TV audio on radios after the loss of analog?

[raccoonradio]

Hope I'm putting this in the right category. In a little over a year analog signals will go away...I guess
people with cable are all set while others will get government subsidized converters. I have already
seen such things at stores as DVD recorders with built in tuners and a disclaimer reading that after
that date, an adapter will be needed etc.

My question is this. There are some portable radios with TV Sound, for analog channels 2-13. Example:
http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Product=4023673
(AM/FM/Weather/TV Sound)

Obviously
the TV audio part won't work after analog goes away but I wonder if radios in the future will be built
with frequencies for the audio part of digital TV?

 

[FightingIrish]

Hope I'm putting this in the right category. In a little over a year analog signals will go away...I guess
people with cable are all set while others will get government subsidized converters. I have already
seen such things at stores as DVD recorders with built in tuners and a disclaimer reading that after
that date, an adapter will be needed etc.

My question is this. There are some portable radios with TV Sound, for analog channels 2-13. Example:
http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Product=4023673
(AM/FM/Weather/TV Sound)

Obviously
the TV audio part won't work after analog goes away but I wonder if radios in the future will be built
with frequencies for the audio part of digital TV?

You bring up some good points. I doubt TV audio will still work, since it will all be digital (ones and zeroes instead of analog waveforms).

As for digital audio capabilities, it's probably similar to the issues with HD Radio, in which a chipset that uses less power can be used successfully in portable devices. There are devices for HD Radio on the horizon, but it will probably be awhile for the TV audio thing, if at all. By that time, there may not even be a market for it.

 

[Stephen_TheMCO]

A friend of mine tried to buy one of those the other day. I successfully steered him away from that purchase after explaining that the TV audio portion won't work after 2009...

With HD radio sales starting to pick up, TV stations could make an agreement with some radio stations, to broadcast their audio on one of the HD radio channels, or do that right away if the parent company of the TV station also own radio stations in the same market. The advantage of doing it on HD radio is that the TV audio could be in full stereo, which is something todays radios with TV audio are unable to do.

However, there has been some talk of being able to broadcast full audio and video to mobile devices like a cell phone, using DVB-H and some of the soon-to-be-auctioned off portion of the RF spectrum in the UHF band. Almost like the video that you can watch on cell phones now, except this would be live broadcasted video over RF, rather than over IP. This would make the idea of rebroadcasting on an HD Radio channel impractical, if this "talk" turns into a working product.

 

[jal41]

With HD radio sales starting to pick up, TV stations could make an agreement with some radio stations, to broadcast their audio on one of the HD radio channels, or do that right away if the parent company of the TV station also own radio stations in the same market. The advantage of doing it on HD radio is that the TV audio could be in full stereo, which is something todays radios with TV audio are unable to do.

Syndex and copyright laws will make it legally impossible to do so on a 24/7 basis. What I could see more of is radio stations and TV stations partnering up to provide severe weather coverage. Of course, one of the reasons why people have TV audio radios is because the local radio stations (at least where I live in Atlanta) refuse to interupt programming (particularly music stations) to cover severe weather.

However, there has been some talk of being able to broadcast full audio and video to mobile devices like a cell phone, using DVB-H and some of the soon-to-be-auctioned off portion of the RF spectrum in the UHF band. Almost like the video that you can watch on cell phones now, except this would be live broadcasted video over RF, rather than over IP. This would make the idea of rebroadcasting on an HD Radio channel impractical, if this "talk" turns into a working product.

TV stations are getting more and more into this space, but the legal issues I mentioned above get into the way with this technology. Almost everyone has a cell phone, and many TV stations (via partnerships with companies that specialize in cell phone alerts) are providing text alerts. Wireless data networks are still pretty slow currently and have a way to go.

Also, in UHF only markets like Huntsville, AL and Fort Wayne, these TV-audio radio have never worked, since they never picked up UHF stations.

 

[AlexBrowne]

Actually, I once had a TV-sound portable radio which picked up UHF as well as VHS. I bought it at Radio Shack about 25 years ago when I worked for a UHF TV station, and it was great for monitoring my station. One day it fell off a ledge and was gone, but it didn't matter because I was then at a VHF TV station. Seven years ago, I was hired by a duopoly -- a VHF/UHF combo -- so I went back to Radio Shack looking for a new portable radio which had UHF as well as VHF. They thought I was crazy, but I assured them that they once did carry such a thing. I don't think such a radio exists any longer, but trust me, it once did!

 

[azumanga]

The funny thing is --why are most TV radios VHF only, even though alot of people watch UHF (either by choice or by necessity)?

 

[KML0224]

I have a Sony Walkman which has the existing VHF TV bands and a weather band. Will the weather band get affected by the changes on TV with digital? Somehow, I doubt it.

As for UHF-only markets (analog), you forgot about the closest one to me: Scranton/Wilkes-Barre in northeastern Pennsylvania.

 

[BRNout]

I have a Sony Walkman which has the existing VHF TV bands and a weather band. Will the weather band get affected by the changes on TV with digital? Somehow, I doubt it.

No, the weather bands will remain unchanged. If anything, there have been efforts in recent years to expand the reach of the NOAA All-Hazards network.

As for TV audio on these units: gone in '09. If you look at websites that sell these types of radios (e.g. JR, Fry's, C Crane Co.) they all have a disclaimer that these radios will no longer work when analogue TV goes away. I wonder what manufacturers will do? If you look at the European models of many popular pocket radios, they substitute LW for TV audio. Could that happen here?

That would at least be interesting, though something tells me that TV audio will replaced by NOTHING.

 

[w9wi]

If you look at the European models of many popular pocket radios, they substitute LW for TV audio. Could that happen here?

LW is on European radios because they have broadcast stations down there. (not many, but there are some) LW won't work any better than analog TV in most US markets after transition.. I suspect you're right, TV audio will be replaced with *nothing*. At some point I can see a means for TV stations to simulcast their audio over the cellphone network, and you'll listen to TV programs on the phone. Provided they come up with a phone with better battery life.

 

[ssetta]

Nobody really listens to TV audio. It's somewhat useless, because a lot of the time, you won't know what they're talking about unless you can see what's going on.

 

[BRNout]

Nobody really listens to TV audio. It's somewhat useless, because a lot of the time, you won't know what they're talking about unless you can see what's going on.

I've gotta agree with you here. At least the Euro models of certain radios give you a shot at LW if you're traveling overseas. I never got much out of the VHF-TV audio and recently bought a Sangean radio with it, despite the warning about the shutoff. Never use it anyway.

Perhaps we'll get more radios with the NOAA All-Hazards stations. That's a useful feature.

 

[raccoonradio]

>>I doubt TV audio will still work, since it will all be digital

btw at work tonight I was in the break room and Boston's NBC affiliate was on the TV. I noticed via
my Walkman that the TV was slightly delayed; my radio was picking up the audio signal while the TV
had digital.
And I was in a Target and noticed a Sony AM/FM/TV Sound/Cassette player and there was that
disclaimer: the TV Sound won't work after Feb of 09.

 

[raccoonradio]

>>there has been some talk of being able to broadcast full audio and video to mobile devices like a cell phone

Yes I saw that online, probably on Wikipedia's page about Digital TV

Also I think I had (MANY years ago) one of those radios that could pick up TV audio from UHF as well
as VHF.

 

[ixnay]

Nobody really listens to TV audio. It's somewhat useless, because a lot of the time, you won't know what they're talking about unless you can see what's going on.

To a degree, they come in handy when there's a power failure.

My mother was a "Matlock" fan. She's always liked crime dramas and lawyer shows ever since "The FBI". One night we were getting ready to watch the back part of a two-part "Matlock" episode when we lost power right before air time. I got out my radio and we listened to part two on the TV band. I think it was the two parter where Ben had to defend the instigator of a prison riot - from inside the prison.

ixnay

 

[Madmansam]

Nobody really listens to TV audio. It's somewhat useless, because a lot of the time, you won't know what they're talking about unless you can see what's going on.

To a degree, they come in handy when there's a power failure.

My mother was a "Matlock" fan. She's always liked crime dramas and lawyer shows ever since "The FBI". One night we were getting ready to watch the back part of a two-part "Matlock" episode when we lost power right before air time. I got out my radio and we listened to part two on the TV band. I think it was the two parter where Ben had to defend the instigator of a prison riot - from inside the prison.

ixnay

They were popular back in the 1970's, when TV's cost an arm and a leg. Most households then usually had one TV. So TV Audio Radios were popular. I believe (though I might be wrong), but RADIO SHACK created the first TV AUDIO RADIOS? BTW, I do remember the VHS/UHF TV Audio radios. Very popular in the Fresno area with ALL UHF ANALOG TV STATIONS. (or at least in the 1970's.)

 

[Markxxx]

People in big metro areas use them. I use it in the park, while walking to work and walking to the gym.

Older people who want to get out and listen to their "Stories" in the park. I see them.

I can see the issue with the loss of TV audio as so many stations will be on UHF, and I can't see the radios w/TV audio having PISP so you'd have to know the ACTUAL channel number not the virtual channel number.

 

[w9wi]

I can see the issue with the loss of TV audio as so many stations will be on UHF, and I can't see the radios w/TV audio having PISP so you'd have to know the ACTUAL channel number not the virtual channel number.

It has nothing to do with the stations being on UHF. (it would not be at all difficult to build an analog TV sound radio that worked on UHF, indeed I'm rather surprised so few such sets were built)

If you did build a TV sound radio that received DTV sound, you'd *have* to decode the PSIP - in order to know which datastream(s) included the sound, and to allow selection of which subchannel to listen to - adding the ability to display the virtual-channel data would really be rather trivial.

 

[Markxxx]

I wonder what that would do to the cost adding the decoding features for Digital TV. I imagine someone will build one if it becomes cheap enough.

I got my Sony Cassette Walkman with AM-FM-TV(2-13) and weather radio for only $9.99 back in 2001. I like it to listen to books on tape from the library

 

[vibe]

One can occasionally find a used 2" HH TV or a very small lightweight portable TV at the thrifts for well under $10. I saw one at $4.99 which I passed on. Of course the shelf life of the product is a known fact, Feb, 2009 (unless this becomes a political issue in next year's Presidential election).
Yes, people still isten to TV audio- my sweetie loves to listen to TV shows on Ch 6 in the car.

 

[w9wi]

I wonder what that would do to the cost adding the decoding features for Digital TV. I imagine someone will build one if it becomes cheap enough.

That's a good question. For TV sets the extra cost of a DTV decoder seems to have disappeared - a DTV now sells for essentially the same price as an equivalent analog set sold for just before companies stopped making them.

From what I've been hearing power consumption (battery life) has been a bigger issue than cost.