PIONEERS OF TELEVISION 2.0 STARTS TONIGHT

[FreddyE1977]

I found it interesting how they sort of took a victory lap about KILLING
local kids shows (through the ACT stuff, too much commercialism, etc.)
and then went on to wax nostalgic about them.

Sort of how they'll be waxing nostalgic about the Big Mac in the future after
Michelle Obama gets her way and it becomes illegal to serve anything but a
salt free burger under 4 oz.

 

[ricksegers]

I find it interesting that ACT thought it was wrong for the host to advertise products and that led to the death of local kids shows to be replaced with Power Rangers, Transformers etc which were nothing but infomercials for toys.

 

[Kelly Watts]

i wated the PBS local Kids Show presentation and thought for the mos part it was pretty good. The key word was LOCAL. To be sure there were HUNDREDS of local TV Kids Shows, some better than otehrs. It was nice to see some familier faces again.

 

[desertv]

For those who wonder about "Wallace & Ladmo"

http://www.wallacewatchers.com/index.html

 

[Tim L]

For those who wonder about "Wallace & Ladmo"

http://www.wallacewatchers.com/index.html

Just went over some of that website..Awesome stuff there..Puts me in mind of The Old Hoolihan and Big Chuck/Big Chuck and Little John Show on WJW-TV 8 Cleveland from 1966-2007..While that was a Movie show on once a week, there were over 2,000 skits produced by the cast, headed by "Big Chuck" Schodowski..With Characters like Certain Ethnic, Kielbasy Kid, Soulman, "Robert" in the "Readings By Robert" skits, Ben Crazy, Cuyahoga Jones, Batguy and Rinaldi, and other one-shot characters..I am actually now lookinmg forward to seeing the "Kids Show" segment of Pioneers of Television.

 

[flashback]

i wonder if they will do a horror hosts episode.

 

[Corky Marlowe]

i wonder if they will do a horror hosts episode.

Doubtful, but it would be cool...Ghoulardi, Zacherle, Elvira, and probably a bunch more I've never heard of.

 

[mleach]

i wonder if they will do a horror hosts episode.

Already been done..well somewhat. Here is a DVD available about the number of horror hosts who had graced the airwaves in Virginia.

http://virginiacreepersmovie.com/

I wouldn't be surprised if there is something similar that was done for other areas. Last year I was told there is a DVD in the works on the history of Colorado TV including horror and kids show hosts and even Denver news icons such as Bob Palmer and Ward Lucas but as of yet..heard nothing new.

 

[flashback]

i wonder if they will do a horror hosts episode.

Doubtful, but it would be cool...Ghoulardi, Zacherle, Elvira, and probably a bunch more I've never heard of.

and vampira who was the first one.

 

[mleach]

I found it interesting how they sort of took a victory lap about KILLING
local kids shows (through the ACT stuff, too much commercialism, etc.)
and then went on to wax nostalgic about them.

There is still debate to this day as to how much of a role did the ACT had in getting so many of those local kids shows off the air. No doubt they had a role but how much? Were stations still making money with such programming in 1974? Did the stations fear the ACT and to "play safe" and went ahead and cancelled those shows anyway? If the ACT were the reason then why and how did Wallace & Ladmo out of Phoenix and Denver's Blinky, Baltimore's Captain Chesapeake, not too mention Chicago's Bozo The Clown had managed to had stayed on the air well into the 80's? Why were those shows exempted?

Lot o'questions..may be hard to find answers.

 

[landtuna]

If the ACT were the reason then why and how did Wallace & Ladmo out of Phoenix and Denver's Blinky, Baltimore's Captain Chesapeake, not too mention Chicago's Bozo The Clown had managed to had stayed on the air well into the 80's? Why were those shows exempted?

I'll take a crack at W&L....

The early days of W&L were 100% a children's show and fairly typical of kids shows in general. Around 1960 a fellow named Pat McMahon joined the troop and added some characters that didn't play exclusively to kids. The humor expanded so that mom's, especially, enjoyed watching the show with their kids. The humor was always clean although frequently it was obviously intended for the viewing adults. This continued until the show went off the air in the very late 80's.

In addition, W&L did constant appearances and received publicity from virtually every other media outlet in town, including the opposition. The staff even created a band "Hub Cap and the Wheels" that parodied rock and roll music with actual concerts. They became a beloved Phoenix metro icon and I imagine there are still thousands of treasured "Ladmo Bags" stored in closets all over the nation to this day.

 

[Tim L]

Just watched The Kid Show segment-Really was pretty good..One clip was shown from the Cleveland Romper Room (WEWS) with Ms. Barbara Plummer, but was uncredited at the end, unless they got the clip from Claster Productions..Seeing Wallace and Ladmo for the first time, I have to say they were very funny..

 

[Kelly Watts]

I think most every TV station had their own "Local Ghoul." They were about as prevelent as the Atlantic Weatherman dressd up in his snappy uniform. One of my favorites was in the Scranton/Wilkes Barre market Uncle Ted. Of course there is allways ELVIRA!

 

[TheBigA]

There is still debate to this day as to how much of a role did the ACT had in getting so many of those local kids shows off the air.

I think the connection between ACT and the end of local kids TV was a bit overstated. What killed local kids TV was the cost of doing local TV, and the increased availability in much cheaper network and syndicated content. Certainly, banning the hosts from doing paid endorsements hurt profitability, but not completely. Let's face it: Disney has made billions selling stuff to kids without having Cinderella or Micky Mouse actually doing the selling. So it was a combination of factors. Shows like Romper Room found a way to continue to market their toys without having them sold by the teachers, and the show continued to air in the US into the 1980s. But let's face it: Local TV is expensive to do. Very staff intensive. And a network affiliate was able to just run game shows or reruns for a lot less money.

One side aspect of this was the movement of local kids shows from network affiliates to independent stations. So we saw Willard Scott, who was Bozo on the NBC affiliate, lose his job in the 60s when the station dropped local kids shows. The competing independent station, WTTG, had Wonderama, and that continued into the 70s. Wallace and Ladmo started at KPHO when it was an independent station. Lots of other local kids shows were on independent stations that desperately needed programming to fill up their day.

Ironically, while this Pioneers show did a great job talking about the early days of local kids TV, it almost completely ignored Phase 2. That began in 1969 with all the PBS shows like Sesame Street, just as a lot of the smaller local commercial shows were fading away. And even though children's shows on PBS didn't advertise products, it became a huge money-maker for them as kids and parents instinctively demanded products from those shows.

 

[Tim from Springfield IL]

I find it interesting that ACT thought it was wrong for the host to advertise products and that led to the death of local kids shows to be replaced with Power Rangers, Transformers etc which were nothing but infomercials for toys.

I agree--but actually I think it was more like the toy line coming out first (as in the forementioned examples plus Pokemon, Wuzzles, Smurfs, Strawberry Shortcake, Care Bears, etc.)--then the idea for a cartoon series related to the toys is launched. Also this was the case in the '80s for some of the latest movies and kid-oriented sitcoms of the time ("Teen Wolf," "Punky Brewster," "ALF," etc.--as well as "Hulk Hogan's Rock n' Wrestling").

Also wanted to throw this out that I have wondered about in the past. Considering all the cartoon series tie-ins to toys, movies, sitcoms, etc. in the '80s I am surprised that no one decided to launch a Saturday morning cartoon series on CBS based on a game show: "Press Your Luck" and their Whammies. That would have been interesting and awesome. ;D ;D

 

[FreddyE1977]

Ironically, while this Pioneers show did a great job talking about the early days of local kids TV, it almost completely ignored Phase 2. That began in 1969 with all the PBS shows like Sesame Street, just as a lot of the smaller local commercial shows were fading away. And even though children's shows on PBS didn't advertise products, it became a huge money-maker for them as kids and parents instinctively demanded products from those shows.

In reality the Childrens Television Workshop kept all proceeds from the licensing of Sesame Street products.
PBS quite stupidly did not cut themselves in for a piece. THey have never gotten a dime from all of that
Big Bird and Ernie merchandise you see in the stores. That would have been the equivalent of a heck of a
lot of pledge drives.

Likely this was due to their deep-seated hostility to the profit motive. They were of like mind with the people
at ACT. So ACT manages to kneecap kids shows on commercial stations and then PBS magically appears with
Sesame Street, The Electric Company, etc. Just after Fred Rogers goes to Capitol Hill and secures their funding.

Not claiming cause and effect mind you, I'm just saying.

 

[TheBigA]

So ACT manages to kneecap kids shows on commercial stations and then PBS magically appears with
Sesame Street, The Electric Company, etc. Just after Fred Rogers goes to Capitol Hill and secures their funding.

Not claiming cause and effect mind you, I'm just saying.

If that's what you're saying, then it's wrong. If what ACT did "kneecapped kids shows," then perhaps the motivations of those shows were misplaced to begin with. And the fact is that those rules didn't kill kids shows at all. In fact if anything, there's more commercial kids TV today than ever.

PBS didn't exist as a network until 1970. As the Pioneers show pionted out, Jim Henson did a local kids show on a commercial station in Washington, but it had long since been cancelled when the ACT rules came around and PBS was formed.

The licensing money for products has almost completely funded the production of Sesame Street. It doesn't get taxpayer funding for show production. Perhaps stations get funding for broadcast, but CTW operates from licensing money. That saves PBS a lot, and also allows it to obtain grants in this area without competing against CTW.

 

[desertv]

Don't forget that cable channels like Nickelodeon and Disney Channel did a lot to end the local kiddie shows also.

In the case of Wallace & Ladmo's longevity, Cable was almost nonexistant in Phoenix until the mid-late 80s, thus little competition.

 

[landtuna]

In the case of Wallace & Ladmo's longevity, Cable was almost nonexistant in Phoenix until the mid-late 80s, thus little competition.

I lived in extreme NW Phoenix at the time and AFAIK we were one of the last areas to get cable. We were wired in 1981.

I think W&L's longevity had more to do with the fact that parents saw it as an institution that many of them had grown up watching and so they introduced it to their own children. Two, and sometimes, three generations of a family could have watched the entire lifespan of the show.

 

[Tim from Springfield IL]

Earlier this evening I just caught the tail end of a promo for next Tuesday's "Pioneers" installment: Late Night hosts (with the part of the promo I saw consisting of a classic Tonight Show Carnac the Magnificent skit).