM

2AM to 6AM - Coast to Coast AM (R)

WOW. Really? I hope you are just joking about this. This sounds like a great lineup for the second (non-Limbaugh) AM talker station in Yakima.

DORI- this sanctimonious twit blows whichever way the political wind takes him. Listen to a few minutes of his older shows. I expect he will start sounding like a moderate Democrat (again) within 6 months. And he benefits now by being a local live show in a weak time period...would be eaten alive in the AMs against the likes of Rivers, et al. Finally, this show will be sports talk more often than not with two jock sniffers like D and V, but the last thing KIRO wants is to create THAT brand on the FM while trying to establish the AM as the sports leader.

DAVE- with Dori listeners for a lead-in, he'll take an hour just to recover. Man without a station in this format.

HH- ummm. Who is this to appeal to? Might work I suppose, but not with any Ross lead-in listeners.

Savage- Niche hate radio. 1994 just called- they'd like their show back

Bloomberg- business programming does just AWESOME after 6pm. You won't have any listeners, but at least it will be cheap.

Art Bell-- his small but dedicated group will follow him anywhere, even to FM I guess...but so what?

Like I say, I hope this was a parody station. If so, good work, it's pretty funny.
 
IndigoCoyote said:
6AM to 10AM - Dori and the Wake-Up Gang
(Dori Monson [host], New York Vinnie [sidekick], Phil Van Der Vort [producing], Tony Miner [headlines] + 1 hot Latina [entertainment news])

10AM to 1PM - Dave Ross

1PM to 3PM - Hebrew Hurricane with Mike Siegel & David Goldstein
[opening music would be the wedding dance from Fiddler on the Roof]

3PM to 6PM - The Savage Nation

6PM to 7PM - Bloomberg Taking Stock

7PM to 8PM - Bloomberg on the Economy

8PM to 9PM - Bloomberg Night Talk

9PM to 10PM - Bloomberg Rewind

10PM to 2AM - Coast to Coast AM

2AM to 6AM - Coast to Coast AM (R)
Click to expand...

.....and KKNW 1150 JUMPS TO #1!!

I agree Indigo, this line up would be the DEATH of KIRO......
 
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