Mother of mercy, is this the end of local talk radio (as we know it)?

[Julius Leonard Marx]

[EDIT]

Farid Suleman, Citadel CEO, is following mentor Mel Karmazin's playbook: Syndicate a high-priced talent and fire a bunch of local people. Farid was Mel's "Robin" at Infinity Radio when Mel first syndicated the I-man and Howard Stern.

Little biographical info about Farid Suleman is easily available. It's like he emerged full grown from the brow of Zeus to become CFO at Infinity. Suleman, 55, is an ethnic Arab and third generation Tanzanian. He "read" (majored in) finance in Britain (University of Nottingham) and worked in mergers and acquisitions in the London office of the big-time accounting firm of Arthur Young (now Ernst and Young). After coming to the US he was a consultant to Capital Cities Broadcasting in their take-over of ABC, Inc. before becoming Infinity's treasurer/CFO. He's never worked for a radio station (only for corporations that acquire them); he's always worked in bean counting.

Suleman does not appear to appreciate the concept of local control of broadcasting, as practiced in the US from the 20s and enshrined in the Federal Communications Act. He seems to see stations as repeaters for satellite delivered programming; not surprising when you consider he grew up and was educated in two countries with centralized media.

Apparently, Suleman's abilities as a money guy are not perfect. Howard Stern says Suleman. whom he called a "weird dude," once cut him check for over a million dollars by mistake while they were both working for Infinity (Howard returned the check saving Suleman considerable embarassment, if not his job). Suleman returned the favor after joining Citadel by taking Howard off all the Citadel stations then clearing his show and sending him a bill for $400,000 for his on-air mentions of Sirius satellite radio. Reportedly, those stations suffered major revenue losses from this move (but Suleman likes to claim his moves are only about money).

Despite all this, reportedly Suleman is now maneuvering to get Howard for New York's WPLJ (the former WABC-FM) and syndication. Suleman also urged Opie and Anthony to buy Citadel stock, which is now selling for the lowest price ever; O&A are still complaining about that. And Citadel is now forced to sell off station properties, reportedly to off-set losses and pay-off the ABC Radio leveraged buy-out.

Consultant (and former WLS program director) John Rook is saying a major further round of lay-offs at Citadel is expected. Already published articles have suggested Suleman and Boyce are getting ready to replace local hosts at ABC/Citadel stations in Washington, Chicago and Detroit (among others) in order to clear Imus. Again, it's all about money.

Suleman also railed against Google's plan to sell unsold radio inventory because, says Suleman, "it implies we can't sell all our inventory." Can they? Suleman's talk stations and syndicated programs have few, if any, blue chip advertisers, but lots of direct response or per inquiry ads for bottom-feeder advertisers hawking herbal and patent medicine cures, cheap insurance for people who can't get insurance, online matchmaking and audio tape lessons to learn youse how to speak real good. Even so, it seems like they aren't selling all their talk radio spot inventory.

Citadel also has complaints to the FCC by the owner of a pair of Connecticut radio stations. Red Wolf Broadcasting accused Citadel of lying in an application for an FM facility license that Red Wolf wanted to use in a market where it competes with Citadel. This was reportedly after Citadel tried to buy those stations, was turned down, and Suleman threatened to "crush them like a bug." In addition, former New York Attorney General Elliot Spitzer (now governor) charged Citadel with violating payola rules.

Maybe it's good business. It's not good radio. Does Suleman want to turn Citadel talk stations into a bunch of turn-key talkers like Salem and Air America (but with more power and better frequencies)? Seems so.


[EDIT-inflammatory]

 

[cm454]

If that's all true, what a disgrace.

The less special and unique radio programming is, the more likely radio will continue to lose audience to other audio sources. In this case, deservedly so.

 

[SeanMGilbow]

There are still local talk operations out there.

WNIR, the first FM talk station in the country, has been primarily local talk since it went all-talk in the early 80s.

And it's the #2 station in the Akron market, sandwiched between two other locally owned and operated radio stations.

 

[cm454]

Yay Akron.

 

[Julius Leonard Marx]

There are still local talk operations out there.

A few. Damn few.

The one in Wilmington, DE which started the whole brouhaha about cramming.
WLW.
WGN.
KGO (ironically, a Citadel station)
NJ 101.5

However, WVKO in Columbus is not one of them. All satellite, all the time.

 

[Phil Boyce]

Yes, and the former planet Pluto is wobbling on it's orbit and might smash in to earth in the year 2089.

Julius, I have tried to be patient with you here. But you need to stop with the lies and the innuendos, and the "reports" that you somehow dug up. I know it is more fun to come here and lie...but I am not going to let you get away with it:

Let's start with this one:

Already published articles have suggested Suleman and Boyce are getting ready to replace local hosts at ABC/Citadel stations in Washington, Chicago and Detroit (among others) in order to clear Imus. Again, it's all about money.

Please list your source here. If there really IS a published report if this, I will call the paper and order a retraction. If your source is an internet blog...that is NOT a published source. Internet blogs do not publish a thing. It takes you about 25 minutes to set one up...and you can say anything you want. I am here to tell you that no discussions have taken place about replacing the morning shows on any of our successful newstalk stations with Imus. It is just not gonna happen. You seem to think you can say this crap right here on this board and get away with it. Dear God have some common sense. If we were going to do this...why did we not do it out of the gate? What would be stopping us? Maybe the fact that we are NOT going to do it might stop us. Sheeeeeeeeesh!

Despite all this, reportedly Suleman is now maneuvering to get Howard for New York's WPLJ (the former WABC-FM) and syndication.

Please stop me from chuckling at this. Hey Julius, Howard is in the middle of a 5 year deal at Sirius that pays him in excess of 100 million dollars a year to NOT be on terrestrial radio. This is not gonna happen. When John Mainelli reported this MIGHT happen in the NY Post, the Post fired him. But even that is OLD news...going back almost a year.

Consultant (and former WLS program director) John Rook is saying a major further round of lay-offs at Citadel is expected.

John Rook has not programmed WLS for 20 years. I have no idea where he has programmed recently or who he consults with...but he knows nothing...or less than nothing about what is going on inside Citadel. What does this mean..."FURTHER round of layoffs?" I did not know we already had the FIRST one? Actually the companies laying off right now are Clear Channel and CBS and that is well documented. You can predict it might happen...but then again read my first sentence above.

Suleman's talk stations and syndicated programs have few, if any, blue chip advertisers, but lots of direct response or per inquiry ads for bottom-feeder advertisers hawking herbal and patent medicine cures,

You are making this up, right? Are you talking about ABC Radio Network? The Talk Stations? What...KGO does not have a blue chipper? Sean Hannity does not have General Motors? What a crock of crap. The Citadel Talk Stations that I supervisie....WABC, KGO, KABC, WLS, WMAL, WBAP, KSFO, and WJR are the cream of the crop in talkradio. They lead their markets in advertisers.

We do have some advertisers on WABC that might be categorized as bottom feeders...but so does every other station in the nation. There is nothing here to be ashamed about. I see the local NBC affiliate in NYC taking infomercials on Sunday afternoon. It's tough out there, but everybody is going through this. It is not a problem unique to my company.

Maybe it's good business. It's not good radio. Does Suleman want to turn Citadel talk stations into a bunch of turn-key talkers like Salem and Air America (but with more power and better frequencies)? Seems so.

Seems so to whom? YOU? A guy who can't get his facts straight? Think about this for a second. I program WABC in NYC. I have THREE successful NYC morning guys in my lineup....Sliwa, Imus, and Gambling. I have Rush Limbaugh, the most listened to host in America. I have Sean Hannity who is a close second...and Citadel owns his show. I have Mark Levin, the fastest growing show in America, and Citadel owns his show. I have an institution in Bob Grant, and the best female talk show host I have ever heard in Laura Ingraham.

You want to compare me to Salem and Air America? You think that is where this is leading? You think this is not good radio? This lineup at WABC is probably the greatest lineup of superstars ever assembled on one talkradio station. Take a look again, and then tell me this is bad for radio:

Curtis Sliwa
Don Imus
John Gambling
Rush Limbaugh
Sean Hannity
Mark Levin
Bob Grant
Laura Ingraham

 

[Julius Leonard Marx]

Dear Phil,

I'll rephrase the "inflammatory" comment removed from my original post. I said that I think Imus was your boss' idea, not your's. I commended your loyalty in defending this and other corporate decisions.

You say Imus taking over mornings on Citadel's heritage news-talker is "not going to happen." With all due respect, we've all seen instances in radio (and elsewhere) when something that wasn't going to happen, did happen (and the other way around). A fair number of industry observers I have found credible say they think it is possible and even likely. We shall see.

As I recall, your predecessor John Mainelli left the Post because management considered his consulting practice a conflict of interest. Ever since Opie and Anthony resumed doing a show for terrestrial radio there has been widespread speculation that Howard might do the same. Given PLJ's numbers, they would seem more in need of change in the mornings than ABC was.

The spots I am talking about are the ones I hear during Rush Limbaugh on WABC (the only current show I can stand to listen to for any length of time). I suppose since talk radio generally is support by bottom-feeder ads, stations have to program talk shows which appeal to the kinds of people such advertisers target.

I can't share the high opinion you express of your current hosts. Nor do I agree that the current uniformity in viewpoint and style on WABC makes for entertaining radio. I liked it better when C&K crossed swords (or Ross and Wilson). I liked it better when Rush was local, not a GOP flack and crossed swords with other station hosts like Lynn Samuels and Joy Behar. The station is just too predictable. I realize that's what current programming theory seeks. I just don't agree. Maybe part of the problem here is programmers looking at shares to define "success" and not the people who aren't listening to radio much or at all any more.

WJR has fallen even more the WABC. It's not just that J.P. isn't around any more. It was once a very classy operation which reflected and expressed its community. WJR was Detroit and it couldn't be anywhere but Detroit. WJR was how Detroit (maybe more accurately Grosse Pointe and Bloomfield Hills) wanted to see itself. The class is gone. The strong local identity and involvement are gone. Like WABC, WJR is just another station like a bunch of others which could be anywhere (visit the Detroit board for more).

I just hope Citadel leaves KGO alone.

 

[DaleGriffin]

Julius,

How hard is it being the smartest man in radio? Seriously you know all the "inside" info and what would work nationwide - from Columbus to New York to San Fran. How has someone not snatched you up to save radio?

 

[SeanMGilbow]

However, WVKO in Columbus is not one of them. All satellite, all the time.

True. A one-person operation at the moment. On the air less than two weeks. And with no sales staff, but nearly a dozen advertisers.

I can't say this enough, Julius Leonard Marx...

Hello, I must be going.

 

[Julius Leonard Marx]

Julius,

How hard is it being the smartest man in radio? Seriously you know all the "inside" info and what would work nationwide - from Columbus to New York to San Fran. How has someone not snatched you up to save radio?

Dale,

Is there something in particular with which you disagree? Or are you one of those who always hated the smart kids and stole their lunch money?

Actually, I don't have much use for "inside" information. It's the insiders and what they think they know that is killing radio. I assume the insiders are wrong and that improves the odds of coming up with something useful. As a brilliant man once said, "Not only can 'fifty million Frenchmen' be wrong; they usually are."

 

[cm454]

Curtis Sliwa
Don Imus
John Gambling
Rush Limbaugh
Sean Hannity
Mark Levin
Bob Grant
Laura Ingraham

The best group ever assembled?

Sliwa is uniquely NYC and probably wouldn't play in most other cities.
Imus is, well, kinda boring in a lot of ways. Very self-indulgant and winding down.
Gambling? Next.
Limbaugh still gets the numbers, but in decreasing amounts.
Hannity is a one dimensional version of Rush
Levin is overrated. He's a more aggressive version of Rush and Hannity. Certainly seems more educated than Sean. I'd be surprised to see him sustain any degree of success on a national level. That pip-squeaky New Yawka voice will not wear well over time.
Grant is the real deal.
Ingraham? Best female? If I was a woman, that would depress me.

 

[Phil Boyce]

It's fascinating to me to be dressed down by people who think they can program a radio station better than me, but for a variety of reasons have never bothered to do so. If you wanna try this, grow a pair and go do it. I actually do this for a living, without a net. I put my job on the line everyday, that this works. If it fails, I hit the unemployment line. So forgive me for not caring what some people say on this message board who, for whatever reason, have never programmed a radio station, but like to give opinions about it. It's fine that you have an opinion, I just don't worry too much about it.

If you recall, I asked Julius to reveal who his published sources were...and as I suspected he could not do so:

You say Imus taking over mornings on Citadel's heritage news-talker is "not going to happen." With all due respect, we've all seen instances in radio (and elsewhere) when something that wasn't going to happen, did happen (and the other way around). A fair number of industry observers I have found credible say they think it is possible and even likely. We shall see.

Name one. Name one industry observer who said this was likely. I would love to see their name. See, unlike you I use my real name. And maybe these industry observers would like to post their real names here so I could know who is out there talking trash with their head up their own posterior.

As I recall, your predecessor John Mainelli left the Post because management considered his consulting practice a conflict of interest.

You can believe that all you want, but Mainelli was always consulting, so why the sudden problem with the Post management, which happened right after his erroneous report that Stern was talking to Citadel about doing what you foolishly speculated.

Ever since Opie and Anthony resumed doing a show for terrestrial radio there has been widespread speculation that Howard might do the same. Given PLJ's numbers, they would seem more in need of change in the mornings than ABC was.

This was over a year ago and it was not widespread. There were a few who speculated about this, and Julius I don't want to be mean but let me point something out to you: IT DID NOT HAPPEN. Citadel has owned us for over 6 months now. Why did it not happen, my friend? Because as I pointed out Howard is in the middle of a big bucks deal on satellite radio and he could not do it even if he wanted to. You are late to the party with this rumor...and since it did not happen even you should admit that you were wrong about it. Because you were and are wrong about it.

The spots I am talking about are the ones I hear during Rush Limbaugh on WABC (the only current show I can stand to listen to for any length of time). I suppose since talk radio generally is support by bottom-feeder ads, stations have to program talk shows which appeal to the kinds of people such advertisers target.

So based on this admittedly limited knowledge, you post the crap about Citadel stations and the network not being able to get blue chip advertisers. Nice to know you put so much thought and effort into this crazy comment that is also BS.

I can't share the high opinion you express of your current hosts.

That's fine...WABC is not for everybody. Go get yourself a radio station and program it. I am not saying you do not have a right to your opinion, you certainly do. But you are just one listener, and I have 1.2 million who do like it. This was a discussion of how you think Farid is going to destroy talkradio (remember your Mother of Mercy shocking headline?) I merely listed my lineup so you would see that despite Citadel buying WABC we continue with a very strong lineup that wins. Whether you like it personally is immaterial to that discussion.

WJR has fallen even more the WABC.

Yes, WABC has fallen because we lost Joy Behar and Lynn Samuels (in your opinion). Farid had nothing to do with that. I thought your post was about Farid destroying talkradio. Since he has made no changes in WJR since the close, I guess he didn't have anything to do with that either.

Focus, Julius. Try to stick to your arguments and actually provide some facts rather than wild assed speculation, innuendo's, and lies.

I am still waiting for the sources on those "published" reports.

pb

 

[Shoot From Hip]

Julius reminds me of the guy who's read every book ever written on how to hit a baseball, and can quote experts from Ted Williams to Rod Carew to A-Rod and can preach about the "right way" to get it done, but has never set foot in the batter's box. I've suggested to him previously that there's a substantial gap between theory and practical application; he'd prefer to lash back with opinion and assertions rather than actual proof of performance.

 

[Slant]

This is just silly.

 

[newhampshiredude]

Curtis Sliwa
Don Imus
John Gambling
Rush Limbaugh
Sean Hannity
Mark Levin
Bob Grant
Laura Ingraham

The best group ever assembled?

Sliwa is uniquely NYC and probably wouldn't play in most other cities.
Imus is, well, kinda boring in a lot of ways. Very self-indulgant and winding down.
Gambling? Next.
Limbaugh still gets the numbers, but in decreasing amounts.
Hannity is a one dimensional version of Rush
Levin is overrated. He's a more aggressive version of Rush and Hannity. Certainly seems more educated than Sean. I'd be surprised to see him sustain any degree of success on a national level. That pip-squeaky New Yawka voice will not wear well over time.
Grant is the real deal.
Ingraham? Best female? If I was a woman, that would depress me.

Laura Ingraham is the best female talk host by far. She hosts a rather entertainging show that isn't the same as all the rest. The best thing about Laura is that she is a real person. I enjoy it wen she is late for her show and they have to play a soundbite while she rushes into the studio. Everyone can have those problems getting to work a little late in the morning...just most people do't do it with 5 million people tuning in.

Mark Levin has acheived great success outside of Nw York for a while. He has picked up 41 of the top 50 markets, which is an amazing feat. You say Mark has a new York accent, but he really grew up in Philadelphia and now lives in VA (outside of DC0 and does his show from his home.

Don Imus is actually an entertaining listen even though I am a conservative. I think his voice has dragged many people into his show.

Sean Hannity is much different than Rush.

John Gambling is unique listen-to.

Sliwa is definitley New York, although he fills in for Sean and Mark.

Grant is still good at his age, although somtimes it hows on the radio, but he is still great.

 

[SeanMGilbow]

Dude...you haven't heard of Stephanie Miller, have you?

Laura Ingraham replaced Stephanie Miller on a station here in Columbus, which has since fallen out of the latest Arbitrends.

I will never put my advertising dollars toward Laura Ingraham, but I have put my advertising dollars on Steph.

And so have a dozen other Columbus businesses who have begun advertising on her show since her return December 3.

You may enjoy Laura Ingraham's constant tardiness, but you wouldn't if you were paying for her to be on the air.

 

[cm454]

That's great.

Ingraham is the BEST female out there, yet the incident that comes to mind first about her outrageous talent, is that she shows up late for her show now and then.

I guess Laura is good if you see everything through a conservative prism.

If the overwhelming trait of a host is their political slant, then they are uni-dimensional. There is a NICHE audience for that, and many programmers are catering to that mentality. GREAT, but I believe those tired of seeing the same old same old in talkradio are wanting to see something that caters to a much borader percentage of the population.

Of course that is what FM talk was supposed to be for. Unfortunately, as has been discussed repeatedly, every time it's attempted, they shoot themselves in the foot with absolutely empty-headed programming.

For once I'd like to see an FM Talk station with edgy and irreverant hosts who talked about the issues of the day---much like AM talk does, but without the political dependancy and stuffiness. Before Tom Leykis went T&A, he was the perfect example of what an FM host would/should sound like. There's got to be a string of hosts who fit that bill.

None, though, who would have the "wheel of piercings" as a feature on their show.

 

[DaleGriffin]

FYI guys all radio stations are targeting a niche audience... the conservative niche at this time is bigger and more successful. Because you are targeting a niche you superserve that niche, the people who like Rush will not like Rhodes. Now you can call them stupid or afraid of opposing ideas or whatever and say the programmers have evil political ideals, but the reality is RADIO this way works. Garth Brooks followed by Sean Kingston would not work for the same reason. Reality folks, try to grasp it.

Also can we all stop pretending we don't gravitate towards certain shows/hosts because we agree politically, it is a factor.

Unrelated question: What is your take on "The Young Turks?"

 

[ABQTom]

Curtis Sliwa
Don Imus
John Gambling
Rush Limbaugh
Sean Hannity
Mark Levin
Bob Grant
Laura Ingraham

The best group ever assembled?

Hey Phil,

HOW ABOUT adding a LIBERAL to morning or afternoon drive, to increase your cume? Perhaps someone who NYC already knows and loves, like Jay Diamond or Randi Rhodes. Then watch your ratings soar.

The lack of a local liberal is is the greatest weakness on "all-conservative stations." The programming appeals mostly to one side of the spectrum. That eliminates thousands of potential listeners including women and educated single professionals 18-44. Just one liberal on a conservative station in a key daypart can increase the cume. New advertisers for the "hip" generation 18-44 will come on board.

 

[ABQTom]

FYI guys all radio stations are targeting a niche audience... the conservative niche at this time is bigger and more successful. Because you are targeting a niche you superserve that niche, the people who like Rush will not like Rhodes.

What you say is not the perspective of all programmers. Look at the mix of ideologies on big stations like KGO in San Francisco, KIRO in Seattle, KFI in Los Angeles, the new 540/1260 KGIL in L.A./San Diego, KGOE/Eureka. All these stations get good ratings (540 is a simulcast as of a few weeks ago of KGIL).
As for Rush and Rhodes on the same station, you might be right. Rhodes did begin on a conservative station in Miami, WJNO, didn't she? I'm not sure.