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The "Athens Of America" ;-( With No Classical Music Station ?

A

AlanShore

Guest
What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of culture for the North East not to have the presence of a Classical Music station on its radio dial.

Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really qualify?

If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring example of the coarsening of American culture. How many indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this city need?

At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a classical music station.

Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in Boston?
 
> What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> Classical Music station on its radio dial.
================================================================================
Amen!

Shall Boston be without such a option while little ole Vermont can sustatin a sucessful commercial classical station?

http://www.wcvtradio.com/<P ID="signature">______________
"What's That?" "French Horns!"

</P>
 
> > What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> > culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> > Classical Music station on its radio dial.
====================> ============================================================
>
> Amen!
>
> Shall Boston be without such a option while little ole
> Vermont can sustatin a sucessful commercial classical
> station?
>
> http://www.wcvtradio.com/
>
May I add that (at least for now) Maine has a commercial classical network, WBACH, owned by Nassau http://www.wbachradio.com/.
 
But there's still one in Stowe, VT...

wcvt_logo.gif

...and I think WTMI 1290 in Hartford is still classical

> At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
> centers but those days seem to be gone.

Kerry Muffy Healey lives down the street from me. Wonder if I can get her
to make a nice contribution to WMWM? (We DID have a classical show a few
yrs ago btw)
 
Ooh! I must have read your mind (made my post before I saw this one)

> Amen!
>
> Shall Boston be without such a option while little ole
> Vermont can sustatin a sucessful commercial classical
> station?
>
> http://www.wcvtradio.com/
>
<P ID="signature">______________
raccoonradio5ap.gif
</P>
 
> What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> Classical Music station on its radio dial.
>
> Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> qualify?
>
> If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring example
> of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this
> city need?
>
> At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
> centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires
> like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
> fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the
> discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> classical music station.
>
> Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
> Boston?
>

It's pathetic. This is the icing on the cake in how Boston is overrepresented in certain formats while abandoning other formats.

The market can sustain sports stations that get no audience. Yet at the same time we have have abandoned Spanish music, jazz, urban AC, dance, and now no classical.

The programmers fall over themselves to reach the coveted white male suburban demographic while ignoring it is other demographic groups that are growing.
 
As Maine goes... so goes Massachusetts ?


> > > What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> > > culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
>
> > > Classical Music station on its radio dial.
> ====================>
> ============================================================
>
> >
> > Amen!
> >
> > Shall Boston be without such a option while little ole
> > Vermont can sustatin a sucessful commercial classical
> > station?
> >
> > http://www.wcvtradio.com/
> >
> May I add that (at least for now) Maine has a commercial
> classical network, WBACH, owned by Nassau
> http://www.wbachradio.com/.
>
 
> The programmers fall over themselves to reach the coveted
> white male suburban demographic while ignoring it is other
> demographic groups that are growing.

Don't WMJX, WBMX and WODS skew more female than male?

Perhaps also WXRV, WBOS, WMKK, WROR and WXKS-FM?
 
You know? I actually agree with you on this one!
Boston without Classical music is like Pizza without Cheese!

The trouble is, radio is a business, and talk about a format that is the furthest thing from that... The logical choice is to put Classical on a non-profit like WGBH or some other public station. Yes, I think WGBH qualifies, and I think it's good that they do not play classical full time.

On the other hand, Boston is a city that should have a classical radio station, and the 4 major colleges (Harvard, BU, BC and Northeasten) should get together with the city leaders to see to it that there is full time Classical radio.


> What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> Classical Music station on its radio dial.
>
> Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> qualify?
>
> If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring example
> of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this
> city need?
>
> At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
> centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires
> like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
> fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the
> discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> classical music station.
>
> Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
> Boston?
>
 
> > The programmers fall over themselves to reach the coveted
> > white male suburban demographic while ignoring it is other
>
> > demographic groups that are growing.
>
> Don't WMJX, WBMX and WODS skew more female than male?
>
> Perhaps also WXRV, WBOS, WMKK, WROR and WXKS-FM?

In regard to WXRV and WBOS, the AAA genre has about a 50/50 men/women split in listenership. WMKK and variety hits also has the 50/50 split, if I recall correctly.

Not sure about WROR; but WXKS is certainly female-skewed.

The real male-targetting stations are the talk stations, the sports outlets, WZLX, WBCN, WAAF and WFNX.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by JustinT on 04/09/06 09:43 PM.</FONT></P>
 
You would think that "Friends of The Symphony" and other charitable supporters of classical music would step forward. They won't complain until WCRB becomes a Hip-Hop format.
Sad.
Boston will be just another backwater second class city without a WCRB or its like.



> You know? I actually agree with you on this one!
> Boston without Classical music is like Pizza without Cheese!
>
>
> The trouble is, radio is a business, and talk about a format
> that is the furthest thing from that... The logical choice
> is to put Classical on a non-profit like WGBH or some other
> public station. Yes, I think WGBH qualifies, and I think
> it's good that they do not play classical full time.
>
> On the other hand, Boston is a city that should have a
> classical radio station, and the 4 major colleges (Harvard,
> BU, BC and Northeasten) should get together with the city
> leaders to see to it that there is full time Classical
> radio.
>
>
> > What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> > culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> > Classical Music station on its radio dial.
> >
> > Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> > qualify?
> >
> > If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring
> example
> > of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> > indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this
> > city need?
> >
> > At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> > likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
>
> > centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires
>
> > like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
> > fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> > engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the
> > discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> > classical music station.
> >
> > Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> > "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
> > Boston?
> >
>
 
> It's pathetic. This is the icing on the cake in how Boston
> is overrepresented in certain formats while abandoning other
> formats.
>
> The market can sustain sports stations that get no audience.
> Yet at the same time we have have abandoned Spanish music,
> jazz, urban AC, dance, and now no classical.

We do have a part-time Urban AC in WILD-FM. Why it isn't a full time outlet is beyond me; if I recall, the last time Boston had a devoted frequency was under Nash ownership of WILD 1090; Radio One flipped it to Urban Oldies soon after the acquisition in 2000.

Dance (or better put, rhythmic AC) would probably have still been here if it were not for the advent of variety hits and Entercom's plan to beat Infinity to the punch. Even so, WQSX never pulled incredible ratings, though it constantly performed adequately.

But I'm with you on Spanish and smooth jazz. WAMG was serving an audience, and if it had ownership that was actually involved in the operation rather than the sale of their non-Florida stations, it would still be here. In regard to jazz, with WMJX moving more upbeat and WCRB disappearing, there is a big void for an instumental station. Perhaps we'll see SJ on 99.5?
 
Non white men

"The real male-targetting stations are the talk stations, the sports outlets, WZLX, WBCN, WAAF and WFNX"

According to this logic, which I've seen before, non-white men don't listen to the radio!
 
> You know? I actually agree with you on this one!
> Boston without Classical music is like Pizza without Cheese!
>
>
> The trouble is, radio is a business, and talk about a format
> that is the furthest thing from that... The logical choice
> is to put Classical on a non-profit like WGBH or some other
> public station. Yes, I think WGBH qualifies, and I think
> it's good that they do not play classical full time.
>
> On the other hand, Boston is a city that should have a
> classical radio station, and the 4 major colleges (Harvard,
> BU, BC and Northeasten) should get together with the city
> leaders to see to it that there is full time Classical
> radio.
>
>
> > What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> > culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> > Classical Music station on its radio dial.
> >
> > Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> > qualify?
> >
> > If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring
> example
> > of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> > indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this
> > city need?
> >
> > At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> > likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
>
> > centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires
>
> > like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
> > fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> > engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the
> > discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> > classical music station.
> >
> > Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> > "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
> > Boston?
> >
>
I remember when South Florida lost its classical music station, the logic was that classical radio couldnt' attract advertisers like Burger King and Pepsi.

Well Duh!But there still are advertisers that want to reach the classical audience, and the audience is upscale. And it's not even a small audience as we can see looking at the ratings.

Losing classical radio in Boston is a short sited mistake.
 
Re: Non white men

> "The real male-targetting stations are the talk stations,
> the sports outlets, WZLX, WBCN, WAAF and WFNX"
>
> According to this logic, which I've seen before, non-white
> men don't listen to the radio!

Considering that the Boston market is about 6% Hispanic and 6% African American, I'm covering the stereotypical preferences of 88% of men in the market.
 
Well, again the problem is that most radio management people come out of radio time sales. They know about selling "spots" for Budweiser and Bufferin but most could care less what the format is. When they get into management the same limited vision thing still applies. All they care about is THE SALE.
But you are right they are short sited. All the high ticket items sell very well on CRB because many who listen to it, while fewer in number than some rap station, have higher desposible incomes. Therefore, the results for the advertisers should be better than many other stations.


> > You know? I actually agree with you on this one!
> > Boston without Classical music is like Pizza without
> Cheese!
> >
> >
> > The trouble is, radio is a business, and talk about a
> format
> > that is the furthest thing from that... The logical choice
>
> > is to put Classical on a non-profit like WGBH or some
> other
> > public station. Yes, I think WGBH qualifies, and I think
> > it's good that they do not play classical full time.
> >
> > On the other hand, Boston is a city that should have a
> > classical radio station, and the 4 major colleges
> (Harvard,
> > BU, BC and Northeasten) should get together with the city
> > leaders to see to it that there is full time Classical
> > radio.
> >
> >
> > > What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> > > culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
>
> > > Classical Music station on its radio dial.
> > >
> > > Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> > > qualify?
> > >
> > > If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring
> > example
> > > of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> > > indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does
> this
> > > city need?
> > >
> > > At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
>
> > > likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and
> cultural
> >
> > > centers but those days seem to be gone.
> Multi-millionaires
> >
> > > like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
>
> > > fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> > > engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep
> the
> > > discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> > > classical music station.
> > >
> > > Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> > > "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
>
> > > Boston?
> > >
> >
> I remember when South Florida lost its classical music
> station, the logic was that classical radio couldnt' attract
> advertisers like Burger King and Pepsi.
>
> Well Duh!But there still are advertisers that want to reach
> the classical audience, and the audience is upscale. And
> it's not even a small audience as we can see looking at the
> ratings.
>
> Losing classical radio in Boston is a short sited mistake.
>
 
How about AM radio??

If Alex Langer, who has regained conrtol of WBIX-1060, is looking for a new format, he should consider classical music.

It's true that it no longer would have the sound quality of FM stereo, but he could run it very inexpensively as an automated/voicetracked operation, and possibly hire away a couple of salespersons from WCRB-102.5 who can tell their former station's advertisers that there's a new home for classical music on Boston-area radio.
 
> You would think that "Friends of The Symphony" and other
> charitable supporters of classical music would step forward.

To try to keep WCRB classical? Would an organization like that actually be able to influence a major market commercial ownership these days, and be able to provide the kind of steady revenue that they (think they) can get with other formats?

Commercial stations today aren't looking for grants and donations like Public Radio stations. They want a steady, maximized revenue stream from advertising. That may have happened many decades ago (back before non-commercial Public Radio was as developed and expenses weren't as high), but I can't see it as being likely in todays economy.


> They won't complain until WCRB becomes a Hip-Hop format.
> Sad.
> Boston will be just another backwater second class city
> without a WCRB or its like.
>
>
>
 
> What does it say about Boston - the alleged center of
> culture for the North East not to have the presence of a
> Classical Music station on its radio dial.
>
> Sure, WGBH-FM does it part-time but does that really
> qualify?
>
> If WCRB goes off the air it will be another glaring example
> of the coarsening of American culture. How many
> indistinguishable rap, rock and hip hop formats does this
> city need?
>
> At the turn of the last century cities could rely on the
> likes of Carneige and others to fund the arts and cultural
> centers but those days seem to be gone. Multi-millionaires
> like Romney, Gabrelli and Mihos would rather spend their
> fortunes on ephermeral self indulging romps of self
> engrandizing than make a financial commitment to keep the
> discriminating arts alive and functioning such as a
> classical music station.
>
> Are there no "angels' out there who will step up to the
> "baton" and keep a commerical classical format alive in
> Boston?
>
Well, politics aside, Paul, it's inconceivable that any visitor to Boston could not find a dedicated classical FM station. The home of the BSO, The Boston Pops...my home, the Rockport Chamber music festival, Tanglewood etc. and yet no full-time FM classical venue? Shameful.(come on corporations, you're write-off is waiting). It really is like pizza without cheese, or Fenway Park without personality.
 
Re: The

> How about AM radio??
>
> If Alex Langer, who has regained conrtol of WBIX-1060, is
> looking for a new format, he should consider classical
> music.
>
> It's true that it no longer would have the sound quality of
> FM stereo, but he could run it very inexpensively as an
> automated/voicetracked operation, and possibly hire away a
> couple of salespersons from WCRB-102.5 who can tell their
> former station's advertisers that there's a new home for
> classical music on Boston-area radio.


I don't think that with the WBIX fidelity and signal that it could attract enough of the former WCRB audience to make enough ad revenue to fly.

Gone are the days forty to fifty years ago when WCRB-AM 1330 could make a go of it because most cars still had only AM radios and many people were still used to AM fidelity for any format (as I remember it well, being my parents station of choice on their car radios back in the day).

Nowadays I think a large portion of the classical audience would more likely get satellite radio, get receivers for HD2 channels, tune to WGBH or WHRB when airing classical, and listen to their own CD's and perhaps even their iPods.

In order for an AM classical station to fly here, wideband analog C-Quam AM stereo would have had to have been fully developed and such receivers would have to be available, and in order to deliver the wideband AM stereo without static and noise for classical music, it would have to be on a better signal than WBIX in the city without a powerful third adjacent (WBZ) and another local third adjacent (WILD), since selectivity goes out the window when listening to AM in wideband.

WBIX's signal strength is adequate for low-fi, compressed talk radio even within the city, but not for classical music with it's dynamic range and quiet passages. The background noise threshold would appear much more intrusive than with talk.

At night, with WBIX's weakened night signal and a 10k heterodyne from 1050 in NYC, classical wouldn't cut it outside of a few nearby metro-west towns.

Here in Somerville in the daytime, the classical pieces occasionally played on the 740 AM WJIB day signal sound excellent on my wideband C-Quam AM stereo just a few miles from their Fresh Pond transmitter, with no local or powerful adjacents more than five steps away on the dial. But, I'm probably one of only a handful of people in WJIB's listening area with receivers that can hear it that way.
 
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