New Rock 94.7 anyone? New Rock 99.5? Return of Rock to NYC Main FM Airwaves on HD-1?
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New Rock Reincarnated into 94.7?/Return of Rock to NYC?
- Thread starter XCountry285
- Start date
And don't even think of trying a hybrid Rock and Country or some kind of dayparted format 
It might work in a small market like #224 (where there'd be more likely to be a limited number of stations), but not in market #1 (Might Cumulus try a Country format with entertainment/country news mixed in, like Buz'n 102.9 in Minneapolis? It's actually doing pretty well)
It might work in a small market like #224 (where there'd be more likely to be a limited number of stations), but not in market #1 (Might Cumulus try a Country format with entertainment/country news mixed in, like Buz'n 102.9 in Minneapolis? It's actually doing pretty well)
K
KC2LDY
Guest
Mike said:
To be honest... I suspect 94.7 is going to be WABC-FM. You see how both all-sports stations have moved to FM. Of course, this has to do with all kinds of coroorate strategy and market positioning. But it's also the vanguard of a wholesale abandonment of AM by mainstream radio - even for spoken-word formats. No, it's not going to play out overnight. We have Clear Channel buying WOR, for example. But 10 years from now, we are likely to look back on 2012 as the beginning of the end for the Stardard Broadcast Band. Look for it to be occupied almost exclusively by religious, brokered-time and ethnic broadcasters.
Steve
KC2LDY
It's going to be a 105.5 and 94.7 country superstation since 94.7 is to get the WDVY call letters!!!!
If 94.7 was a full Empire B I would say it's WABC-FM easily. The fact it's not, and yet a full 50kw AM station makes it an odd choice given the coverage gap between the two. However I would say at this point it's the odds on favorite for a simulcast. Modern Rock would probably be my distant second bet. I would put country at slim to none. I have a lot of respect for the passion of country fans in NY, and there are many of you. While all the stars seem to align, (not a true NYC signal, Cumulus and Country, Cumulus nearby running country..) Unfortunately there's just far too strong a cloud cover to seem them - the strong media bias against the format here. Is it logical? Probably not, but it's real and pervasive. No one drops big money on a transmitter to try a format that can't bill. Given there's clauses about $$ and moving it down the line, it also shows their long term intentions and it's not a favor for country.
It could also just go Christmas for the next month and a half, if it does it probably nixes the simulcast plan and it's something else. Who knows.
It could also just go Christmas for the next month and a half, if it does it probably nixes the simulcast plan and it's something else. Who knows.
New Rock 101.9 has a message on their website that it's still streaming. I notice the playlist has strayed from the usual Q87.7/Chicago programming. The new New Rock 101.9 isn't that great. They've added active rock tracks. Yikes. Anyhow, who's programming it and why? Pure speculation, but could they be keeping it alive to sell the intellectual property? Perhaps to Cumulus...
I have also noticed that WWSK/Smithtown (94.3 The Shark) has shifted their playlist to much more alternative-leaning rock. Probably a good move. It actually sounds similar to the latest FM incarnation of RXP (until Def Leppard shows up randomly... ha!)
K
KC2LDY
Guest
ansky212 said:
Of course, I have no idea what Cumulus is thinking, but they could be convinced many people won't even sample WABC because it's not on FM. Add to that the simple fact that reception conditions continue to deteriorate for AM stations - even those with 50 kw signals. This has to factor into the Fan's decision to simulcast on FM - because the ratings are still fine for the signal on 660 khz. They're hedging for the future: They'll have FM for a clear in-market signal inside of buildings; AM for a good out-of-market signal and in cars everywhere.
Steve
KC2LDY
M
Marckd
Guest
According to Sniffin - Country on 94.7 is slim to none. He would probably say no more than 5 % chance - MY GUESS. He insists Country is IMPOSSIBLE to sell properly in New York City and its not just ratings issues. I agree with him that at one time this WAS true. It Was true back in 1996, 2000, 2002, 2005.
But it MIGHT not be true anymore. Its been 17 years almost since we had a major player on FM doing Country. Then for another 5 and a half years we had a suburban group of stations simulcasting a Country format. That ended for multiple reasons. Historically Country did not sell well in Manhattan. WJRZ in the 60's had mediocre ratings at best on 970 and in 1971 they went Top 40 and then religious in 74. Then in 1973 1050 WHN dropped their easy listening leaning MOR format for country. That struggled for a year or so until they modified it into a Country/AC hybrid format - half country friendly pop and half country with crossover material more than half the time. That did pretty well. Then in 1980, WRVR 106.7 drops Jazz for Country becoming WKHK. They pull the lower end of mediocre ratings and WHN also goes down as well. WKHK drops out early in 1984 to become Lite FM 106.7 WLTW. WHN by then is running Sports in the evening but still leaning pop when playing country. Their ratings are decent but they also are not selling the format well. When Emmis bought WHN's parent company they held on to country during the day but put more sports on at night in 1986. Then they announced in April 87 that WHN would become WFAN and all Sports July 1. The same day ratings troubled AC station WYNY 97.1 went country - with less pop than WHN played. Ratings were okay. Due to the fact Emmis bought NBC's radio frequencies, Westwood One bought 103.5 and moved the WYNY Country Unit there in 1988.
On 103.5, the station lacked marketing and promotions. Plus there were rumors that Westwood One wanted to eventually dump Country. From 1989 to 1991, WYNY did okay in ratings but still sold as well as stations with half their ratings. Promotions and marketing lacked as well. Then in 1991, WYNY sold to another company who stated they were committed to keeping WYNY Country but instead they continued to cut costs. They were preparing the station to be spun off eventually. Then in the Fall of 1994, Broadcast Partners put WYNY on the block and found a taker in early 1995, Evergreen. Evergreen would not comit to country either way but rumors of the format's demise were rampant. WYNY even allowed Dan Daniel to do a shift on CBS FM for radio Greats Weekend in 1995, knowing that WYNY would not be around much longer. In January of 1996, Evergreen announced that when the sale of WYNY becomes final, Country would be gone. 6 AM February 5, Country WYNY was no more. Then from December of 96 to May of 2002 we had the Y 107 Triplecast eventually becoming a Quadcast. That did some ratings in suburbs but not even mediocre in New York City.
Now today I think there is a 25 % to 33 % chance that 94.7 will be country. WHY??? Well most of the sales people and managers that were around in 1996 and even 2002, are no longer working in the NYC market or even radio at all. Also almost half the advertisers around in 1996 are no longer in business - either closing down or being sold or merged with other companies. Also Cumulus was not in New York City back then. So their broadcasting phillosophy is likely different from CBS or Clear Channel. Cumulus also owns a country music station in most of their markets.
Another thing is that 94.7 will not have to just rely on New York City sales. Their signal in Manhattan is as good as the rest but leans slightly to the west, this gives them an edge in North Jersey. There are tons of Northern NJ businesses that would buy sales time on 94.7. Also most of the country listeners are from northern NJ and few are from Manhattan. Another reason I think Country is possible is because you have WDHA 105.5 doing rock and for them to do rock they would have a serious competitor with WDHA.
I also think Rock is about a 33 % chance. Though WDHA has a strong following, 94.7 could try going after WDHA. Another thing is maybe they could buy WDHA's intellectual unit and move it to 94.7. Then Greater Media could do Country on 105.5 while WDHA moves to the stronger 94.7.
Talk I believe also has a 33 % chance of going to 94.7. Slim to no chance of oldies. With Citadel??? Maybe but Cumulus has a history of dumping oldies. Most of they time the changes are sudden and abrupt. But up in Hudson Valley they began evolving 97.7 WCZX/97.3 WZAD from Oldies 1955-1974 to Oldies 1955-89 to Oldies 1964 to 1989 to pop leaning classic Hits 1964 to 1994 to Gold Based AC leaning 70's and 80's but spanning from 1964 to then current product to a Straight but deep AC format by the fall of 2004. They did acquire a Class A FM station on 94.3 they put oldies 1955 to 1972 on in january of 2003 but that lasted till that September when they made 94.3 Country Music. They eventually added 97.3 to the simulcast of 94.3 making only 97.7 the AC station. They compete with Country there regardless of the fact 107.3 WRWD is doing far better with Country. So in the Hudson Valley we have 2 country stations.
But it MIGHT not be true anymore. Its been 17 years almost since we had a major player on FM doing Country. Then for another 5 and a half years we had a suburban group of stations simulcasting a Country format. That ended for multiple reasons. Historically Country did not sell well in Manhattan. WJRZ in the 60's had mediocre ratings at best on 970 and in 1971 they went Top 40 and then religious in 74. Then in 1973 1050 WHN dropped their easy listening leaning MOR format for country. That struggled for a year or so until they modified it into a Country/AC hybrid format - half country friendly pop and half country with crossover material more than half the time. That did pretty well. Then in 1980, WRVR 106.7 drops Jazz for Country becoming WKHK. They pull the lower end of mediocre ratings and WHN also goes down as well. WKHK drops out early in 1984 to become Lite FM 106.7 WLTW. WHN by then is running Sports in the evening but still leaning pop when playing country. Their ratings are decent but they also are not selling the format well. When Emmis bought WHN's parent company they held on to country during the day but put more sports on at night in 1986. Then they announced in April 87 that WHN would become WFAN and all Sports July 1. The same day ratings troubled AC station WYNY 97.1 went country - with less pop than WHN played. Ratings were okay. Due to the fact Emmis bought NBC's radio frequencies, Westwood One bought 103.5 and moved the WYNY Country Unit there in 1988.
On 103.5, the station lacked marketing and promotions. Plus there were rumors that Westwood One wanted to eventually dump Country. From 1989 to 1991, WYNY did okay in ratings but still sold as well as stations with half their ratings. Promotions and marketing lacked as well. Then in 1991, WYNY sold to another company who stated they were committed to keeping WYNY Country but instead they continued to cut costs. They were preparing the station to be spun off eventually. Then in the Fall of 1994, Broadcast Partners put WYNY on the block and found a taker in early 1995, Evergreen. Evergreen would not comit to country either way but rumors of the format's demise were rampant. WYNY even allowed Dan Daniel to do a shift on CBS FM for radio Greats Weekend in 1995, knowing that WYNY would not be around much longer. In January of 1996, Evergreen announced that when the sale of WYNY becomes final, Country would be gone. 6 AM February 5, Country WYNY was no more. Then from December of 96 to May of 2002 we had the Y 107 Triplecast eventually becoming a Quadcast. That did some ratings in suburbs but not even mediocre in New York City.
Now today I think there is a 25 % to 33 % chance that 94.7 will be country. WHY??? Well most of the sales people and managers that were around in 1996 and even 2002, are no longer working in the NYC market or even radio at all. Also almost half the advertisers around in 1996 are no longer in business - either closing down or being sold or merged with other companies. Also Cumulus was not in New York City back then. So their broadcasting phillosophy is likely different from CBS or Clear Channel. Cumulus also owns a country music station in most of their markets.
Another thing is that 94.7 will not have to just rely on New York City sales. Their signal in Manhattan is as good as the rest but leans slightly to the west, this gives them an edge in North Jersey. There are tons of Northern NJ businesses that would buy sales time on 94.7. Also most of the country listeners are from northern NJ and few are from Manhattan. Another reason I think Country is possible is because you have WDHA 105.5 doing rock and for them to do rock they would have a serious competitor with WDHA.
I also think Rock is about a 33 % chance. Though WDHA has a strong following, 94.7 could try going after WDHA. Another thing is maybe they could buy WDHA's intellectual unit and move it to 94.7. Then Greater Media could do Country on 105.5 while WDHA moves to the stronger 94.7.
Talk I believe also has a 33 % chance of going to 94.7. Slim to no chance of oldies. With Citadel??? Maybe but Cumulus has a history of dumping oldies. Most of they time the changes are sudden and abrupt. But up in Hudson Valley they began evolving 97.7 WCZX/97.3 WZAD from Oldies 1955-1974 to Oldies 1955-89 to Oldies 1964 to 1989 to pop leaning classic Hits 1964 to 1994 to Gold Based AC leaning 70's and 80's but spanning from 1964 to then current product to a Straight but deep AC format by the fall of 2004. They did acquire a Class A FM station on 94.3 they put oldies 1955 to 1972 on in january of 2003 but that lasted till that September when they made 94.3 Country Music. They eventually added 97.3 to the simulcast of 94.3 making only 97.7 the AC station. They compete with Country there regardless of the fact 107.3 WRWD is doing far better with Country. So in the Hudson Valley we have 2 country stations.
M
Marckd
Guest
I got percentages from formats that are out there and may have a shot on 94.7. I really think the new 94.7 FM will be either rock or country. Allan Sniffin almost INSISTS it WONT be Country and he appears to be betting on a talk format of some sort though he distances himself from saying exactly what. He mentioned maybe a simulcast of WABC. He to this day says the perceptions of Country have not changed. People try to convince him New York should have a Country station. His response is "I am not the one you have to coinvince of this". He is not anti-country but based on who he knows he feels that New York has little if any shot of getting a country station in our lifetimes.
I even observed one thing - every time a station was in trouble they went out of their way NOT to go country. When Q 104 was about to drop rock for classic rock they considered country and turned it down. 105.1 when dropping Mix opted for Modern Rock AC then AC then Hot AC then Jammin Oldies then R & B Oldies then young R & B. 102.7 even in their desperate ratings and money losing situation turned down country. Country would have been their easy way out. But they turned it down for their failed Blink format - again for an AC format which they evolved to rhythmic adult - and again for a semi hot AC format. K Rock turned it down for Talk which failed and again for K Rock 2: The Sequel and again for Rhythmic Top 40. 101.9 also turned Country down for rock and then for news and then for rock again and now became WFAN FM (which was something CBS bought the station specifically for). So every time a radio station is in trouble or desperate - THEY TURN DOWN COUNTRY MUSIC. In several siutuations - I feel it would have been the best move (102.7 and 92.3 for example). Based on that I do not think Country will happen - But at the same time we only had Cumulus in the market for a short time and they are the newcomers. Newcomers often will do something that others would not have dared to do - This is why I think country is at least possible. I believe they are at least considering it - not necessarily carrying out but at least toying with the idea. I also think they are considering the WRXP intellectual unit as well as maybe New Yorks Best Rock format.
I even observed one thing - every time a station was in trouble they went out of their way NOT to go country. When Q 104 was about to drop rock for classic rock they considered country and turned it down. 105.1 when dropping Mix opted for Modern Rock AC then AC then Hot AC then Jammin Oldies then R & B Oldies then young R & B. 102.7 even in their desperate ratings and money losing situation turned down country. Country would have been their easy way out. But they turned it down for their failed Blink format - again for an AC format which they evolved to rhythmic adult - and again for a semi hot AC format. K Rock turned it down for Talk which failed and again for K Rock 2: The Sequel and again for Rhythmic Top 40. 101.9 also turned Country down for rock and then for news and then for rock again and now became WFAN FM (which was something CBS bought the station specifically for). So every time a radio station is in trouble or desperate - THEY TURN DOWN COUNTRY MUSIC. In several siutuations - I feel it would have been the best move (102.7 and 92.3 for example). Based on that I do not think Country will happen - But at the same time we only had Cumulus in the market for a short time and they are the newcomers. Newcomers often will do something that others would not have dared to do - This is why I think country is at least possible. I believe they are at least considering it - not necessarily carrying out but at least toying with the idea. I also think they are considering the WRXP intellectual unit as well as maybe New Yorks Best Rock format.
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