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The End of the Glendive Nielsen Market?

dhett

dhett

Glendive, a small community in east-central Montana, has had the distinction of being Nielsen Marketing's smallest television market, #210, with fewer than 4,000 TV households.

That will likely be history. Stephen Marks, owner of Glendive's only full power television station, KXGN, has passed away, and his estate has, for all practical purposes, donated the station to Montana State University, along with KYUS-TV in Miles City, Montana, which Marks also owned. MSU is changing the licenses of the two stations to non-commercial, all but guaranteeing them to become satellites of KUSM-TV Bozeman as part of MSU's statewide PBS network.

KXGN had been a CBS affiliate on VHF channel 5, and after converting to digital, added NBC on the 5.2 subchannel. Back in the day, Marks hosted a five-minute evening newscast, called Montana East, a true low-budget, locally produced product. On the particular cold February night in 2004 that I saw the broadcast, he was dressed as if he had just come in from hunting and had a look and demeanor that reminded me of almost all the roles that actor Wilford Brimley had played. That newscast was eventually replaced by a regional newscast from the Billings CBS affiliate.

When the new Nielsen market list comes out, I expect there to be only 209 markets. Number 209, for the record, is North Platte, Nebraska.

Another part of television's colorful past is gone, to be replaced with sterile productions, I'm sure. I am glad to have witnessed what TV has been.
 
dhett said:
Glendive, a small community in east-central Montana, has had the distinction of being Nielsen Marketing's smallest television market, #210, with fewer than 4,000 TV households.

That will likely be history. Stephen Marks, owner of Glendive's only full power television station, KXGN, has passed away, and his estate has, for all practical purposes, donated the station to Montana State University, along with KYUS-TV in Miles City, Montana, which Marks also owned. MSU is changing the licenses of the two stations to non-commercial, all but guaranteeing them to become satellites of KUSM-TV Bozeman as part of MSU's statewide PBS network.
. Back in the day, Marks hosted a five-minute evening newscast, called Montana East, a true low-budget, locally produced product. On the particular cold February night in 2004 that I saw the broadcast, he was dressed as if he had just come in from hunting and had a look and demeanor that reminded me of almost all the roles that actor Wilford Brimley had played. That newscast was eventually replaced by a regional newscast from the Billings CBS affiliate.
Click to expand...
It wasn't 5 minutes, but 22 minutes long. Was there a different one with Marks that aired at one time?
 
I stand corrected on the host. There might have been a longer newscast; the one I saw was very short. Then again, it was over 20 years ago; I could have remembered it wrong.

Point being, it was a very short newscast, very local, very rough, no-nonsense, substance over style. I appreciated that.
 
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dhett said:
I stand corrected on the host. There might have been a longer newscast; the one I saw was very short. Then again, it was over 20 years ago; I could have remembered it wrong.

Point being, it was a very short newscast, very local, very rough, no-nonsense, substance over style. I appreciated that.
Click to expand...
And at least one broadcast has been preserved.

It makes me wonder if there are any off-air recordings of KYUS-TV that have yet to be unearthed. My gut tells me, probably not.

But at least we have the Real People segment on the station, which aired in 1980:
 
Rollo-Smokes said:
And at least one broadcast has been preserved.

It makes me wonder if there are any off-air recordings of KYUS-TV that have yet to be unearthed. My gut tells me, probably not.

But at least we have the Real People segment on the station, which aired in 1980:
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Wow. I remember watching that segment when it first aired. I was 10. Always found that station and the one in Glendive to be such interesting anomalies in the business.
 
There's got to be some 80 to 90-year-old rancher in Miles City, Forsyth or Terry that had a VCR 40+ years ago and still has piles of dusty tapes in a wooden cabinet. Thus, I think '80s KYUS and KXGN recordings are out there. But you never see estate sales out that way, ever.
That would be my holy grail in terms of VHS recordings. Maybe someday I'll discover a 1989 recording of KXGN and their CBS shows on a Memorex tape complete w/ commercials.
 
When notable photographer Cliff Naylor of KFYR-TV retired a couple years ago, the station honored him by airing a brief retrospective of his career. How this ties into KXGN is that his first job in TV was at KXGN in the late 1970s. The piece aired on KFYR-TV includes some brief footage of KXGN newscasts from the time. Probably the videos are from a personal collection of airchecks, but it does prove that there are videos of KXGN from the 1970s out there somewhere.

The KXGN footage is around 1:40 in this video. Thanks to the NBA scores, we can say the sports clip dates to January 27, 1978.
 
This little town of Glendive MT continues to fascinate me. I just found out that in addition to having had the smallest TV station in the US, they also have the smallest commercial airport with scheduled airline service in the US.

simpleflying.com

What Is The Smallest Airport In The US?

The US's smallest airport is in Glendive, MT, at Dawson Community Airport.
simpleflying.com simpleflying.com

Does anyone know if KXGN-AM with it's FM translator is being sold or will it go silent?
 
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crainbebo said:
There's got to be some 80 to 90-year-old rancher in Miles City, Forsyth or Terry that had a VCR 40+ years ago and still has piles of dusty tapes in a wooden cabinet. Thus, I think '80s KYUS and KXGN recordings are out there. But you never see estate sales out that way, ever.
That would be my holy grail in terms of VHS recordings. Maybe someday I'll discover a 1989 recording of KXGN and their CBS shows on a Memorex tape complete w/ commercials.
Click to expand...
Even if found, that 80 to 90 year old rancher probably has no clue how to upload it to YouTube! 😃
 
KilowattKat said:
This little town of Glendive MT continues to fascinate me. I just found out that in addition to having had the smallest TV station in the US, they also have the smallest commercial airport with scheduled airline service in the US.

simpleflying.com

What Is The Smallest Airport In The US?

The US's smallest airport is in Glendive, MT, at Dawson Community Airport.
simpleflying.com simpleflying.com

Does anyone know if KXGN-AM with it's FM translator is being sold or will it go silent?
Click to expand...

The MArks stations were sold not long ago to the forner GMs son and a business partner. The radio stations stay on
 
KilowattKat said:
Even if found, that 80 to 90 year old rancher probably has no clue how to upload it to YouTube! 😃
Click to expand...
Don't kid yourself; those old folks had to rely on technology all their lives and had plenty of time during winters to read up on new tech. In the 60s, my uncles - in their 30s and 40s at that time - had the latest tech available, and were never afraid of new technology.
 
The Glendive market's local channels now depend on your provider. If you have Dish and are in/around Glendive, you now get Rapid City affiliates. However, it appears streaming services like YouTube and Fubo are now a strange mix of Billings, national feeds, and reportedly even a Chicago affiliate. I suppose it may continue this way until Nielsen redraws the lines and providers adapt.
 
jwnelson said:
The Glendive market's local channels now depend on your provider. If you have Dish and are in/around Glendive, you now get Rapid City affiliates. However, it appears streaming services like YouTube and Fubo are now a strange mix of Billings, national feeds, and reportedly even a Chicago affiliate. I suppose it may continue this way until Nielsen redraws the lines and providers adapt.
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TV Passport shows them getting a national feed of ABC, and WLNY and WCBS from New York on Fubo. NBC isn't listed.

You'd think they'd just get a straight feed of all network affiliates from Billings. Rapid City is kind of a strange fit for Glendive. Possibly has to do with the most easily-received transponders.
 
That holy grail of recordings was found earlier this fall.
KXGN/CBS commercials, 10/1/1986 part 1

and there's a few more also up. I have a partial KX5 newscast to upload from November 1984 as well!!! Once I can get the Betamax plugged in, that is. I never thought I'd see the day when an eBay lot came up from Glendive...but was I glad to snag it or what? Some of the best stuff I've ever found in over a decade of collecting TV airchecks.

Dish should just give them western ND channels on 6-9PM primetime schedule (KXMD, KUMV, and KMCY Minot), and (with permission) perhaps one Billings affiliate...maybe KTVQ? Would fit better w/ the residents, as KUMV was translated on K13PL for decades in Glendive.
 
crainbebo said:
That holy grail of recordings was found earlier this fall.
KXGN/CBS commercials, 10/1/1986 part 1

and there's a few more also up. I have a partial KX5 newscast to upload from November 1984 as well!!! Once I can get the Betamax plugged in, that is. I never thought I'd see the day when an eBay lot came up from Glendive...but was I glad to snag it or what? Some of the best stuff I've ever found in over a decade of collecting TV airchecks.

Dish should just give them western ND channels on 6-9PM primetime schedule (KXMD, KUMV, and KMCY Minot), and (with permission) perhaps one Billings affiliate...maybe KTVQ? Would fit better w/ the residents, as KUMV was translated on K13PL for decades in Glendive.
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If there is no more Glendive market (and you really can't have a Nielsen market with just PBS stations), the counties now in the Glendive market would likely be assigned to Minot-Bismarck-Dickinson-Williston or Billings. If they were assigned to MBDW, though, adding one Billings station (such as KTVQ) would require them to be deemed orphan counties, and there are a lot of hoops to jump through to get that status. Being able to demonstrate that Billings news was carried on KXGN could be one argument in favor of it.

I didn't know this until I opened up the 2019 Nielsen map a moment ago, but all of northeastern Montana is in the MBDW market. And, theoretically, the Glendive market could be split, as it is comprised of two counties (Dawson and Prairie).
 
crainbebo said:
That holy grail of recordings was found earlier this fall.
KXGN/CBS commercials, 10/1/1986 part 1

and there's a few more also up. I have a partial KX5 newscast to upload from November 1984 as well!!! Once I can get the Betamax plugged in, that is. I never thought I'd see the day when an eBay lot came up from Glendive...but was I glad to snag it or what? Some of the best stuff I've ever found in over a decade of collecting TV airchecks.

Dish should just give them western ND channels on 6-9PM primetime schedule (KXMD, KUMV, and KMCY Minot), and (with permission) perhaps one Billings affiliate...maybe KTVQ? Would fit better w/ the residents, as KUMV was translated on K13PL for decades in Glendive.
Click to expand...

I lived in Williston when there was still a staffed studio just outside of downtown with a 10 or so mintue cutaway for local news and weather.. this was back in... errrmmm..... 2006.
 
IM42A said:
I didn't know this until I opened up the 2019 Nielsen map a moment ago, but all of northeastern Montana is in the MBDW market. And, theoretically, the Glendive market could be split, as it is comprised of two counties (Dawson and Prairie).
Click to expand...
Market boundaries have always been kind of imaginary in northeast Montana. In reality, cable operators and OTA translator districts have long been prone to just rebroadcasting whatever stations are the easiest for them to pick up, even if the stations are technically outside the market.

KUMV is the only in-market station that historically has been widely available. By and large, KXGN was the region's default CBS affiliate, not KXMD. Even now, with KXGN no longer with CBS, KRTV has essentially taken over the role KXGN had as the region's default CBS affiliate.

ABC and Fox have long had such a weak presence in the region that it used to be commonplace for cable operators to take C-band feeds of KMGH and KDVR for their lineups over attempting to import affiliates closer by. Sometime after the digital OTA transition, though, the ABC and Fox affiliates from Great Falls and Billings became more readily available and finally booted Denver TV out of the region.
 
blizzard59 said:
Market boundaries have always been kind of imaginary in northeast Montana.
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Even the Glendive DMA itself was kind of imaginary. Historically single-station markets are prone to being smaller than the coverage areas of the lead station in them because surrounding DMAs, with more stations, could attract a larger total percentage of viewing in the fringe areas. This is also true in markets like Jonesboro AR and Bowling Green KY (which have very similar stories to each other), where the incumbent stations serve areas beyond their DMA lines and at times have had to fight to retain their access to areas that otherwise would be obvious parts of their patch.

Thanks to translators (including K13IG in Richland County, which KXGN owned), KXGN-TV served a larger area than its DMA would have indicated, spanning from the Canadian border to the Wyoming border. In some cases, it was carried by the translator district on the same transmitters as KFBB. Even though KXGN-TV was in the smallest DMA in the country, its service area as a commercial station was a fair bit larger.

As to the networks offered by MVPDs:
  • The cable provider in Glendive, Mid-Rivers, stopped offering cable service in 2023. It offered Billings ABC and Fox plus KUMV for NBC.
  • YouTube TV offered Great Falls ABC and Fox.
  • Dish already offered Rapid City ABC and Fox.
The two counties would have to be reassigned to another DMA based on what people are mostly watching, and to me that suggests one of the two Montana DMAs. Great Falls is actually further than Billings, Bismarck or Rapid City, but it has a fighting chance here.
 


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