Regionally syndicated sports in teamless markets?

[Ultimajock]

...I've been wondering a bit about the following set of circumstances. In Wisconsin, between the departure of the Milwaukee Braves to Atlanta in 1966 and the arrival of the Milwaukee Brewers from Seattle in 1970, several stations carried the baseball games of surrounding cities -- WFRV/5 Green Bay carried the Chicago Cubs (into the first couple of years of the Brewers' existence, in fact); WVTV/18 Milwaukee, WKOW-TV/27 Madison and WAOW/9 Wausau carried the Chicago White Sox; and WEAU-TV/13 Eau Claire (as well as WKOW and WAOW, IIRC) picked up the Minnesota Twins games. I'm curious, in other areas where expansion or moving teams for various sports were placed or one team moved a few years before the current team arrived, who got the local territorial claim to be the "offical" team for that town? Between the Cardinals and the Rams, was St. Louis defaulted to the Chiefs? In 1968, after the Athletics left for Oakland but before the Royals were created, was Kansas City a St. Louis Cardinals town? Prior to the Football Cardinals arriving in Phoenix, did Arizona take the Chargers, Broncos or Cowboys? After the Jazz left for Utah, did New Orleans get the Rockets or Hawks prior to the Hornets' arrival? You get the idea here, fill me in ;D ...

 

[Tim from Springfield IL]

Although I don't know of any specific examples on the TV side, I have heard that prior to the creation of the Colorado Rockies in 1993, that the radio network of the Kansas City Royals included many areas where the Rockies now have a fan base (e.g. Wyoming, the Dakotas, western Nebraska, and of course Colorado, etc.). Anyone know for sure if pre-Rockies Denver had a KC Royals radio or TV affiliate?

And in the case of the "Gridbirds" (the former St. Louis football Cardinals), after they left St. Louis in 1988 for Phoenix, I recall seeing an item during one Sunday's CBS football coverage that parts of Missouri (including St. Louis) still received regional coverage of the Cardinals on CBS. I don't know if that practice continued into 1989-94 (Rams arrived in '95), or if St. Louis and parts of Missouri started regularly receiving regional coverage of other NFC teams such as the Chicago Bears or Dallas Cowboys.

And also something related to this question that I've wondered about--although it's more of a radio question rather than TV--during the 1970s/early '80s heyday of the Dallas Cowboys and Pittsburgh Steelers, did those two NFL teams have wider radio network coverage (in addition to being the lead game on CBS/NBC) farther away from their home markets? In other words, did the Cowboys radio network once have affiliates deeper into the South (such as Tennessee, Alabama, etc. in spite of the Saints and Falcons) or even into the West and Midwest (I could see some stations in the likes of Nebraska, Iowa, Missouri or the Dakotas during the '70s consider picking up Cowboys games on the radio--or even preseason TV games. And what about pre-Cardinals Arizona--could they have been a Cowboys market or LA Rams/SF 49ers/San Diego Chargers instead)? What about the Steelers--did their radio network and following get any Southern following or in additional parts of the Northeast or Midwest during the "Steel Curtain's" heyday? Just curious.

 

[Cincinnati Kid]

Someone fron the New York City area should certainly be able to provide more specific information, but after the Giants & Dodgers left that city after the 1957 season, one of the New York TV stations carried Philadelphia Phillies games. As far as I remember, those were just picked up from the Phillies' TV. That started in 1958 and provided National League baseball to that city. Again, someone else from there from that time should be able to advise more about it.

 

[wbhist]

Someone fron the New York City area should certainly be able to provide more specific information, but after the Giants & Dodgers left that city after the 1957 season, one of the New York TV stations carried Philadelphia Phillies games. As far as I remember, those were just picked up from the Phillies' TV. That started in 1958 and provided National League baseball to that city. Again, someone else from there from that time should be able to advise more about it.

From my memory, that station was WOR-TV (Channel 9), up to 1961; this ended once the expansion New York Mets (whose TV home was WOR through 1998) played their first (disastrous) season in 1962. WOR had run Dodgers' games right up to that 1957 season; the Giants' games were on WPIX (Channel 11) where, prior to that year, that team shared station baseball coverage with the Yankees.

 

[Iowan]

In the Quad Cities, KGCW has carried the St. Louis Cardinals games since 2001. Personally, I'd like to see the Cubs telecast in the QC again...

 

[Mr. Mike]

Someone fron the New York City area should certainly be able to provide more specific information, but after the Giants & Dodgers left that city after the 1957 season, one of the New York TV stations carried Philadelphia Phillies games. As far as I remember, those were just picked up from the Phillies' TV. That started in 1958 and provided National League baseball to that city. Again, someone else from there from that time should be able to advise more about it.

From my memory, that station was WOR-TV (Channel 9), up to 1961; this ended once the expansion New York Mets (whose TV home was WOR through 1998) played their first (disastrous) season in 1962. WOR had run Dodgers' games right up to that 1957 season; the Giants' games were on WPIX (Channel 11) where, prior to that year, that team shared station baseball coverage with the Yankees.

Speaking of the Mets, here's an interesting fact. I know it sounds kind of hard to belive, but WOR-TV almost didn't become the flagship station for the Mets. Infact, were it not for a few quirks of fate, WNET Channel 13, then known as commercial independent WNTA-TV would've carried the inagural season of the New York Mets in 1962.

At the time, the owners of Newark, N.J.-based WNTA, with the encouragement of New Jersey officials, particuarly then-governor Robert Meyner, were trying to hold off an effort by an educational TV consortium to convert Channel 13 to non-commercial status. According to the station's Wikipedia entry, as a matter of fact, they had even acquired the rights to broadcast the first regular season games of the then-new New York Mets for the 1962 season. But after a while, WNTA decided to throw in the towel, and as we all know, Channel 13 eventually became today's WNET, one of the country's leading public broadcasting stations.

Here's the Wikipedia page on New York's Channel 13, if you want more info on it's relatively colorful history:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WNET

P.S. This is the first time I've posted a website on a message board.

 

[Cincinnati Kid]

Almost from their inception through the 1969 season, WCPO-TV in Cincinnati and WHIO-TV in Dayton were on the Cleveland Browns Network and carried all of the Browns games with the exception of some Saturday night games. To this day, I feel this is why there continue to be Browns fans in southwestern Ohio even though there has been an NFL franchise in Cincinanti since 1968.

At the same time (and I know this is a TV portion of the website), radio stations in Cincinnati and in many parts of Ohio were on the Browns Radio Network. Their games are still picked up today on WONE in Dayton.

Actually, the Browns had a pretty sizeable TV network up into the 1960's. Their games were shown on Ohio stations and even, I believe, some in Kentucky as well. In the late 1950's I heard someone from upper New York State indicate they received the Browns on TV.

 

[KeithE4]

Before the arrival of the Cards in 1988, The Arizona CBS stations got the Cowboys. That's why, even today, there are still as many Cowboy fans as Cardinal fans here. The natives were brought up on the Cowboys.

Before the Diamondbacks 1998 debut, Prescott's KUSK-TV 7/27/57 carried Dodgers, Giants, and A's games. I believe the AAA Phoenix Giants/Firebirds televised a few games per year, mostly on what was then called ASPN (now FSN Arizona). In the mid '70s, pre-TBN KPAZ-TV 21 carried a few Phoenix Giants games as well, while then-indie KPHO-TV 5 broadcast a dozen or so SF Giants games per year.

No hockey that I can remember before the Coyotes moved here from Winnipeg. IIRC, the minor-league Roadrunners never televised their games, even on cable. Don't know about what they did during their brief mid-'70s run as a WHA franchise.

 

[Bob1370]

The Mets never seemed to travel into upstate NY on TV until cable service, including carriage of the NYC stations, began in earnest in the late 60s and early 70s.

The Yankees, however, were often seen on upstate NY television, at least as far west as Syracuse and Rochester, even after the CBS Game of the Week started carrying more different teams' games every Saturday. I remember the station that most frequently joined the Yankees' regional broadcast network (which originated with WPIX) was probably Syracuse's WSYR-TV channel 3, an NBC basic affiliate. Syracuse was especially interested in the Yanks because their local AAA team, the Chiefs, was the Yankees' principal farm club until 1977. (As an aside, Yankee catcher Thurman Munson even did TV commercials endorsing a local Syracuse/Utica pizza chain, Arturo's, which apparently was his favorite while he was with the Chiefs before moving up to the big club in 1970.)

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Football Cardinal games were heard on the radio in Stl for a while after they left. Stl Rams preseason games were seen in LA until a couple years ago. Don't know what (if any) non-network preseason games aired in Stl from 88-94. The Royals radio network has station in North Dakota, the White Sox radio network has station in Southern MO, the Cardinals radio network has a station in Northwest Missouri (Royals territory). Many teams claim Iowa as their territory. Cowboys, Mets, Yankees, and Cubs have radio affiliates in Florida.

 

[Tim L]

For at least 1996, Tbe Baltimore Ravens were heard on WTAM-1100 Cleveland..Also, The Cincinnati Royals had a network affiliate in Cleveland, WKBF-61, in at least 1967-68..(January 1968)

 

[Charles1]

Pre-WTCG/TBS, the Braves local TV package was carried in Birmingham. When WSB was the flagship station, games were shown locally on WAPI-13. When WTCG became the flagship station, the package moved to WBMG-42 in Birmingham, WCFT-33 in Tuscaloosa, and WHMA-40 in Anniston. IIRC, the Huntsville Braves station in the WSB days was WMSL-48, and when WTCG became the flagship station the package moved to WAAY-31.

Even though Atlanta is ~145 miles from Birmingham, and Nashville is about 190 miles away, no Birmingham market stations currently carry Falcons preseason games, but the Titans' games are carried on ABC 33/40. Then again, the Falcons currently don't have a local radio affiliate in Birmingham, while the Titans Network has a local affiliate on WJOX-FM.

 

[mjlarochelle]

I'm curious what Cleveland got, if anything, for NHL hockey for 22 years after the short-lived Cleveland Barons merged with the Minnesota North Stars (1978) until the Columbus Blue Jackets were established (2000)

 

[firepoint525]

There was an attempt to expand Cowboys coverage into Houston after the Oilers left for Nashville in 1997, but before the Texans came in 2002.

 

[nomadcowatbk]

There was an attempt to expand Cowboys coverage into Houston after the Oilers left for Nashville in 1997, but before the Texans came in 2002.

Did the Oilers have a station in Dallas?

 

[Cincinnati Kid]

The Cincinnati Royals had a network affiliate in Cleveland, WKBF-61, in at least 1967-68..(January 1968)

During this period, the Royals played some of their games in the Cleveland Arena.

 

[ixnay]

And in the case of the "Gridbirds" (the former St. Louis football Cardinals), quote]

Good one, Tim. Never saw "Gridbirds" before. That could apply, today, to the Baltimore Ravens, who play next door to the Orioles aka the "Birds". But when distinguishing the two, I prefer "Purple Birds" for the football team.

Ultimajock, obviously Channel 5 carried the North Siders in 1969, when the Brewers (then in their first season) were the Seattle Pilots.

ixnay

 

[ixnay]

Almost from their inception through the 1969 season, WCPO-TV in Cincinnati and WHIO-TV in Dayton were on the Cleveland Browns Network and carried all of the Browns games with the exception of some Saturday night games. To this day, I feel this is why there continue to be Browns fans in southwestern Ohio even though there has been an NFL franchise in Cincinanti since 1968.

The Bengals were under the AFL banner in 1968 and 1969, although the pact to absorb Lamar Hunt's league into Pete Rozelle's had been a done deal since 1966 and took effect in 1970.

I miss those solid orange helmets with BENGALS in arched letters, but that's for OTA.

ixnay

 

[FreddyE1977]

For a couple of years in the past decade (around 2005 I think) Cleveland Cavaliers games
were being carried in Pittsburgh on WBGN-TV, a low-power network available on various
over-the-air channels in the region. I think the arrangement ended when Comcast booted
them from their cable systems.

 

[Ultimajock]

Ultimajock, obviously Channel 5 carried the North Siders in 1969, when the Brewers (then in their first season) were the Seattle Pilots.

...and continued to do so into at least 1971; I distinctly recall watching Ernie Banks' last game over WFRV-TV (perhaps WGN Continental had a standard for three-year contracts?)...