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NETWORK RERUNS ALREADY / FOX AT 10 PM / WHAT HAPPENED TO SPECIALS

gregg75 said:
I think Fox giving up or moving their 10 PM news makes a lot more sense than NBC putting Leno
on at 10 PM.
Click to expand...
Or less.
Fox is simply part of a larger enterprise, and the bottom line is what matters. That bottom line is well served with the revenue generated by the established 10 pm newscasts. Whether or not Fox began that model as a result of trying to avoid some arcane definition of “network” that nobody outside of the FCC and a few geeks care about, because the then-new affiliates already had 10 pm programming they weren’t willing to clear for this new venture or some combination (of those and other considerations) is irrelevant.

gregg75 said:
Hey, at least NBC took a chance, which is more than most. Those are the kind of risks that will eventually pay off for somebody.
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And how is duplicating what’s already showing signs of strain on the other networks the kind of risk that makes sense? NBC’s risk can be viewed as, if nothing else, motivated by an acceptance of reality. Perhaps a bit too soon, perhaps just not the right execution, perhaps both, or perhaps simply that the 10 pm hour will at some point be a piece of real estate that isn’t economically viable for them in any form. That remains to be seen.

gregg75 said:
All cartoons on Sunday has paid off for Fox. That was a risk they took which could have turned out very differently. All crime and drama has worked for CBS, but can they keep it up? Somethings gotta give.
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Every programming decision carries some measure of risk. Striking out in a new direction or returning to the well that’s driven your success a few too many times. “Something’s gotta give” because it always does. And then they’ll try new risks, and measure the upside vs the downside, and take their best shot. As before, some of those risks will pay off, some…not so much.
gregg75 said:
How does Fox know shows will not work at 10, WHEN THEY'VE NEVER TRIED IT? I will only watch the 10 PM news when there is absolutely nothing else on.
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That’s you. And anecdotal examples are irrelevant. The business is about the big picture, and that is best served at this point by collecting the revenue the stations get from their newscasts as, generally, the leaders in offering counterprogramming at that time, not a sliver of an hour that’s showing signs of fading away for the three broadcasters programming it now.

gregg75 said:
I still think the other networks would have a mild heart attack if Fox moved into the 10 PM slot and became a true competitive network.
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They have their own worries right now in the 10 pm hour, and they already know the reality that Fox is a very competitive network. When you have the number one show for several seasons running now, one that dominates its time period even when its peak has come and gone, you’re as real a competitor as there is.
 
gregg75 said:
You need some CHILL PILLS. Doesn't take much to get your DEBATE skills in high gear.
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Imhomerjay may need decaf, but he's not wrong. I rarely watch news at 10:00, and you may not watch it either, but it's very popular in many markets, including San Francisco and LA.

In the 90s in the Bay Area, the NBC and CBS affiliates switched to early prime (7:00 - 10:00) so they could compete head-to-head with the Fox (KTVU) affiliate's hugely popular 10 O'Clock News. It didn't work. KTVU's news was so popular that it kept its lead, and the other 2 went back to regular prime-time after a couple of years. In the Bay Area, 10:00 News is a decades-long franchise, immensely popular, and (I assume) very profitable.
 
Unfortunately the news heads have hijacked this thread.

I'm not saying that news at 10 PM is not popular or profitable.

Back to the original post, I'm saying that it's time Fox became a TRUE
NETWORK and moved beyond 10 PM. Affilates would have a choice as
to show those programs or continue with their news. Chicago, Atlanta,
San Francisco, etc. can keep news if they want.

But, Valdosta GA, Tallahassee FL, Boise ID, Fargo ND, etc. may wish
to take Fox up on such a bold move and run with it. It might put Fox
10 PM at the CW or ION level (yes, I know CW is not on at 10PM),
but it works for those networks and it would work for Fox as well.
 
P.S.

Perhaps the CW stations or other independents in Chicago, Atlanta, San Francisco, etc.
might decide to accept the Fox 10 PM programs that the "NEWS" stations aren't interested in.
 
So it hinges on quibbling over an arcane definition of a "network?"

Viewers don't care. Do you seriously think anyone thinks about such things outside of little communities like this?

They're a business, that happens to be providing programming to a network of affiliates. Whether the FCC says it's an official network or not...meaningless. And as a business, their job is to try to do what looks like the best thing for the bottom line (balancing short and long term issues). Whether the programming at 10 on Fox stations is news or Benny Hill reruns is likewise irrelevant. It brings in good money, and makes the most sense for their business needs. And they would dump out of that because someone--who on one hand rightly points out that it's not the 1980s anymore (and that nothing lasts forever) but on the other hand advocates moving away from a more financially logical business model to one that has little to no probability of actually doing better simply because it's the way the "other" guys have historically operated--has an obession over whether they run 2 hours most nights instead of 3?
 
It is not just the large markets. A lot of medium and even small market Fox affiliates make cash out of that 10 PM newscast. Even if they don't mount an effort of their own, they can have the cast produced by a sister station (i.e. "First News at Ten" on Fox Youngstown / WYFX-LP 62/WKBN 27.2) or even hire out another station's news production (i.e. Roanoke's WFXR/27-WWCW/21 "Fox 21 and 27 10 O'Clock News", which is produced by non-co-owned WSLS/10 NBC).

You're under the mistaken impression that only the big market Fox O&Os make money off the 10 PM news.

Fox is widely considered a major network today, and has the biggest audiences in TV with shows like "American Idol" and the lucrative NFL/NFC contract. Not programming at 10 PM doesn't turn them into ION.
 
Someone else gets it. :D

No question the news at 10 (9) has spread to small and medium market affiliates, but the Fox O&Os are larger stations, and those are the ones contributing to the same News Corp. bottom line. The rest contribute to their respective owners' bottom lines of course, and they'd have plenty of reason to object to a misguided foray that would do nothing but harm them.
 
gregg75 said:
P.S.

Perhaps the CW stations or other independents in Chicago, Atlanta, San Francisco, etc.
might decide to accept the Fox 10 PM programs that the "NEWS" stations aren't interested in.
Click to expand...

So Fox would be spending a lot of money developing shows that wouldn't be cleared by many of the affiliates, including some in major markets. Yes - they could be shifted to other stations. For example, KTVU in the Bay Area also operates independent KICU, so they could shift the 10:00 shows to their other station. But I would think that would lead to viewer confusion, and lower ratings for those shows.
 
Could care less about if Fox is a "network" or not. Sure it is a network (or 3/4 of one). I'm talking about developing programs to run at 10 PM.They are missing an opportunity. They would have more to gain than lose by expanding.

Is it a true grade school if it only goes to the 4th grade?
Is it a true car if it only has 3 wheels?
Is it a true bathing suite if it only has a bottom?
Is it a true network if it signs off at 10PM? Go ask NBC, CBS, ABC, and a large number of cable networks...........

"Fox is not a "true" network, it's an ongoing experiment that signs off at 10 PM"

THE END
 
The expression "my mind's made up, don't confuse me with the facts" seems entirely fitting.
 
gregg75 said:
PICK YOUR TOPIC(S)

RERUNS: We're only about 5 weeks into the new season and the networks are already rerunning some NEW shows. Is this due to lack of programs or a "they'll watch anything" mentality?
I honestly believe broadcast networks are in trouble as cable continues to take viewers away. Are they just following the cable networks which show the same show 7 times in a week or more???
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CBS has NOT SHOWN ANY RERUNS at all this year. I have been DVRing NCIS, NCIS:Loas Angeles, CSI, Two and Half Men and The Big Bang Theory each week since the current Season began and CBS has not shown one RePeat episode so far this season. I'm not sure about the other networks. This time last year, CBS had already shown several repeat episodes of the previously mentioned series, even repeating the Pilot epsiode of NCIS:Los Angeles just a couple of weeks after the searies premire.
 
"Fox is not a "true" network, it's an ongoing experiment that signs off at 10 PM"

Is this really a debate to have in the year 2010? Perhaps in 1989. But the entire network model is challenged, and will likely be dramatically altered in the coming years. In case you haven't noticed, the networks are programming fewer original hours, not more. ABC, NBC and CBS have dropped original programming on Saturday nights -- which, under your outdated way of thinking, makes them "lesser" networks as well.

You're not going to see the networks programming any more hours -- they can't afford it. They'll be programming less. Trust me, the original Big 3 are envious of Fox's 15-hour schedule; fewer hours to program means fewer costs and fewer holes. You'll be seeing more networks reducing their hours within the decade.
 
gregg75 said:
Could care less about if Fox is a "network" or not.
(snip)
"Fox is not a "true" network, it's an ongoing experiment that signs off at 10 PM"
Click to expand...

You're contradicting yourself inside of one message. "The end" indeed.
 
gregg75 said:
Back to the original post, I'm saying that it's time Fox became a TRUE
NETWORK and moved beyond 10 PM. Affilates would have a choice as
to show those programs or continue with their news. Chicago, Atlanta,
San Francisco, etc. can keep news if they want.

But, Valdosta GA, Tallahassee FL, Boise ID, Fargo ND, etc. may wish
to take Fox up on such a bold move and run with it.
Click to expand...

This has to be one of the dumbest ideas I have seen in a while. Valdosta and Fargo are the other smaller markets where Fox stations don't have viable (and profitable) 10 PM (9 PM Central/Mountain) newscasts just don't have enough households to make this profitable.

So you seem to be suggesting that Fox should develop seven hours of programming simply because it's the definition of a "real network" to you -- even though those seven hours wouldn't be cleared by the Fox stations that reach a majority of the population?
 
gregg75 said:
Back to the original post, I'm saying that it's time Fox became a TRUE
NETWORK and moved beyond 10 PM. Affilates would have a choice as
to show those programs or continue with their news. Chicago, Atlanta,
San Francisco, etc. can keep news if they want.
Click to expand...

Would Fox O&Os and affils. have the option to program non-news shows at 10/9, if you have your way, gregg?

ixnay
 
Lots of people get up earlier for work and like than 10pm newscast. There are 800 other channels not carrying news at 10pm.
Specials just aren't the same since the plate spinners retired.
 
Fox does have the FX cable network, which airs original programming after 10 PM. Usually more mature programming that wouldn't be suitable for the broadcast Fox.

But like others said, there's no incentive for Fox itself to program the 10 PM hour since many affiliates have profitable newscasts at that hour, plus less programming hours = reduced costs for the network.
 
gregg75 said:
I think Fox giving up or moving their 10 PM news makes a lot more sense than NBC putting Leno
on at 10 PM. Hey, at least NBC took a chance, which is more than most. Those are the kind of
risks that will eventually pay off for somebody.

All cartoons on Sunday has paid off for Fox. That was a risk they took which could have turned out very differently. All crime and drama has worked for CBS, but can they keep it up? Somethings gotta give.
Click to expand...
Which is "Amazing Race"?

"Undercover Boss" occasionally exposes crime, but still ...
 
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