Low Power Radio Triumphs over Big Broadcasters in Washington: Local Community Ra

[Tom Wells]

I'm not sure how, in reality, you are going to get hundreds of people with vastly different agendas to agree on providing LPFM service for still a limited number of frequencies. OK, I want to do Christian rock, someone else wants to do fire and brimstone preaching, someone else wants to do big band, oldies, polka, left winfg political talk, right wing political talk. How does that all come together?

That sounds like it would be one heckuva good station, if you and the other someones can agree that it needs to be a Christian Rock, brimstone polka big band oldies L/R political talk station. Whew. I'd listen. Such a wide range should satisfy everyone, no?

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

I'm not sure how, in reality, you are going to get hundreds of people with vastly different agendas to agree on providing LPFM service for still a limited number of frequencies. OK, I want to do Christian rock, someone else wants to do fire and brimstone preaching, someone else wants to do big band, oldies, polka, left wing political talk, right wing political talk. How does that all come together?

It will take several months... no, make that several years of struggle and sorting out. And actually the very same kind of human forces that are at work in the free enterprise system will be at work. Those who are political conservatives have a message that the market place, the dollars, eventually decide things. Who decides NOW what is on commercial radio stations? The dollars in the market place.

Under a non-profit system the programming and policies of NCE stations (non-NPR) and LPFM is eventually decided by the "currency" of volunteer labor, and the ability to raise endorsement money. Those who are political liberals will come to realize that their message (whether they understand it today or not) is that the market place of available volunteers will decide things. People who want religion on these stations may or may not be ready volunteers. People who want news and comment of a conservative nature on these stations may or may not be ready volunteers. People who want obscure artistic music or heavy classical music may or may not be ready volunteers. People who want to hear cowboy music by Tex Ritter and Gene Autry may or may not be ready volunteers. People of Scandinavian descent who want the greatest hits by "Whoopee John Wilfart" may or may not be ready volunteers.

The free enterprise market place that functions via an economy not measured in U.S. currency will allow all this to come together... or fall apart and go away.

 

[cold_coffee]

How will a bunch of amateurs playing on the radio help this industry stay afloat?

 

[Ken Tucky]

"How will a bunch of amateurs playing on the radio help this industry stay afloat?"




Good Point! Look what all the amateurs running Clear Channel, Cumeless, Citadel etc. have accomplished!!!

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

How will a bunch of amateurs playing on the radio help this industry stay afloat?

I don't know that it is the goal of the FCC, the Congress or those who will be applicants and operators that LPFM will keep the (commercial?) industry afloat. The goal would be to make a venue for some programming content that hopefully listeners want that the industry does not provide. It is the job of the FCC, the Congress and the LPFM operators to serve the listeners, not to serve the current industry.

Now as to professionalism. I suspect you will find within the LPFM "family" once it is in place, expanded and running a lot of radio Pros and retired Pros and ex Pros making their talent available to the dinky little stations. Some of them will end up making some of the commercial stations sound like THEY are the amateurs.

For those people who dream of loading their favorite 1,253 songs into an automation machine in the closet and simply making an LPFM into your iPod with an antenna for their closest friends... please don't come to the party. That is what will KILL the whole LPFM "Community Radio" concept.

 

[Icangelp]

"How will a bunch of amateurs playing on the radio help this industry stay afloat?"




Good Point! Look what all the amateurs running Clear Channel, Cumeless, Citadel etc. have accomplished!!!

Did someone get fired from CC when they were weeding out the non-contributors?

 

[cold_coffee]

Idiots! These Low Power dudes have asked the FCC to put restrictions on themselves that no other
class of broadcaster has to deal with. Idealistic fools! You don't need to worry about the NAB or
me.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

Idiots! These Low Power dudes have asked the FCC to put restrictions on themselves that no other
class of broadcaster has to deal with. Idealistic fools! You don't need to worry about the NAB or
me.

You want to explain your claims... and maybe document your claims? What restrictions have low-power supporters asked for? What restrictions have been hung around the necks of low-power operators by the NAB and others who want to make sure they fail?

 

[Flying-Dutchman]

The LPFM service is not perfect. But, it is much better than nothing. The
FCC and some of us are trying to improve the rules. I am not for placing
restrictions on LPFM that do not apply to other classes of stations.

I suspect we will have many new LPFM's next year.

 

[Radio Dav]

I would like to get the radio band extended for these, like low band TV, they had radio's for years that would pick up them. That would be a good place for LP and translators, the signal would not have to fight with the monsters, it may be a good place to move several class A's to, that would open up up the FM band. Build a a little converter that will transmit to current FM radio.

 

[Flying-Dutchman]

quote
"I would like to get the radio band extended for these, like low band TV, they had radio's for years that would pick up them. That would be a good place for LP and translators, the signal would not have to fight with the monsters, it may be a good place to move several class A's to, that would open up up the FM band. Build a a little converter that will transmit to current FM radio."  quote


Any service that requires the listener to buy a new receiver would be at a severe
disadvantage.  However, I do support expanding the FM band. I would also
support commercial LPFM's on a case by case basis. But, I do not want LPFM to
finish off the last of the Mom & Pop stations.

 

[Radio Dav]

They would have to make them very cheap.

Yes it would be a disadvantage but I heard HD is more of a disavantage according to Randy M. yrs. no tuner yet that works off batteries, but they had TV radio's that worked on batteries in the 80's that I know.

Another thing they could think about is move full power stations to low band VHF in the next 10 years and build radio now that will get all low band VHF.

It would be like AM it took FM several years before it took off, They would need less power and get out further. There is still some TV stations on low band, just stick the FM stations in among them.

 

[One Who Knows]

How will a bunch of amateurs playing on the radio help this industry stay afloat?

I don't know that it is the goal of the FCC, the Congress or those who will be applicants and operators that LPFM will keep the (commercial?) industry afloat. The goal would be to make a venue for some programming content that hopefully listeners want that the industry does not provide. It is the job of the FCC, the Congress and the LPFM operators to serve the listeners, not to serve the current industry.

Now as to professionalism. I suspect you will find within the LPFM "family" once it is in place, expanded and running a lot of radio Pros and retired Pros and ex Pros making their talent available to the dinky little stations. Some of them will end up making some of the commercial stations sound like THEY are the amateurs.

For those people who dream of loading their favorite 1,253 songs into an automation machine in the closet and simply making an LPFM into your iPod with an antenna for their closest friends... please don't come to the party. That is what will KILL the whole LPFM "Community Radio" concept.

I wholeheartedly agree that as LPFM grows, more professionals and yes, retired professionals wil go to work in these stations. Some will be run well, and I have no doubt some will be screwed up messes (no real difference from today's radio). But the cream will rise to the top. And the truest concepts of "community radio" can be achieved.

As long as the FCC makes a serious effort to license a truly diverse group of LP owners. And by that I mean anyone from former broadcasters to the guy who owns the corner grocery store in a small town. Or a muncipal group, such as a city or village. Licensing 3000 stations to one religious organization won't get you there. And, sadly, there's a lot of those types of prospective owners. I'm not against religious organizations owning HD's...only that I don't believe the largest percentage of these frequencies should go to one "mega church" who'll offer satellite or internet delivered programming with little or no outlet for local content.

 

[Flying-Dutchman]

The Bible of the community radio movement was a book called Sex And Broadcasting. The book was
about WYSO in Yellow Springs and the creation of WAIF in Cincinnati. The ideas that came out of Yellow
Springs were very much against the prostitution of the airwaves by those only in it for money. Community
Radio should not duplicate or imitate commercial radio. But, instead provide an alternative.

Low power broadcasting was not a new thing. After all, Springfield had 10 watt WUSO back when I was
in school. The FCC had discontinued licensing low power stations back in the 1970's

I think it would be great if some guys in Yellow Springs bring back community radio as it once was at WYSO.
It would be great to see one come to Springfield, Urbana, Saint Paris and other towns.

The broadcasting world has changed much since the 1970's. I think a radio station that plays oldies
with a 6,000 song playlist is serving unserved people and is serving the public interest.

Atomation can be abused. But a computer with Raduga software can be a very useful tool. I remember
the old days being chained to the equipment having to cue every song. The automation gives you a
break and can cover when volunteers don't show up. It will free you from being a slave.

Hope to see some new station owners!

 

[One Who Knows]

The Bible of the community radio movement was a book called Sex And Broadcasting. The book was
about WYSO in Yellow Springs and the creation of WAIF in Cincinnati. The ideas that came out of Yellow
Springs were very much against the prostitution of the airwaves by those only in it for money. Community
Radio should not duplicate or imitate commercial radio. But, instead provide an alternative.

Low power broadcasting was not a new thing. After all, Springfield had 10 watt WUSO back when I was
in school. The FCC had discontinued licensing low power stations back in the 1970's

I think it would be great if some guys in Yellow Springs bring back community radio as it once was at WYSO.
It would be great to see one come to Springfield, Urbana, Saint Paris and other towns.

The broadcasting world has changed much since the 1970's. I think a radio station that plays oldies
with a 6,000 song playlist is serving unserved people and is serving the public interest.

Atomation can be abused. But a computer with Raduga software can be a very useful tool. I remember
the old days being chained to the equipment having to cue every song. The automation gives you a
break and can cover when volunteers don't show up. It will free you from being a slave.

Hope to see some new station owners!

Only problems with your post:

The current WYSO has a measurable audience...and it's pretty good, actually! The old one you mention? Not so. I'm sure the old one was fondly remembered by those who attended the college in the "the old days", but history tells another story. I happen to remember it, too. A lot of my friends called it "the hippie station".

I have no issues with serving a definable "alternative" audience. Just make sure it's truly "definable". Serving an "alternative" audience that, in all likelihood, amounts to a few hundred (or less) record collectors, "rock snobs", and which plays largely only to the vanity of the license holder and "his" view of what "everyone" wants is not, in my opinion, worthy of an FCC license. These types of stations have already been put on the air...many have been sold to other interests when the programming fails and these owners find programming a station is a little more difficult than they thought.

Better to program something which could appeal to as large as possible a group of people to gain real fans, than to go with a half-baked "alternative" idea that could lead to ruin. The more professionally a station is run, most often, the better the likelihood of a successful operation. Is there room for being an "alternative"? Of course, provided that audience can be defined in the first case. The majority of radio listeners are not the "radio sucks" crowd.

I recognize you'll disagree here, and that's fine.

 

[gr8oldies]

WYSO has always had the conflict between the very vocal fans of very eclectic programming that very few listened to (DJs that had 10 fans apiece but man could could those 10 fans write letters!), and the realties of WYSO having to stay afloat financially. To stay afloat (especially after Antioch said they no longer would subsidize it), it had to become the area's "Morning Edition" and "All Things Considered" station. WYSO has done quite well with it, even though the townspeople ran a couple of PDs and a GM IIRC out of town on a rail. Yellow Springs may be a perfect place for an LPFM, maybe doing a little of what the dissident listeners group wanted, and I don't know what else. Even then, is everyone in Yellow Springs in that leftover 60s hippie mode?

 

[Flying-Dutchman]

No beef with NPR. One of their voices got her start with me and I am proud of her.

The old WYSO was 750 watts at 100 feet. It's fringe area was Springfield. It could not have made Dayton ratings without a signal.

I have run my own radio stations most of my life. I never ran one at a loss. You have to know how to make
money and you must know how to use money. No, you don't have to be a money lover. But, you better
know how to manage the buck.

I don't care if a station owner does his or her own music programing. They will need to have a large number of listeners and an income to back them up. The new station owners who went broke in the 1990's mostly
borrowed money they could not repay and lived beyond their means. Again, you must know how to use the dollar bill.

Next I have seen great programmers go broke with good ratings because they did not know how to sell.
I have seen crappy stations do very well because they did.

Not all of us agree on what good radio is. This does not matter because there is room for all of us.

I went to high school in Springfield. I had to move out of state because there had not been an opportunity
for me to start a station there.

I sold WKLU in Indianapolis in October 2004 due to having a stroke. It was billing $600,000 per year.
That was $100,000 profit per year. Had I not had health problems, I would own it today. I am currently involved in a non-commercial station that covers 100,000 people.

 

[Flying-Dutchman]

As for the GM who got run out of town at WYSO. He was hired to show people out the door. He
canned many who had been there for years. In business, we call this the "PAPER TOWEL TREATMENT"
That's when you are used to clean up a mess and thrown away.

Wow! Glad I never had a job like that one. Recently an acquaintance was bragging about his new
radio job and how he got to fire people his first week. He had been devastated when he had been axed.
All I could think was wow, he became the man he hated.

 

[pbr]

ONE WHO KNOWS wrote:

Serving an "alternative" audience that, in all likelihood, amounts to a few hundred (or less) record collectors, "rock snobs", and which plays largely only to the vanity of the license holder and "his" view of what "everyone" wants is not, in my opinion, worthy of an FCC license.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I tire of your unfounded and thinly-veiled criticism of Ultimate Oldies Radio, the way it is run, as well as the spouting off of a lot of half-truths and rumor. I am thinking of asking the moderator to remove your unprofessional postings, and suggest you ask yourself what you are trying to prove. I look back at at all your ramblings in the "Ultimate Oldies Radio Expands...." thread, and wonder why you went on a crusade after my original post to happily announce an expansion of our format.

Other postings have taken issue with about anything that anyone has to say. If you think your lengthy diatribes are showing your expertise and intelligence, you are quite wrong. If you wish to grow in this business, try showing some respect to others - even those you may feel are competitors.

We are as deserving of our FCC license as anyone in the business, with a proven record of public service and community involvement. Our innovative format is reaching a broad and appreciative audience. If you don't like it, push a button on your radio and listen to another station.

I'd rather you not post anything at all to this forum - unless it starts and ends with an simple one-line apology.

 

[One Who Knows]

No beef with NPR. One of their voices got her start with me and I am proud of her.

The old WYSO was 750 watts at 100 feet. It's fringe area was Springfield. It could not have made Dayton ratings without a signal.

I have run my own radio stations most of my life. I never ran one at a loss. You have to know how to make
money and you must know how to use money. No, you don't have to be a money lover. But, you better
know how to manage the buck.

I don't care if a station owner does his or her own music programing. They will need to have a large number of listeners and an income to back them up. The new station owners who went broke in the 1990's mostly
borrowed money they could not repay and lived beyond their means. Again, you must know how to use the dollar bill.

Next I have seen great programmers go broke with good ratings because they did not know how to sell.
I have seen crappy stations do very well because they did.

Not all of us agree on what good radio is. This does not matter because there is room for all of us.

I went to high school in Springfield. I had to move out of state because there had not been an opportunity
for me to start a station there.

I sold WKLU in Indianapolis in October 2004 due to having a stroke. It was billing $600,000 per year.
That was $100,000 profit per year. Had I not had health problems, I would own it today. I am currently involved in a non-commercial station that covers 100,000 people.

And I'm sure that you, like most owners, was very happy for that $100,000 profit. The real problem with the business these days comes from the companies that took themselves public after purchasing tons of stations at ridiculous multiples. That's what's led to companies insisiting on "risk-averse" programming, which is what led to complaints about "homoginized" programming.

Yes...there is room for all of us here. I appreciate that. And I appreciate that you see that. And everyone is entitled to opinions. That's what these boards are for.

You argued passionately, as did I. I wish you well.