• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

Seattle-Tacoma Radio Ratings - Holiday 2022

A few points.

1. “Northwest News” should not simulcast on 101.5. I think it’s important to note that 1000 is easily one of the best AM signals on the west coast. While AM radio is certainly not what it used to be, a spoken word format on one of the strongest signals in the market is not a bad thing to have.

2. Seattle has multiple AC stations, multiple CHR stations, but only one hot AC. Star certainly isn’t what it used to be, but that doesn’t mean that they should throw in the towel at this point. There’s an opportunity to build something and Lotus seems interested in doing it.

3. A simulcast of 1000 on 97.7 is the highest and best use of the their south mountain signal. 97.7 gives KNWN the ability to have the equivalent of a massive FM repeater that teaches most of the market with a mostly listenable signal. Sure, 97.7 isn’t going to give you great coverage on the East side or northern suburbs, but it’s better than what some markets have. In Baltimore, news radio WBAL has a FM translator to provide secondary FM coverage to the metropolitan area. Suffice to say that the signal isn’t full market. Not to mention, the AM signal for WBAL isn’t nearly as good as 1000.

4. I would be very surprised to see anyone try another south sound signal at this point. There are already many stations competing for limited advertising dollars. Adding one more into the mix would likely be a war of attrition.
 
pjc1961 said:
Top 5+ demo ranking analysis for ages 25-54, 18-34 + 18-49:
AllAccess Demo Ranking Analysis - Holiday 2022 (scroll down to see Seattle-Tacoma market)

25-54: 1. KRWM 2. KEXP 3. KSWD (up from #9) 4. KQMV 5. KISW 10T. KJEB 10T. KNWN-AM 18T. KCMS (same rank as Dec. '22)
18-34: 1. KRWM 2. KEXP 3. KSWD 4T. KUOW 4T. KISW (up from 9T) 9T. KQMV (down from 3T) 12. KJEB (down from 3T)
18-49: 1. KRWM 2. KEXP 3. KSWD (up from #8) 4. KISW 5. KQMV 6. KIRO-FM
Click to expand...

This is astounding! KEXP plays mostly underground music and is absolutely crushing it in a major market on a small signal.

A cousin station of sorts, the 100kW KCMP in Minneapolis, a very similarly composed market, does not rank in the top 5 in these demos. While boasting quite a diverse playlist itself, KCMP is not as adventurous as KEXP.
 
crainbebo said:
Does KXXO concentrate on Seattle or the South Sound? KNWN-97.7's transmitter is at Matlock/Shelton, the COL at Oakville. This puts the 60dbu into Pierce/Thurston, and 97.7 could concentrate on Tacoma/Olympia.\
Click to expand...
So you believe that there's more national and local advertising potential South of Seattle?
KXXO would probably given up their first born to have a full market signal. If anything for stick value alone. What you're proposing is like someone wanting to build a grocery megastore in Tumwater verses West Seattle. Financial suicide.
crainbebo said:
KNX-97.1 L.A. beat KLOS in the October AND November books (3.2 rating). And that's with 1070 simulcasting it. It nearly beat KIIS-FM in October. What's to say KNWN can't do this with full-power 101.5 at Cougar Mountain?
Click to expand...
Different markets.
crainbebo said:
AAA dead? What about KBCO in Denver? Tied 5th place in Holiday '22. KPND in Coeur D'Alene? There has to be some type of audience left if they are still getting these ratings with the ski/liberal audience in Denver/Boulder.
Click to expand...
You don't re-format a station with something already showing to be in decline. As has been illustrated many times on this site, changing formats is super expensive. Only a fool would bother making that investment for something that likely could fail.
crainbebo said:
And Seattle has a loyal KEXP audience. What's the difference between a typical Seattle music lover vs. one in the suburban Denver metro?
Click to expand...
KEXP is a non-comm.
 
Some other nuggets from when I tried my hand at radio sales a few years ago: it’s a lot harder than you ever would think it could be. I can’t speak for what the experience is like in Seattle, but in any smaller market, it’s an uphill battle. Local businesses already operate on thin margins, and spending money on radio advertising is usually not a very high priority for them. Expect to spend a lot of time driving around to different businesses and trying to build any sort of relationship with the business owner, manager, or employees. All in all, it’s a difficult way to make money and I didn’t last long. Add in the complexity of trying to sell something intangible to someone who isn’t really sure that they even need it. I would argue that it’s easier to sell virtually anything that you can actually hold in your hands. Advertising is a mysterious beast.
 
fordranger797 said:
A few points.

1. “Northwest News” should not simulcast on 101.5. I think it’s important to note that 1000 is easily one of the best AM signals on the west coast. While AM radio is certainly not what it used to be, a spoken word format on one of the strongest signals in the market is not a bad thing to have.

2. Seattle has multiple AC stations, multiple CHR stations, but only one hot AC. Star certainly isn’t what it used to be, but that doesn’t mean that they should throw in the towel at this point. There’s an opportunity to build something and Lotus seems interested in doing it.

3. A simulcast of 1000 on 97.7 is the highest and best use of the their south mountain signal. 97.7 gives KNWN the ability to have the equivalent of a massive FM repeater that teaches most of the market with a mostly listenable signal. Sure, 97.7 isn’t going to give you great coverage on the East side or northern suburbs, but it’s better than what some markets have. In Baltimore, news radio WBAL has a FM translator to provide secondary FM coverage to the metropolitan area. Suffice to say that the signal isn’t full market. Not to mention, the AM signal for WBAL isn’t nearly as good as 1000.

4. I would be very surprised to see anyone try another south sound signal at this point. There are already many stations competing for limited advertising dollars. Adding one more into the mix would likely be a war of attrition.
Click to expand...
Outside of the obvious formats that either wouldn't do well in certain markets or are overall in decline, I don't understand why certain markets have format holes at all. For instance, New Orleans doesn't have a Hot AC, and Bend just lost its closest thing to mainstream AC. Even in Seattle, there's really nowhere for current-based hip-hop anymore.
As for AAA stations, is it even true that most of the audience of KINK is 55+? That would seem really odd to me as that's not really AAA anymore, more of a Modern AC with an '80s component.
 
So it's safe to say KPLZ did not go Xmas this year. Lol.

Hot AC is a format that targets the most important demos that a station could go for, so the overall ratings can be very low, yet the billing can be good.
It's the female side of sports, ratings may look awful but revenue is a different story.

When Hot AC is done right by playing the strongest gold from 2k to 5 or so years ago. Even can spike stuff like Living on a prayer, take on me, Don't stop believin etc if it doesn't have a classic hits cluster mate, then the best testing currents and recurrents, it should be making money.
When it doesn't work it's usually the music is flawed, and or they have jocks who blab on and on about things that the audience doesn't care about.
 
So instead of posting ratings every month we should just stick to posting what each station makes and subtract the cost to operate. That’s the real deal and true indicator of success. Got it.
 
bobdavcav said:
Outside of the obvious formats that either wouldn't do well in certain markets or are overall in decline, I don't understand why certain markets have format holes at all. For instance, New Orleans doesn't have a Hot AC, and Bend just lost its closest thing to mainstream AC. Even in Seattle, there's really nowhere for current-based hip-hop anymore.
As for AAA stations, is it even true that most of the audience of KINK is 55+? That would seem really odd to me as that's not really AAA anymore, more of a Modern AC with an '80s component.
Click to expand...
The main issue here is that current based hip-hop is a pretty weak format right now. KUBE crashed and burned when the format started to have trouble remaining relevant. KHTP could probably add in a few modern tracks (if they wanted to) to provide some modern hip hop. They would only have to go for the low hanging fruit (i.e., songs that fit in with what they’re already doing. Perhaps Kendrick Lamar). Other than that, I wouldn’t expect to see a station like KUBE come back anytime soon.

As for AAA, I think you could argue that it could potentially become the “new”alternative. Subtract the older tracks on KINK, and you’ve got a station that’s a little more acoustic than an alternative station trying to pass off pop songs as alternative. However, it seems like a lot of alternative stations have backed off from this approach. As it stands right now, a typical listener of KINK is someone older, and who has listened for a long time.
 
Cobra14 said:
So instead of posting ratings every month we should just stick to posting what each station makes and subtract the cost to operate. That’s the real deal and true indicator of success. Got it.
Click to expand...
It's always about revenue and expenses within the group. What, you think radio companies do this for just individual station ratings, forget about revenue? Like some score at a game?
 
I decided to listen to 93.3 for a while. One guy wants to know why people aren’t going to Huskies football games more than they are. Other guy said 4K HDTV and the low cost of those now are keeping people at home. He didn’t mention how bad getting in and out of Seattle is, crime, parking, COVID fears, the weather and all of the other reasons why people would stay away from going to the stadium. Not to mention the concessions and cost, and waiting in line to use the bathroom. Also the one guy said the 2023 Mariners were great and wants to know why they didn’t have more attendance. They haven’t played a game yet this year. Must have fortune tellers on staff.

The normal shrill nasally irritable sounding voiced guy who begins every segment with “ALRIGHT!!!” Was gone today.

Then they aired a low quality poor audio phone call with some host from another station in Alabama talking about Tuscaloosa football coaching and the team down there.

Kelly to answer your question based on what I heard today I’d say neither are of concern to some stations or managers. Just based on the example given by these guys. Quality and content should be a concern. But who cares what people are actually hearing right? Just as long as they can sell beer, insurance, cars for kids spots and autos. $$$
 
Cobra14 said:
Kelly to answer your question based on what I heard today I’d say neither are of concern to some stations or managers. Just based on the example given by these guys. Quality and content should be a concern. But who cares what people are actually hearing right? Just as long as they can sell beer, insurance, cars for kids spots and autos. $$$
Click to expand...
Sure, it's called a business. Just because you don't like what you're hearing, doesn't mean it's broken, or not financially successful.
 
“Just because you don't like what you're hearing, doesn't mean it's broken, or not financially successful.”

Further listening reveals it sounds like they are trying to fill dead air with talking rather than provide provocative or relevant content. Also never heard a pro broadcaster say “uhhh ummm uhh” and “yep” so many times as a response to the guy on the phone interview. Is this a long term business model that’s viable or someone or somebody’s trying to pretend to know how to present this format? If I owned the station there’d be some strong words and a few meetings about it. “Uhhhh or uhhhhhh”.
 
“The sun comes up, the rooster crows, we eat breakfast”. Host on 93.3 today.

Such sophistication on the airwaves today. Good grief.
 
Country music has had a tough couple years and Seattle radio stations have suffered along with stations in Portland and many West Coast Cities. I don't believe SF even has a full market Country station any longer. By the way in case you missed it KPLZ flipped to AC over the holidays. Mediabase dropped them as a HOT-AC reporter and now list them as AC. Their playlist shows currents spinning like an AC. Air-staff is the same.
 
guruofradio said:
Country music has had a tough couple years and Seattle radio stations have suffered along with stations in Portland and many West Coast Cities. I don't believe SF even has a full market Country station any longer. By the way in case you missed it KPLZ flipped to AC over the holidays. Mediabase dropped them as a HOT-AC reporter and now list them as AC. Their playlist shows currents spinning like an AC. Air-staff is the same.
Click to expand...
That's just plain strange! Logic dictates that they'd have kept Christmas music and promoted the new format, since it's more compatible.
 
fordranger797 said:
The main issue here is that current based hip-hop is a pretty weak format right now. KUBE crashed and burned when the format started to have trouble remaining relevant. KHTP could probably add in a few modern tracks (if they wanted to) to provide some modern hip hop. They would only have to go for the low hanging fruit (i.e., songs that fit in with what they’re already doing. Perhaps Kendrick Lamar). Other than that, I wouldn’t expect to see a station like KUBE come back anytime soon.

As for AAA, I think you could argue that it could potentially become the “new”alternative. Subtract the older tracks on KINK, and you’ve got a station that’s a little more acoustic than an alternative station trying to pass off pop songs as alternative. However, it seems like a lot of alternative stations have backed off from this approach. As it stands right now, a typical listener of KINK is someone older, and who has listened for a long time.
Click to expand...
That's probably what I would do with KHTP, that's kind of what KUBE was doing in later years anyway.
As for AAA, my problem with a lot of those stations is their lifeless presentation. Let's take KINK in particular. Regardless of the format, I would never cold segue every other song routinely. What imaging they do have is really boring. I would probably take a similar approach to AC for a station like that. I can understand someone listening to KINK for years, but it does seem odd to me that that would be the primary driver of that format, as if you take out everything pre-1990 from the playlist, you have something similar to what 98.9 tried a few years ago. Then again, it seems like that formula has been tried over and over and it never works, which that's something I don't quite understand either.
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom