Most of Internet Radio IS Terresterial Radio

[landtuna]

There has been much discussion on these boards about the impact the Internet is having on OTA radio and it has occurred to me many times while reading those that most of what we call Internet Radio IS OTA somewhere.

I have a 'favorites' list of about 30 stations I listen to over the Internet from time to time (and one I listen to most of the time) and they are all normal radio stations broadcasting OTA in their home cities.

So, in addition to the normal in-area competition from fellow OTA stations there is now national, and perhaps international, competition from stations in far away places that would not have mattered in the old days.

The problem is that those far away stations don't get credit for my ears because I don't live in their market. So it isn't that "radio" that is in trouble so much as it is their business model. Stations with national ad-supported revenue could co-exist with the Internet quite nicely if there was some way to account for Internet listeners (assuming the audience was substantial enough to be measured). Those with local advertisers are still out of luck and must make their money the old-fashioned way. That is not to say they are doomed to failure however.

 

[FredLeonard]

Arbitron does measure Internet radio listening, including streams from terrestrial stations.

 

[landtuna]

Arbitron does measure Internet radio listening, including streams from terrestrial stations.

Are they able to measure more than just TSL?

Are the data significant enough to influence ad buys?

 

[Robert Bass]

There has been much discussion on these boards about the impact the Internet is having on OTA radio and it has occurred to me many times while reading those that most of what we call Internet Radio IS OTA somewhere.

Not exactly... Live365 has over 7,000 internet stations that are operated by individuals who have a passion for radio. Yes, I'm sure there are a few OTA stations over there as well, but they are likely outnumbered by the individuals who run their own station(s).

R

 

[KeithE4]

There has been much discussion on these boards about the impact the Internet is having on OTA radio and it has occurred to me many times while reading those that most of what we call Internet Radio IS OTA somewhere.

Not exactly... Live365 has over 7,000 internet stations that are operated by individuals who have a passion for radio. Yes, I'm sure there are a few OTA stations over there as well, but they are likely outnumbered by the individuals who run their own station(s).

R

But how many listeners do they have, compared to the OTA stations streamed on TuneIn, Radio.com, and iHeartRadio?

 

[Robert Bass]

There has been much discussion on these boards about the impact the Internet is having on OTA radio and it has occurred to me many times while reading those that most of what we call Internet Radio IS OTA somewhere.

Not exactly... Live365 has over 7,000 internet stations that are operated by individuals who have a passion for radio. Yes, I'm sure there are a few OTA stations over there as well, but they are likely outnumbered by the individuals who run their own station(s).

R

But how many listeners do they have, compared to the OTA stations streamed on TuneIn, Radio.com, and iHeartRadio?

First of all, a number of Live365 stations are also on iTunes and TuneIn, including mine.

Secondly, I'm not aware that Live365 has released a listener count estimate. They clearly have enough to attract advertisers such as Progressive Insurance and AT&T. You could probably come up with some sort of average listener count by adding up all the 30 day rolling TLH figures that are posted on each station and dividing by 720. Based on TLH figures, the number one station on Live365 at this time, is averaging approximately 670 listeners at any given time.

R

 

[Tom Wells]

There has been much discussion on these boards about the impact the Internet is having on OTA radio and it has occurred to me many times while reading those that most of what we call Internet Radio IS OTA somewhere.

Not exactly... Live365 has over 7,000 internet stations that are operated by individuals who have a passion for radio. Yes, I'm sure there are a few OTA stations over there as well, but they are likely outnumbered by the individuals who run their own station(s).

R

But how many listeners do they have, compared to the OTA stations streamed on TuneIn, Radio.com, and iHeartRadio?

I could never afford to run a station on live365, iheartradio, etc.
I CAN afford to run a part 15 AM station, and I expect my very dense "neighborhood" has 40-50,000 potential listeners.
There are podcasts for those who might be farther away... I do not accept the concept that after the work I've done to make the presentation, that there should be any recurring costs with monthly bills.
The laws of physics provide the means of transmission, I provide programming, and I'm not likely to pay
some third party to carry the programming when the laws of physics provide this for free.

 

[Robert Bass]

I could never afford to run a station on live365, iheartradio, etc.
I CAN afford to run a part 15 AM station, and I expect my very dense "neighborhood" has 40-50,000 potential listeners.
There are podcasts for those who might be farther away... I do not accept the concept that after the work I've done to make the presentation, that there should be any recurring costs with monthly bills.
The laws of physics provide the means of transmission, I provide programming, and I'm not likely to pay
some third party to carry the programming when the laws of physics provide this for free.

Well you are still paying ASCAP/BMI/SESAC for your Part 15, right? Or do you not use music on your station?

R

 

[Tom Wells]

I'm old enough to see clearly that I'm doing a favor to the writers, artists, performers, the music, AND record labels.

No one is going to make sure my friends get paid for airing of their recordings, I'm quite sure.....

On the other hand, I'm sure I have helped generate sales of music recordings and exposed new music to those who
have gone out to purchase their own copies.

That should be enough... I make NOTHING, and the music wins.

 

[Robert Bass]

The law is the law.... If you're not paying music royalty fees, you're breaking the law. It doesn't matter how you think you are serving the writers and publishers.

R

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

So the question I am left with after reading through this thread: If by law, or if by boycott, there was not one single traditional radio station streaming today, would there even be a topic to discuss? There is software and wifi recedivers like the Logitek Squeezebox in the retail stores and the iPhones and other smart phones have gone to the trouble of including software to receive streams. But if the only audio available on the Intenet non-broadcast station, would there be any traction for the whole concept of streaming?

 

[landtuna]

But if the only audio available on the Intenet non-broadcast station, would there be any traction for the whole concept of streaming?

There are undoubtedly some people who want niche music and who would benefit by having a streaming music service which is not OTA as well but I have not found one I would listen to for more than a few minutes.

 

[FredLeonard]

So the question I am left with after reading through this thread: If by law, or if by boycott, there was not one single traditional radio station streaming today, would there even be a topic to discuss? There is software and wifi recedivers like the Logitek Squeezebox in the retail stores and the iPhones and other smart phones have gone to the trouble of including software to receive streams. But if the only audio available on the Intenet non-broadcast station, would there be any traction for the whole concept of streaming?

Probably. But it would take longer for traction to build. Streams from terrestrial stations are what gets a lot of people to pay attention to Internet radio in the first place. Then they start discovering Internet-only streams - especially for hard to find formats.

Live365 is not really a service for terrestrial stations. It's for individuals who want to play radio and set up hobby stations. It's the audio equivalent of blogging. Professional broadcasters use outfits like Stream the World.

 

[XMportable]

Currently, streams are added to your car. Does anyone see in the future Demos in a the city that they live not mater as much since you can stream the world? This may allow more niche formats on "terresterial radio" to survive located anywhere, USA. Any thoughts? ???

 

[FredLeonard]

The more I look at the headline, I find it telling. An audio stream simulcast of terrestrial radio IS Internet Radio. Terrestrial radio is what comes from a transmitter. Nothing else.

Content is the product (from the listener's viewpoint). Transmitter or Internet stream or satellite are means of distributing that "product."

 

[KeithE4]

The more I look at the headline, I find it telling. An audio stream simulcast of terrestrial radio IS Internet Radio. Terrestrial radio is what comes from a transmitter. Nothing else.

Content is the product (from the listener's viewpoint). Transmitter or Internet stream or satellite are means of distributing that "product."

But people are more familiar with WGN or KFI, for example, than they are with RadioBop, Radio Free Phoenix, or other internet-only stations.

 

[Robert Bass]

The more I look at the headline, I find it telling. An audio stream simulcast of terrestrial radio IS Internet Radio. Terrestrial radio is what comes from a transmitter. Nothing else.

Content is the product (from the listener's viewpoint). Transmitter or Internet stream or satellite are means of distributing that "product."

But people are more familiar with WGN or KFI, for example, than they are with RadioBop, Radio Free Phoenix, or other internet-only stations.

That's why net-only stations need to promote themselves.

R