WHGH-AM 840 Thomasville petitioning FCC to have license reinstated

[tomservo]

No, the coordinates are just wrong. I did find it, thanks to your help poledo, downtown. The coordinates for both the AM and the translator's CP are about 6-7 blocks west of where they really are. Though street view on Google you can even see there's a small "WPAX" sign hung on the tower. (WTUF broadcasts from Boston.)

I was under the impression it was like WSM's tower—diamond-shaped, but this is just a conventional self-supporter. I guess I figured Blaw-Knox only made the other kind!

 

[Louis_009]

WPAX-AM 1240 does reach Tallahassee but if u go south of Tallahassee u will lose there singal. Also WPAX is on FM on 103.7 W279BD-FM 103.7 MHz translator.

 

[Kmagrill]

On the other hand, this is America, damn it! And many people have much more money than I've ever even dreamed of having, and if they want to spend some on the radio business, they have every right.

True. Often, very true.

But also, I have twice seen locally run stand alone AM stations succeed as businesses, even if they don't generate a big ratings number. Two examples are WVLG in the Villages and WSBB in New Smyrna Beach. Of course, there are differences, but one big key to survival seems to be getting very plugged into the community, which is a pretty good idea for any radio station.

Not only that, but with a string of 250-watt FM translators spaced about every 20 miles or-so, they could actually make The Big 84 the Flagship of a network serving the Entire Southland...

Unfortunately, no. The current FCC rules preclude being on any translators beyond the 2mV contour or 40km from the station, whichever is less.

 

[Poledo]

No, the coordinates are just wrong. I did find it, thanks to your help poledo, downtown. The coordinates for both the AM and the translator's CP are about 6-7 blocks west of where they really are. Though street view on Google you can even see there's a small "WPAX" sign hung on the tower. (WTUF broadcasts from Boston.)

WTUF is co-owned and run from the same building.

 

[amfmxm]

But also, I have twice seen locally run stand alone AM stations succeed as businesses, even if they don't generate a big ratings number. Two examples are WVLG in the Villages and WSBB in New Smyrna Beach. Of course, there are differences, but one big key to survival seems to be getting very plugged into the community, which is a pretty good idea for any radio station.

Not only that, but with a string of 250-watt FM translators spaced about every 20 miles or-so, they could actually make The Big 84 the Flagship of a network serving the Entire Southland...

Unfortunately, no. The current FCC rules preclude being on any translators beyond the 2mV contour or 40km from the station, whichever is less.

I was thinking non-commercial rules, I guess. And, hey, most likely there wouldn't be any commercials, anyway.

And, yes, there are indeed exceptions. There always are... to every rule. The Villages, itself, is extremely unusual. And in certain circumstances, one exceptional individual--a great leader, a great salesperson, a genius (in whatever fashion)--may be all you need. A charismatic broadcaster can be especially impactful in a small community...

 

[drt]

But also, I have twice seen locally run stand alone AM stations succeed as businesses, even if they don't generate a big ratings number. Two examples are WVLG in the Villages and WSBB in New Smyrna Beach. Of course, there are differences, but one big key to survival seems to be getting very plugged into the community, which is a pretty good idea for any radio station.

I'm in the area of Ridge Manor East/Webster several days a week and enjoy listening to WVLG; that said WVLG is owned by the Villages corporation has very very deep pockets. I do enjoy their live and local sound, music, jingles, live and local weather 24/7 but they seem to be mainly a promotional tool for promotion of The Villages; a good deal of their ads are for real estate in the Villages and then they do a lot of promotions for The Villages Daily Sun (a good sized quality daily newspaper, which is becoming a rarity these days.) as well as PSA's for events going on in The Villages.

drt,
st. petersburg,fl (mostly)



[/quote]

 

[amfmxm]

Unless wikipedia is making it up (always a possibility) The Villages is the fastest growing community on the planet--or at least in the United States--nearly doubling population just since 2010, to nearly 100,000 people. As the only local radio station... a fulltime AM with a solid night-time signal... in a town full of older folks--that is, people my age--who know how to tune an AM radio... all helps.

WSBB in NSB doesn't have it quite as cushy, but it does have a town of 22,000 (in a metro of 500,000) all to itself. And, yeah, that 1-killowatt non-DA rig on 1230--what we once knew as a Class IV--is a perfectly good little stick for a community that size. It can be the Voice of New Smyrna Beach and the bigger players in Daytona are happy to let them play that role.

840/WHGH was/is an AM daytimer in a town of 18,000 that's already pretty well served by other broadcasters. The proverbial "one-armed paperhanger" may do okay if he's the only paperhanger in a small town, but if he's gotta compete with other well-established two-armed paperhangers, it's a helluva handicap to overcome.

Being an AM is already a handicap. Being an AM daytimer is a double-handicap.

 

[drt]

The Wikipedia article would be pretty accurate in this case; I know their newspaper, according to ABC figures is the fastest growing newspaper in the United States, but I'm sure the rate of growth will eventually slack off, since right now the increased circulation is due to the area's fast growth and that growth will have to slow down as they run out of land to buy.

The Villages over the last decade to 14 years has bought up nearly every tract of land within about a six or 7 mile radius of Spanish Springs, of the original Villages. A small town nearby (Oxford, FL) now only has a church, a post office and one or two other businesses and at the most maybe 6 hold out home owners.

The radio station does suffer from strong interference of the Cuban 640 at night once you get more than 25-30 miles from their tower near the Lake/Sumter county line, but not within the Villages, where the tower is (s.s.e. of Lake Sumter Landing); the tower had been in the nearby town of Wildwood. They apparently have good grounding, as their signal really is impressive for 930 watts day and 860 watts night.

The Villages cover portions of three counties, Lake county (part of the Orlando radio market),Marion county (part of the Gainesville/Ocala market) and Sumter county (no market claims Sumter county). At night it is the only local AM receivable within the Villages.

Getting back to WVLG 640; most of their air staff are retired radio people, including people who have done stints at WABC and CKLW.



drt

 

[Kmagrill]

I'm in the area of Ridge Manor East/Webster several days a week and enjoy listening to WVLG; that said WVLG is owned by the Villages corporation has very very deep pockets. I do enjoy their live and local sound, music, jingles, live and local weather 24/7 but they seem to be mainly a promotional tool for promotion of The Villages; a good deal of their ads are for real estate in the Villages and then they do a lot of promotions for The Villages Daily Sun (a good sized quality daily newspaper, which is becoming a rarity these days.) as well as PSA's for events going on in The Villages.

drt,
st. petersburg,fl (mostly)[/color]

WVLG has not always been such a subset of the Villages newspaper. For a while, they were run as a semi-independent operation and had achieved substantial billing. However, the overall media director is a newspaper man who doesn't seem to realize that print media is dying. Or maybe he does realize it and is just afraid of the WVLG potential. In any case, the word went out from his office that WVLG was no longer allowed to sell advertising to any client of the newspaper, past or present. The newspaper, however is allowed to bonus print advertisers with free spots on WVLG. Naturally, the top people at WVLG quit in frustration. That was 3 years ago and not much has changed since. WVLG remains a shell of its former self. They do, however, have a fantastic pool of former major market air talent there. It's quite something to hear.

 

[level42]

The "small WPAX sign" on the tower is actually about 30 ft. tall...it's the original neon sign that went up with the tower...and yes...it still works and runs every night. WPAX is only on its third owner since it went on the air in 1929...still has its original Blaw-Knox tower, and still has the original neon sign. Not too many stations can say that.

Interesting about the coordinates being wrong, I will have that looked into.

Concerning WHGH, great sounding AM with a great signal (when it was on the air). Daggum shame Mr. Gross let the renewal slip by, it's actually a nice facility and had a loyal local audience.

 

[Poledo]

Is WPAX the oldest radio station in the US south of Atlanta? At least the oldest one still running? Or maybe just the oldest Georgia radio station south of ATL?

 

[rnigma1]

It's supposed to be the third oldest in Georgia behind WSB and WMAZ, all coming on within months of each other in 1922.

 

[Poledo]

It's supposed to be the third oldest in Georgia behind WSB and WMAZ, all coming on within months of each other in 1922.

So how large would the daytime coverage areas of WSB, WMAZ, and WPAX been back in 1922? Or in other words, what portion of the Georgia population would have had access to daytime radio?

Also, if they all came on within a few months of each other, why didn't WMAZ (Macon?) and WPAX get three letter calls?

 

[Kmagrill]

Is WPAX the oldest radio station in the US south of Atlanta? At least the oldest one still running? Or maybe just the oldest Georgia radio station south of ATL?

WRUF-AM claims to have gone on the air in 1928 using a T type antenna located between two self-supporting towers located on the west side of the University of Florida campus on (what else?) Radio Road. When the station moved in 1948, the towers were sold to the Gainesville Police Dept. and WGGG. One of the two towers still (partly) stands at the abandoned WGGG studios.

 

[radioboy]

WHGH is back on the air today following a petition for reinstatement.

 

[amfmxm]

It's supposed to be the third oldest in Georgia behind WSB and WMAZ, all coming on within months of each other in 1922.

So how large would the daytime coverage areas of WSB, WMAZ, and WPAX been back in 1922? Or in other words, what portion of the Georgia population would have had access to daytime radio?

Also, if they all came on within a few months of each other, why didn't WMAZ (Macon?) and WPAX get three letter calls?

Two great questions, Poledo--and worth waiting a couple months for an answer, eh?

WSB, MAZ and PAX would have been listenable for much greater distances than today--even in the daytime. With only a handful of radio stations on the air, worldwide, there was a lot less station-to-station interference. But there was also a lot less interference from electrical equipment, in general--because electricity was still not available through most of rural America, at the time--and it was still a fairly new and novel contraption.

And people were listening on much better--more receptive--AM radios than the pieces of shit we have today, too.

I know that during the earliest years of radio, all stations actually used the same frequency--approximately 833 kHz. I don't recall when the feds started spreading them out onto other channels, but it is possible (I guess) that WSB, WMAZ & WPAX may have "shared time"--each broadcasting for a few hours, each day. Maybe one of the historians among us can clarify.

The three-letter calls went out to just a handful of stations before the federales realized that they'd run out, way too quickly. So they switched to four-letter calls after only a year or two...

 

[rnigma1]

And if you had no electricity, you could still listen to radio on a crystal set.

 

[Poledo]

I knew that AM stations had to change frequencies several times while the predecessor to the FCC was trying to figure out how to divvy up the spectrum. I had no idea that old radio, even as new as the early 1920's, all shared the same frequency. Guess I'm going to have to go out and research that on the old interwebster. It would be cool if the official Georgia Radio Historians, Jay Braswell or Art Sutton, jumped in right now and filled in some details on this thread.

I know my great x? grandparents were the first household to have electricity in Bainbridge back before 1910 (maybe 1903?), but they weren't early adopters of radio or TV so I doubt they even knew WPAX or WSB existed... especially when the Great Depression started in the late 1920's.