Taylor on Radio-info: An FM sports talker in Bos. this year?

[raccoonradio]

For those who don't subscribe (free) to Tom Taylor's email newsletter, he has an item today
wondering if we'd see an FM sports station here in Boston sometime this year. He quotes one
"talk veteran" (not sure who) who says "somebody’s bound to take on Entercom’s WEEI, looking at their amazing ratings and revenues and how hot those Boston teams are. It could be CBS or Greater Media or even Entercom itself". Could it happen?

In terms of rivals, I could see a CBS or a GM having a blend of local hosts and ESPN (make a deal to
put ESPN on FM and take it off the less powerful 890/1400....though as I drove into Boston area last
night I did notice 890 wasn't too bad)

 

[JustinT]

I know this one's been beaten into the ground before, and it wouldn't be a surprise to see sports on Greater Media's 92.9, CBS' 100.7 or 104.1, or quite honestly Entercom's 97.7 or 107.3 at this point.

But is it really possible to take on WEEI? Entercom's got all of the teams locked up outside of the Bruins, which unfortunately for CBS happens to be the only team that isn't partaking in the momentum. Sure CBS or GM could run a feed of ESPN Radio on FM but non-local sports radio doesn't have a great record in this market, so whoever does it is going to need to invest big in talent.

And right now, if you're really looking to launch a station in Boston on the cheap that's guaranteed to perform well, wouldn't the #1 12+ numbers of WJMN be a bit tempting to go after?

EDIT: Forgot CBS also had the Pats (obviously)... I take that back.

 

[blamethemayo]

i have an idea, why not put weei on every available frequency in new england?

when im up in burlington vt and i start to doubt that the red sox are the greatest baseball team ever assembled, i want to be able to turn on my radio so that the 'eei crew can reassure me that yes, in fact the sox are the greatest team ever assembled...

if im in podunk new hampshire and it is 5:55 pm, what am i going to do if i cant hear the whiner line and someone doing an eddie in lynnfield impression?

 

[VoxPox]

If EEI did get some decent competition, the quality of the talk shows would improve dramataically. How I miss Guy Maniella.

 

[radiodouble]

I know this one's been beaten into the ground before, and it wouldn't be a surprise to see sports on Greater Media's 92.9, CBS' 100.7 or 104.1, or quite honestly Entercom's 97.7 or 107.3 at this point.

But is it really possible to take on WEEI? Entercom's got all of the teams locked up outside of the Bruins, which unfortunately for CBS happens to be the only team that isn't partaking in the momentum. Sure CBS or GM could run a feed of ESPN Radio on FM but non-local sports radio doesn't have a great record in this market, so whoever does it is going to need to invest big in talent.

And right now, if you're really looking to launch a station in Boston on the cheap that's guaranteed to perform well, wouldn't the #1 12+ numbers of WJMN be a bit tempting to go after?

EDIT: Forgot CBS also had the Pats (obviously)... I take that back.

you want the krafties to pull all the kraft/patriots content(patriots monday, player/coach appearances, revolution games) off weei and shift it to an upstart sports fm station? are you mad?! wbz tried all-sports on weekends when weei was still in growth stage and it was a complete joke. they couldn't compete and lost money.

whatever tom taylor is smoking, it's not very good.

 

[Blackroc]

I hope the source doesn't call 96.9 home? The Red Sox contract was key to attacking WEEI dominence and now that's settled longterm, so I don't see a significant challenge by anybody.

 

[WBIMDJ]

Wow, like we need enough of one of those. Sports talk *GAGS*

And stations like Jamn' and Kiss still dominate because of no competition and they wanna do sports talk on FM. On FM?!
Now I remember why I always love other radio markets when I go visit somewhere and sample the local radio, and wonder why Boston markets aren't like them.

 

[BRNout]

It would be pretty tough for a newcomer to make inroads. The WEEI product is unique in that it has developed a heritage of its own in a relatively short time. Having the Red Sox on board was another major coup. That's always going to be the best fodder for a station like WEEI because baseball season is very long and involves games on an almost daily basis. It becomes akin to following a soap opera! Football, on the other hand, has games only once a week and a season that is shorter than baseball's. So, although the Pats generate hot talk during times like these - they are hardly a staple. The Red Sox, on the other hand, always give the folks a lot to talk about. And, the B's and Celtics will always be talk also-rans. Without the 'Sox as a foundation, you just cannot have a successful sports talker in this market. And, Entercom got there first.

Best AM/FM combo would be Entercom's: 850/107.3/97.7 or 850/93.7 That would be worthwhile, given the product.

Anyone else would be a waste of space on an FM band that is already lacking in programming diversity. Can ESPN Radio or FOX Sports really take on WEEI anywhere in New England? Categorically NO. So, trying to do so would show an immense lack of originality.

 

[TSBench]

I know this one's been beaten into the ground before, and it wouldn't be a surprise to see sports on Greater Media's 92.9, CBS' 100.7 or 104.1,

It would surprize me, since it wouldn't make either economic or programming sense. The stations would have to kiss off all their current billing, and run up years of multi-million dollar loses, just for the privilege of being chewed up and spit out by WEEI.

or quite honestly Entercom's 97.7 or 107.3 at this point.

Why would Entercom do that? Take music off of two stations currently making money, swap billing currently on WEEI, and leave themselves with a 50KW AM with no viable programming options other than talk, which would just cannabalize audience and billing from WRKO? Truly a cure for which there is no known disease.

But is it really possible to take on WEEI? Entercom's got all of the teams locked up outside of the Bruins, which unfortunately for CBS happens to be the only team that isn't partaking in the momentum.

The NHL in general, and the Bruins in particular, got a rude awakening when they went on strike for a season and nobody noticed. The Bruins probably feel lucky that WBZ isn't charging them for carrying the games.

Forgot CBS also had the Pats (obviously)... I take that back.

Doesn't matter. WEEI still gets all the pre- and post- game and talk action, and serious access to the players and coach without paying the rights fees for what is essentially a television event. WBCN gets the games, bills a few bucks, and gets a chance to cross promote its other programming while eating time that isn't particularly revenue generating. WEEI gets all the gravy.

you want the krafties to pull all the kraft/patriots content(patriots monday, player/coach appearances, revolution games) off weei and shift it to an upstart sports fm station? are you mad?

Another tough nut to crack, since the Entercom access to the Pats is part of a quid pro quo with the Krafts for carryihg the Revs. And the Revs are essentially a get-no-respect freebie for WEEI that can be moved around on delay to make way for sports programming people are actually interested in. Anyone who wants to base a sports station on MLS is in for some very heavy, and expensive, rolls.

Can ESPN Radio or FOX Sports really take on WEEI anywhere in New England? Categorically NO.

Amen.

whatever tom taylor is smoking, it's not very good.

Well, Taylor is ignoring the elephant in the room, specifically that Boston isn't a "great sports town"; Boston is a great Red Sox (and for the last couple of years, Pats) town. That is why the national sports nets are non-starters, nobody (except for hard core gamblers) cares about anything else in numbers great enough to be successful. Boston could be the worst college sports market of any major city in the country (with the exception of BC, but they're only on because there are enough alums controlling business purse strings to sponsor the broadcasts, regardless of how few listen) and the Boston television ratings for 'neutral' games (with the exception of the Yankees when their games have a impact on the Sox) are usually the lowest in the country. If sports radio is considered talk radio for morons, where, exactly, does that leave 'national' sports talk? Without the Sox as a tent pole, I can't imagine how a second sports station could make a dent in the market. The way things are currently structured, WEEI is invulnerable.

Regards,
TSB

 

[BRNout]

or quite honestly Entercom's 97.7 or 107.3 at this point.

Why would Entercom do that? Take music off of two stations currently making money, swap billing currently on WEEI, and leave themselves with a 50KW AM with no viable programming options other than talk, which would just cannabalize audience and billing from WRKO? Truly a cure for which there is no known disease.

Perhaps not - but they could make a killer deal for the 99.5 signal. That would vastly expand the range of the WEEI brand to currently underserved (yet affluent) areas of the market. You could make even more money with a good FM signal than is presently being made with the highly-directional AM one. Imagine the ratings with the AM/FM combo. You get economies of scale going by running the same programming on both.

The only caveat is that they'd need to strike while the iron is hot - as in right now (or soon).

 

[raccoonradio]

Boston has the potential for ONE "other" sports station to do well--or "OK", as an alternative to WEEI. A station
that would have a couple local talk shows and some syndie (ESPN or Sporting News; WEEI has Fox). Whether
it would do well on FM, who knows. WAMG 890/WLLH 1400 are getting at least some numbers (12 plus) now
(they do have local talk w/ Felger). I know it's unlikely, but suppose someone were to put this sports
talker on FM, steal Felger & ESPN away from 890/1400, and WWZN and 890/1400 were to conveniently
flip formats (I SAID it was unlikely!) to ethnic or prog. talk or classic country or whatever.

Sure, it would be no match for WEEI but it would at least grab SOME of the audience. Unlikely but stranger
things have happened. But local content is key...WWZN, WTTT, and the former prog talk format of
WKOX/WXKS is proof that all syndie will get you nowhere. Getting some kind of play by play rights would
help, too, of course; if CBS had an underperforming station, they could shuttle the Bruins there (if, if...)
OR if Greater felt WBOS could so sports, make a play for the Bruins (when is that contract up?). There's
college sports, minor league baseball, etc. No, it wouldn't match WEEI but it could grab some of the audience.
Or are "alternatives" to WEEI strictly for the AM dial...?

 

[TSBench]

or quite honestly Entercom's 97.7 or 107.3 at this point.

Why would Entercom do that? Take music off of two stations currently making money, swap billing currently on WEEI, and leave themselves with a 50KW AM with no viable programming options other than talk, which would just cannabalize audience and billing from WRKO? Truly a cure for which there is no known disease.

Perhaps not - but they could make a killer deal for the 99.5 signal. That would vastly expand the range of the WEEI brand to currently underserved (yet affluent) areas of the market. You could make even more money with a good FM signal than is presently being made with the highly-directional AM one. Imagine the ratings with the AM/FM combo. You get economies of scale going by running the same programming on both.

The only caveat is that they'd need to strike while the iron is hot - as in right now (or soon).

Agreed, but that is a whole 'nuther smoke. That keeps WEEI as sports, adds a fading classical music station to the mix, and the existing Entercom FMs still programming music. I believe this thread was about an alternative to WEEI, not just adding affiliates to carry their existing programming.

Regards,
TSB

 

[Speaker of Truth]

In order for another FM Sports Talker to work, you could see if Bob Ryan or Jackie Mac would try the daily grind of a sports talk show in addition to everything else they have on their plates..

You could also add Jim Rome to the mix..

But as has been stated, WEEI/Entercom would not give up the Red Sox or Celtics..would the Bruins want to shift to an FM? Of course..but selling those games has to be an incredible chore..and just throwing ESPN or Sporting News programming out there when nothing else is avaliable is a weak option at best..

 

[TSBench]

Boston has the potential for ONE "other" sports station to do well--or "OK", as an alternative to WEEI.

Based on what? There isn't a major league market in the country with two successful sports talk stations, and most don't even have one. WEEI is the sports station every group would like to have.

A station that would have a couple local talk shows and some syndie (ESPN or Sporting News;

There is a reason that WEEI programs the national sports nets in throwaway time; they don't work here. This has be demonstrated time and again. Remember that old definition of insanity?

WEEI has Fox).

Which is used to fill what would otherwise be dead air. It's main purpose is to give WEEI hosts somebody (JT The Brick comes to mind) to make fun of.

Whether it would do well on FM, who knows.

FM is basically about sound quality. Nobody, except that guy on the old Art Bell show who used to pitch a radio 'especially set up for AM talk radio listening', cares.

WAMG 890/WLLH 1400 are getting at least some numbers (12 plus) now
(they do have local talk w/ Felger). I know it's unlikely, but suppose someone were to put this sports
talker on FM, steal Felger & ESPN away from 890/1400, and WWZN and 890/1400 were to conveniently
flip formats (I SAID it was unlikely!) to ethnic or prog. talk or classic country or whatever.

What you usually get when you combine two small failures is one big failure. Don't confuse what you read on the boards from the folks who don't like WEEI with real life.

Sure, it would be no match for WEEI but it would at least grab SOME of the audience.

Ummm...the problem is that, while you can get an audience for almost anything, getting a economically viable audience is quite another. What part of this don't you understand? WEEI didn't even regard ESPN or TSN as competition, they just ignored them. If they had actually thought that they were competition, they would have crushed them. These folks don't play around when there is cash on the table.

Getting some kind of play by play rights would
help, too, of course;

Yes, and if I had some ham we could make a sandwich, if you had some bread. Perhaps Curry College hoop is available.

if CBS had an underperforming station, they could shuttle the Bruins there (if, if...)

Yes, make WBCN a sports station with the Pats and the Bruins. Dan Mason is on the line, asking where his twenty millions bucks in billing went.

OR if Greater felt WBOS could so sports, make a play for the Bruins (when is that contract up?). There's
college sports, minor league baseball, etc.

Paying rights fees for events nobody cares about probably isn't the route to success (do you seriously want to counter-program the Bosox with the Pawsox?). The truest words ever posted on these boards were 'you need the Sox to be a successful Boston sports station.' When GM didn't get the Sox, they did the smart thing. You have to know when to fold 'em.

No, it wouldn't match WEEI but it could grab some of the audience.
Or are "alternatives" to WEEI strictly for the AM dial...?

I think I can guarantee you that branding your station as 'the alternative to WEEI' is a loser. EDS isn't as contageous as you might think, and certainly isn't regarded as a research tool in the GM or CBS executive suites. .

Unlikely but stranger things have happened

Name one.

Regards,
TSB

 

[radiodouble]

Boston has the potential for ONE "other" sports station to do well--or "OK", as an alternative to WEEI. A station
that would have a couple local talk shows and some syndie (ESPN or Sporting News; WEEI has Fox). Whether
it would do well on FM, who knows. WAMG 890/WLLH 1400 are getting at least some numbers (12 plus) now
(they do have local talk w/ Felger). I know it's unlikely, but suppose someone were to put this sports
talker on FM, steal Felger & ESPN away from 890/1400, and WWZN and 890/1400 were to conveniently
flip formats (I SAID it was unlikely!) to ethnic or prog. talk or classic country or whatever.

Sure, it would be no match for WEEI but it would at least grab SOME of the audience. Unlikely but stranger
things have happened. But local content is key...WWZN, WTTT, and the former prog talk format of
WKOX/WXKS is proof that all syndie will get you nowhere. Getting some kind of play by play rights would
help, too, of course; if CBS had an underperforming station, they could shuttle the Bruins there (if, if...)
OR if Greater felt WBOS could so sports, make a play for the Bruins (when is that contract up?). There's
college sports, minor league baseball, etc. No, it wouldn't match WEEI but it could grab some of the audience.
Or are "alternatives" to WEEI strictly for the AM dial...?

this has to be your joseph gallant tribute post...

yes, felgie was so thrilled to be a thorn in weei's side by stealing half a share from the big show after two years, he went out and got himself a fulltime gig on cable tv. now, he sits in a tiny radio booth in burlington and does his silly little afternoon show on 890 talking to weei listeners who punch him up during long breaks on 850. 890 would've never survived this long without piggybacking off 850.

 

[BRNout]

Getting some kind of play by play rights would
help, too, of course;

Yes, and if I had some ham we could make a sandwich, if you had some bread. Perhaps Curry College hoop is available.

LOL! So very true - for sports talk to work, you have to establish your station's credibility (as in, being THE station for the big teams) and have compelling local sports issues to discuss. Ummm, great personalities don't hurt either. Without those elements, you might as well program Curry College basketball. ;D

Sports radio is a fickle beast.

The truest words ever posted on these boards were 'you need the Sox to be a successful Boston sports station.'

Why, thank you! Just goes to prove that even a broken clock is right twice a day(....unless it's digital)!

 

[raccoonradio]

Then you'd prob disagree with "Practical Progressive" at the savewrko.com board who thinks WBCN should
go all sports (keep Pats, add B's) , 103.3 all news; move oldies to 100.7 (bye classic rock) and all live and local talk on 1030...
I doubt See B.S. would go THAT far but 'BCN to sports might work...if done well. Maybe even partner up
with The Paper That Will Increase Its Price To 75 Cents On Feb. 4 (hint: they're on Morrissey Blvd.)

http://www.savewrko.com/archives/2008/01/bruins_on_wbz.php#comments

 

[blamethemayo]

Then you'd prob disagree with "Practical Progressive" at the savewrko.com board who thinks WBCN should
go all sports (keep Pats, add B's) , 103.3 all news; move oldies to 100.7 (bye classic rock) and all live and local talk on 1030...
I doubt See B.S. would go THAT far but 'BCN to sports might work...if done well. Maybe even partner up
with The Paper That Will Increase Its Price To 75 Cents On Feb. 4 (hint: they're on Morrissey Blvd.)

http://www.savewrko.com/archives/2008/01/bruins_on_wbz.php#comments

after thinking about it, moving the bruins to wbcn and making it a sports station isnt a totally bad idea.

103.3 to all news is a bad idea, however.

 

[DanStrassberg]

I've said this before in another thread: If Entercom can get control of 99.5, they could move it to the 93.7 stick in Peabody where it could become a full B or close. (The stick is ever so slightly short-spaced to WPLM but WPLM's HAAT is only 430' vs 492 for a full B, so despite the short the spacing to WPLM, 99.5 might be able to run from Peabody at full B power--which is 34 kW for WMKK because its HAAT is more than 492'.) Since 93.7 covers Boston well without help from a close-in simulcast--such as the one on Class A 97.7--99.5 would do the same and would become perfect for WAAF without 97.7, which could become WCRB. 107.3 could then become a simulcast of 850 (although advertisers could be given a choice to not buy one or the other of the two signals, giving WEEI the opportunity to use the new FM signal to produce additional revenue). It appears that 107.3's W Boyleston stick has not yet been granted a license to cover, meaning that 107.3 could move back to Paxton and thus get back all of the coverage it lost in its disastrous move. Since the 107.3 signal would then return to being a west-of-Boston signal, advertisers would have to pay for the coverage it would provide outside of the immediate Boston market, which 850 covers.