Wall St Journal radio network gone at end of year

[Ravens]

They never replaced agency spots with PSAs. They replaced them with more host reads and 1-800 spots. From what I've seen, at least for Rush, he's made up for lost agency money with other stuff. But it's had an effect in other places. Let me know if you're hearing McDonalds or Home Depot in Rush.

I work when Rush is on, but I know for a fact that Home Depot runs during some of our syndicated programming. Hannity if I had to guess. They also buy time in the barter spots for syndicated stuff.

The "do not runs" have not stopped. Also if your station runs any syndication, they ALL come with instructions for "do not run in Rush Limbaugh or any controversial programming." Those are the exact words I see every day.

I've never seen one since about 2 weeks after Sandra Fluke. In two different stations, both of which ran Rush. Are they hiding them from me? Is it a conspiracy?

 

[TheBigA]

I work when Rush is on, but I know for a fact that Home Depot runs during some of our syndicated programming. Hannity if I had to guess.

Can you tell if they're in local or network breaks?

I've never seen one since about 2 weeks after Sandra Fluke.

Then you're the only one. Ask your sales people.

For all I know, your station could be ignoring the ban. If it's not owned by a major company, they probably don't care.

 

[davideduardo]

They did build it. It was called Air America. It bombed.

As I said, because it was not entertaining. Too much intensity, not enough fun and entertainment.

Did you ever look for it?

Yes. I've done talk as a programmer in a number of different countries as well as in half of the top 10 markets in the US. And I have both done research for the general format and used it as a programmer.

 

[davideduardo]

You're still dealing with the AM platform, and the potential audience for that, regardless of the entertainment value or political perspective, is limited.

That is the biggest impediment to revitalizing present-day AM talkers. I was thinking more generically about the format, and not the band.

There have been discussions over the years of bringing The Daily Show or something like that to radio, and the cost simply exceeds the potential revenue.

With real-dollar radio revenues considerably off from the 90's and early 2000's, it's just not affordable.

 

[FredLeonard]

Before the great purge in the early-mid 90s, the leading talk stations' line-ups included both liberal and conservative hosts. When David Eduardo dismisses the quality and appeal of progressive talk out of hand, he seems to be forgetting Michael Jackson in his hometown.

People who equate progressive talk with Air America Radio (not "Air America"), they overlook the fact that the three most successful national progressive talk shows were not produced by AAR: Stephanie Miller, Thom Hartmann and Ed Schultz.

Major broadcasters, like Bain Channel, set up the format to fail. They stuck progressive talk mostly on weak stick, high-end of the band AM stations, with little or no promotion and then pulled the plug before any new format could be expected to establish itself. There is evidence Bain Channel only wanted to head off a threat to restore The Fairness Doctrine and when that threat lessened, they pulled the plug.

AAR was on AM after it became close to impossible for any new format to succeed on AM. AM can hold an audience but it can no longer create one. The successful right-wing talk stations are almost all blow-torches that evolved from highly successful full service stations and news/talk stations with diverse host line-ups. Progressive talk stations did about as well as Salem talkers and other 2nd tier right-wing talk stations.

AAR hired a corrupt Republican political operative to run their "network." And he ran it into the ground. Their biggest mistake was to do progressive talk in the style of demagogic right-wing talk and to expect progressives to respond to that.

People who listen to right-wing talk tend to be working class, uneducated, angry and bigoted. They are true believers and authoritarian personalities. They respond to fundamentalist preachers and haranguing talk show hosts who feed them THE TRUTH. No original thought or critical thinking needed or wanted.

Radio has been fertile soil for people like Rush.... all the way back to Father Coughlin and Adolph Hitler.

 

[SaltyDog]

With real-dollar radio revenues considerably off from the 90's and early 2000's, it's just not affordable.

Yeah, but as you wrote on an earlier thread: " radio revenues are up from $12 billion to $17 billion in the last 5 years." So things are moving in the right direction and it's odd that they would bail out now, right?

 

[Ravens]

Can you tell if they're in local or network breaks?

Sure, I can see what the computer is running. I've heard Home Depot on network and on barter spots.

For all I know, your station could be ignoring the ban. If it's not owned by a major company, they probably don't care.

Anything we get from those big companies like Home Depot would be coming from Clear Channel or Dial. All I can say is what I've seen from my experience. On this end, it doesn't seem to be as bad as what we're being told.

 

[Ravens]

People who listen to right-wing talk tend to be working class, uneducated, angry and bigoted. They are true believers and authoritarian personalities. They respond to fundamentalist preachers and haranguing talk show hosts who feed them THE TRUTH. No original thought or critical thinking needed or wanted.

Radio has been fertile soil for people like Rush.... all the way back to Father Coughlin and Adolph Hitler.

This may be the most bigoted thing I've seen all day. And I saw what the New England Patriots posted on Twitter last night. You're a miserable and ignorant little man.

http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...cludes-word/wotpbKIKJTc7msOE8ETPhJ/story.html

 

[boombox4]

I know I'm going to miss the morning Wall Street Journal report. And here in my market it's on FM.

It's also pretty sad when news and business shows are somehow considered 'controversial'. Since when is news reporting too 'controversial' to run someone's ads? Do the people in ad agencies even listen to the shows? Shows like the WSJ Morning show and America In The Morning are no more controversial than most programming on NPR.

 

[TheBigA]

Major broadcasters, like Bain Channel, set up the format to fail. They stuck progressive talk mostly on weak stick, high-end of the band AM stations, with little or no promotion and then pulled the plug before any new format could be expected to establish itself.

The fact is that no one puts a 24/7 format of any kind on strong station. That includes sports, music, news or talk. So blaming CC for the failure of AAR is ignoring the fact that every network like it, including CNN Radio (news), Evergreen Radio (all-female), WSJ Radio (business), and even Radio Disney have all failed. So don't single Air America out because of its politics.

 

[TheBigA]

It's also pretty sad when news and business shows are somehow considered 'controversial'.

No one has said they're controversial.

 

[davideduardo]

Before the great purge in the early-mid 90s, the leading talk stations' line-ups included both liberal and conservative hosts. When David Eduardo dismisses the quality and appeal of progressive talk out of hand, he seems to be forgetting Michael Jackson in his hometown.

Michael Jackson was not "purged". His ratings went from bad to dismal, and he suffered the fate of all low rated personalites.

By the way, Air America began as Air America Media, became Air America Radio and at the end was just Air America.

Major broadcasters, like Bain Channel, set up the format to fail. They stuck progressive talk mostly on weak stick, high-end of the band AM stations,

Very untrue. In LA it was on a 50 kw station at 1150 that puts a much better signal over the metro than stations like KHJ, KABC and KFWB have. In Portland, it went on the former KGW 620, which has better day coverage than KEX. In Miami, it went on 50 kw WINZ. In fact, of all the operators, Clear Channel put Air America on perhaps the best signals and definitely the most signals.

with little or no promotion and then pulled the plug before any new format could be expected to establish itself.

They gave it at least a year more than anyone expected, given the low ratings and the troubled finances at AA.

There is evidence Bain Channel only wanted to head off a threat to restore The Fairness Doctrine and when that threat lessened, they pulled the plug.

There is absolutely no evidence of that. If you have any, please give links or sources. Of course, you can't.

AAR was on AM after it became close to impossible for any new format to succeed on AM. AM can hold an audience but it can no longer create one. The successful right-wing talk stations are almost all blow-torches that evolved from highly successful full service stations and news/talk stations with diverse host line-ups.

Air America went on during the tail end of a major peak in AM talk listening in 2004. The decline in AM has come in part due to aging demos and to a great extent due to PPM, which did not start rolling out until 2008. By 2008, Air America had been through bankruptcy, and was sold to some liberals who knew nothing about radio.

People who listen to right-wing talk tend to be working class, uneducated, angry and bigoted. They are true believers and authoritarian personalities. They respond to fundamentalist preachers and haranguing talk show hosts who feed them THE TRUTH. No original thought or critical thinking needed or wanted.

Thats a vile, mean and disgusting statement.

Radio has been fertile soil for people like Rush.... all the way back to Father Coughlin and Adolph Hitler.

I invoke Godwin's Law. You lose.

 

[TheBigA]

Anything we get from those big companies like Home Depot would be coming from Clear Channel or Dial. All I can say is what I've seen from my experience. On this end, it doesn't seem to be as bad as what we're being told.

Every communication I've received for Home Depot spots, as recently as yesterday, has the following notation:

Cannot air in Rush Limbaugh or in or adjacent to any other controversial programming. Please ensure a minimum separation of 30 minutes between Home Depot spots.

As I said, perhaps your station is choosing to ignore this. That doesn't mean it's not being sent.

 

[FredLeonard]

Michael Jackson was not "purged". His ratings went from bad to dismal, and he suffered the fate of all low rated personalites.

By the way, Air America began as Air America Media, became Air America Radio and at the end was just Air America.



Very untrue. In LA it was on a 50 kw station at 1150 that puts a much better signal over the metro than stations like KHJ, KABC and KFWB have. In Portland, it went on the former KGW 620, which has better day coverage than KEX. In Miami, it went on 50 kw WINZ. In fact, of all the operators, Clear Channel put Air America on perhaps the best signals and definitely the most signals.



They gave it at least a year more than anyone expected, given the low ratings and the troubled finances at AA.



There is absolutely no evidence of that. If you have any, please give links or sources. Of course, you can't.



Air America went on during the tail end of a major peak in AM talk listening in 2004. The decline in AM has come in part due to aging demos and to a great extent due to PPM, which did not start rolling out until 2008. By 2008, Air America had been through bankruptcy, and was sold to some liberals who knew nothing about radio.



Thats a vile, mean and disgusting statement.



I invoke Godwin's Law. You lose.

David, you can be counted on slavishly to provide the industry line.

In addition to being infested with right-winger, radio is filled with compulsive liars. Of course, there is a great deal of over-lap between those two groups.

You’re entitled to your own opinions. You’re not entitled to your own facts.

True conservatives have been forced into being "re-branded" as "libertarians." The Republican Party used to have class and to include the better people. Then Nixon made his Faustian bargain and brought in Southern Democrats and Archie Bunker types from other regions. The party of Lincoln became the party of Joe McCarthy (and Nixon).

 

[L Chanon Gade]

Wrong. One of the reasons so many people vote for liberal candidates and support the liberal agenda is that one needs to refrain from all thinking. To be a liberal means to replace thinking with feeling. That's why people who vote liberal choose to listen to entertainment, like music format radio, rather than having listen to spoken word programming that requires thinking.

They did build it. It was called Air America. It bombed.

Well, there you go, classic AM talk radio listener. . . It was easy enough for you...all you did was replace 'conservative" with "liberal".

If you had ever bothered to actually listen to talk shows on non-commercial radio, you would find that most of the offerings are talk. It is true that NPR/PRI don't offer much in the way of call-ins, but most local affils do. Here in new York WNYC has two such shows for a total of four hours per weekday. The difference between these callers and the "mega dittos" and 'Great Americans' on the two dying commercial stations would be clear, and probably uncomfortable for you.

Well, thanks anyway, you filled my "stupid quota" for the day.

Chan/NYC

 

[davideduardo]

David, you can be counted on slavishly to provide the industry line.

In addition to being infested with right-winger, radio is filled with compulsive liars. Of course, there is a great deal of over-lap between those two groups.

If you check the actual facts, you will see that you are the one that posted inaccurate data.

1. Clear Channel put some major, big coverage stations on with Air America Media when it started. They gave them several years to succeed, but the multiple crisis points at the network along with wholly un-entertaining hosts doomed the project.

2. The network changed name three times. You are wrong that it was only called "Air America Radio". It had two other names in its short lifespan.

3. Michael Jackson was losing badly when he was removed from the air at KABC in the Summer of 1997; in the Spring book Rush was #2 and Michael was 9th, and in 25-54 Michael was not even in the top 15 (KFI had a 5.1 in the sales demo and KABC was below a 2 share). In fact, talk host Amalia González on my KTNQ beat Jackson as well!

4. Your obfuscation attempt by calling me a liar and an industry drone do little to cover up the fact that you have no proof that Clear Channel affiliated multiple stations with Air America out of concerns for a return of the Fairness Doctrine. Nor do you have proof that there was any significant movement at the legislative or regulatory level to to bring back Fairness.

5. If you look at the panorama of significant major market talkers, they were, with really no significant exceptions, all in very good health in 2004 when Air America started. The PPM was still 4 years away and the 25-54 erosion was still not hurting revenues. It was still a good time to try to introduce a new talk network using mostly AM affiliates. Now, 10 years later, those 45-54's are 55-64 and out of the sales demos but back then there was an under-55 audience and it used AM radio.

6. No matter how you phrase it, your comparison of Limbaugh with Hitler is both utterly vile and inaccurate. Limbaugh is a radio entertainer, while Hitler was a Fascist leader of a foreign country... one is dependent on ratings while the other was the maximum authority in his nation.

All 6 points are verifiable. I have even given you some ratings data that disproves one of your mistaken statements.

 

[FredLeonard]

Whatever! It's strange how y'all on the right keep harping about left-wing media bias and get so incredulous when the suggestion is made that a pervasive right-wing monopoly in talk radio is just a random occurrence or an accident, nothing deliberate or systematic (pay no attention to the man behind the curtain).

Maybe, just maybe, all the ranting about left-wing media bias is just a skillful ploy to distract attention from how the corporate elite uses and controls the media.

Funny how progressive talk radio (including but not limited to AAR) was hit with do not buy tags from the very start.

 

[davideduardo]

Funny how progressive talk radio (including but not limited to AAR) was hit with do not buy tags from the very start.

Untrue.

Some clients wanted no controversial talk at all, and simply did not buy any kind of talk... right, left or center.

The reason that Air America affiliates did not get bought is that they had, except for the possible exception of Portland OR, Seattle and perhaps the station in ME, no ratings that would get them on any transactional buy of any kind.

Music stations with similar ratings did not get on buys, either.

The only "do not buy" that was in effect was more of the "don't buy any station that can't make our CPP goal". That criteria is in effect now and has been in effect for decades.

 

[davideduardo]

Whatever! It's strange how y'all on the right keep harping about left-wing media bias and get so incredulous when the suggestion is made that a pervasive right-wing monopoly in talk radio is just a random occurrence or an accident, nothing deliberate or systematic (pay no attention to the man behind the curtain).

Maybe, just maybe, all the ranting about left-wing media bias is just a skillful ploy to distract attention from how the corporate elite uses and controls the media.

Untrue.

In the case of groups like Clear Channel that affiliated stations with Air America, there was a great hope that the format would succeed. Clear had more AMs than it could successfully program in a number of markets, so having both a conservative and a progressive talk option was something they encouraged because it could make yet another of the AMs in quite a few markets into a viable property.

 

[FredLeonard]

True. I saw the paperwork. It specifically said not to place spots in or adjacent to Air America Radio programs. No exception for Portland, Seattle or anyplace else.

Meanwhile, the same advertisers were allow spot placement in Rush, et al.