Why are San Francisco DJs so much worse than other markets?

[scooty430]

San Francisco is a pleasant enough place, but is really a small, insular town masquerading as a world-class city. The same thing you describe with the radio DJs also seems to be true with their TV newshosts, by the way.

I would say that KFOG's Dave Morey is a great DJ, someone with a natural, but smooth speaking voice, great knowledge of music, and luckily the rare freedom to choose an hour of music per day.

 

[LKellerIII]

San Francisco is a pleasant enough place, but is really a small, insular town masquerading as a world-class city. The same thing you describe with the radio DJs also seems to be true with their TV newshosts, by the way.

I would say that KFOG's Dave Morey is a great DJ, someone with a natural, but smooth speaking voice, great knowledge of music, and luckily the rare freedom to choose an hour of music per day.

I couldn't agree more with both of those statements if I'd written them myself. I moved here in the mid 70s from LA, and I could BELIEVE how small town and amateurish the local TV news was compared to what I was used to. And the SF Chronicle reminded me of the small suburban daily papers in LA more than the LA Times, or any good big city paper like the NY Times or the Chicago Tribune.

But it was NOT true of radio here then. KCBS was a excellent news staion equal to either of the 2 news stations in LA, KGO was a much BETTER talk station than KABC and the others in LA. Top 40 KFRC was a much higher class station than it's Bill Drake counterpart in LA (KHJ). KSFO was a world-class "MOR" station, the equal to its LA sister station (KMPC). It was still a great time for album rock "underground" stations - and that format started in San Francisco in the late 60s here at KSAN and KMPX - at least on the West Coast. The LA versions were originally programmed by Tom Donahue out of San Francisco.

In terms of radio - the Bay Area was the equal of the LA or New York markets THEN. Not now, sadly...

 

[romer979fm]

hmmmm well i know many former jocks from there ... they were all on tape.
i am not just talking out of my ass ya know.

[/quote]

of course you are..."tape"? who are you talking to...jocks in the year 1978?

 

[scooty430]

San Francisco is a pleasant enough place, but is really a small, insular town masquerading as a world-class city. The same thing you describe with the radio DJs also seems to be true with their TV newshosts, by the way.

I would say that KFOG's Dave Morey is a great DJ, someone with a natural, but smooth speaking voice, great knowledge of music, and luckily the rare freedom to choose an hour of music per day.

I couldn't agree more with both of those statements if I'd written them myself. I moved here in the mid 70s from LA, and I could BELIEVE how small town and amateurish the local TV news was compared to what I was used to. And the SF Chronicle reminded me of the small suburban daily papers in LA more than the LA Times, or any good big city paper like the NY Times or the Chicago Tribune.

But it was NOT true of radio here then. KCBS was a excellent news staion equal to either of the 2 news stations in LA, KGO was a much BETTER talk station than KABC and the others in LA. Top 40 KFRC was a much higher class station than it's Bill Drake counterpart in LA (KHJ). KSFO was a world-class "MOR" station, the equal to its LA sister station (KMPC). It was still a great time for album rock "underground" stations - and that format started in San Francisco in the late 60s here at KSAN and KMPX - at least on the West Coast. The LA versions were originally programmed by Tom Donahue out of San Francisco.

In terms of radio - the Bay Area was the equal of the LA or New York markets THEN. Not now, sadly...

You're probably right that radio was once as good as, perhaps better, during those times. Certainly San Fran had some innovative bands at the time (Dead, Airplane, Santana, Stevie Miller, CCR) that most likely fed into the quality of the radio. Of course, LA had its own stuff - Byrds, Doors, Love, Zappa, Little Feat, CSNY, Mamas and Papas, etc. so it's hard to say which music scene was more potent.

I do always hear so much about KHJ being the originator, so I imagine some would question it being inferior to anyplace else. (Wasn't around to hear it.) Definitely the FM underground stuff had "San Francisco" all over it, even though I'd say KPPC and KMET quickly took on their own style. You also have to consider KROQ from 78 to 86 as a true L.A. original. Definitely agree about KGO - I used to be able to hear that at night down here, actually.

 

[LKellerIII]

[/quote]

You're probably right that radio was once as good as, perhaps better, during those times. Certainly San Fran had some innovative bands at the time (Dead, Airplane, Santana, Stevie Miller, CCR) that most likely fed into the quality of the radio. Of course, LA had its own stuff - Byrds, Doors, Love, Zappa, Little Feat, CSNY, Mamas and Papas, etc. so it's hard to say which music scene was more potent.

I do always hear so much about KHJ being the originator, so I imagine some would question it being inferior to anyplace else. (Wasn't around to hear it.) Definitely the FM underground stuff had "San Francisco" all over it, even though I'd say KPPC and KMET quickly took on their own style. You also have to consider KROQ from 78 to 86 as a true L.A. original. Definitely agree about KGO - I used to be able to hear that at night down here, actually.
[/quote]

Scooty - I was probably engaging in a little hyperbole - I experienced underground FM radio in LA first, a few years before I moved to the Bay Area - so you're probably right when you say that the LA stations took on their individual styles - my favorite was KPPC during the Les Carter era - certainly there was nothing to equal it in the Bay Area when I arrived,,,though sadly, that KPPC era was short-lived, and gone by 1971 anyway.

As far as Bill Drake goes - people argue about the origins of the Drake format that became the biggest influence in Top 40 radio by the mid- 60s. Some say its beginnings went back to when Drake was PD at KYA San Francisco (about 63), others say KYNO Fresno where he programmed after that, or KGB San Diego which went with Drake's new Boss Radio format a few months before KHJ - maybe late 64 or early 65. But certainly, KHJ was the "flagship" station, and had legendary DJs like Morgan and Steele. So it's a matter of opinion, but I used to DX KFRC at night from LA in the late 60s - and I thought their take on Drake had all the excitement of KHJ with a more adult orientation...less "teeny bopper" - but that's my personal opinion.

Also, by 74 or so, Drake was fired by RKO - the owners of both KHJ and KFRC. KHJ did OK for a couple of years, then (I've heard), went into decline, wheras KFRC was voted "station of the year" a number of times, and prospered into the early 80s, when it could no longer compete with FM.

I wasn't around to hear KROQ in the late 70s - when I left LA, KROQ had just started on AM 1500 as a Top 40, well before they purchased 106.9 and went album rock. RE: KGO - HUGE signal - my mother (a KABC junkie) would often switch to Ira Blue on KGO at night when the signal could be received in LA.

 

[Leeanne]

hmmmm well i know many former jocks from there ... they were all on tape.
i am not just talking out of my ass ya know.

of course you are..."tape"? who are you talking to...jocks in the year 1978?
[/quote]

uhhh no, try the past 5 years
try calling the request line to those stations on the weekend......you may get a board op pretending to be the dj on the air, or the phone will ring and ring , or it will just be busy.
clear channel and entercom have made voice tracking a regular buisness practice. you can think all you want that i am talkiing out of my ass , but being someone in the business who has worked for all 3 companies (CBS,entercom , Clear channel) voice track most of the weekend and during the overnights. clear channel has gone as far as weeknights too...7- midnight.
so believe what you want, but the people i have worked with that were the ones taping there shows, are the proof.

 

[Leeanne]

hmmmm well i know many former jocks from there ... they were all on tape.
i am not just talking out of my ass ya know.

of course you are..."tape"? who are you talking to...jocks in the year 1978?
[/quote]


okay then let me put it this way.... they record there voice into the digital audio system (RCS)
is that more 2007 for you?

 

[sirmusic]

I don't know who your sources are, but as a current employee of CC SF, the whole "everything is tracked" thing is pretty much hogwash. Yes there's some tracking here, but KMEL is 90% live, KYLD is 99% live, KISQ is 95% live, Star is probably 80% live, KKSF is mostly live, now some news stations may feature a lot of syndicated stuff, but there isn't much voice tracking...not as much as you're making it out to be.

 

[LKellerIII]

Star is probably 80% live...there isn't much voice tracking...not as much as you're making it out to be.

Is the new guy (Darren McPeake) live? The afternoon drive show on Star was formerly voice-tracked by Lisa Foxx, and Gene and Julie before that. Even if Darren is live, along with Bleu and Chacon, that's still only about 12 hours a day, or 50% by my arithmetic. Renee Taylor has to be tracked, unless she commutes from LA to SF for the weekends. You're not going to tell us Tesh is live, are you?

 

[radio dx]

Todays programers and consultants are out of touch with what the public really wants out of radio that along with the bottom line. Radio stations today just don't want to pay for top talent any more. When radio stations do enlist some talent it just your am drive satelite feed. San Francisco radio now has got to be the most boring radio around, it's hard to believe we were the envy at one time. Most of these guys are not in radio any more it's hard to get a gig when one company owns most of the radio stations in the market. The dj's now sound like high school radio stations at best.

 

[SFStatic]

I disagree. Today's programmers aren't out of touch...upper management is driving this voice tracking stuff. I don't know a single programmer (and I know quite a few) who has EVER lobbied to get his/her live talent replaced by tracked shifts or syndicated programs. The fact is, the major radio companies don't want to pay for talent or be bothered with creative people (despite all the talk about "compelling programming.")

 

[Leeanne]

I don't know who your sources are, but as a current employee of CC SF, the whole "everything is tracked" thing is pretty much hogwash. Yes there's some tracking here, but KMEL is 90% live, KYLD is 99% live, KISQ is 95% live, Star is probably 80% live, KKSF is mostly live, now some news stations may feature a lot of syndicated stuff, but there isn't much voice tracking...not as much as you're making it out to be.

i have told you who my sources are....
my friends who used to work there.
maybe things have changed recently, like wyld and KMEL getting smarter and nnto doing it as much .
but let me explain again.....

nikkii blakk- KSJO (voice tracked every single shift for 3 years.... worked 7- midnight mon-fri)
sloopy joe-KSJO voice tracked on weekends
pauly ( weekends at KSJO & channel 1049 - voice tracked every single shift
lori thompson- weekends @ star 1017 - voice tracked every single shift
mary diaz @ wyld- was live when she did mid days... voice tracked on weekends @ wyld and star 1017
kat @ channel 1049- live on week nights ( most of the time ) voice tracked on weekends.....
these are all people i have worked with, and are friends. they arent lying when they tell me this is what they did. nikki blakk got paid for 4 hours a week to record her entire week of air time, and sometimes sent shows to the modesto clear channel affiliate.

i almost got a board op job at one time for channel 1049, because all the jocks were pre recorded and they needed board ops to run them
do i need to say more?
like i said... maybe KMEL and wyld got smarter. but i wouldnt say they dont use voice tracking at all, cuz they still do, no matter what you wanna believe.....

 

[Willie Jones]

I don't know who your sources are, but as a current employee of CC SF, the whole "everything is tracked" thing is pretty much hogwash. Yes there's some tracking here, but KMEL is 90% live, KYLD is 99% live, KISQ is 95% live, Star is probably 80% live, KKSF is mostly live, now some news stations may feature a lot of syndicated stuff, but there isn't much voice tracking...not as much as you're making it out to be.

i have told you who my sources are....
my friends who used to work there.
maybe things have changed recently, like wyld and KMEL getting smarter and nnto doing it as much .
but let me explain again.....

nikkii blakk- KSJO (voice tracked every single shift for 3 years.... worked 7- midnight mon-fri)
sloopy joe-KSJO voice tracked on weekends
pauly ( weekends at KSJO & channel 1049 - voice tracked every single shift
lori thompson- weekends @ star 1017 - voice tracked every single shift
mary diaz @ wyld- was live when she did mid days... voice tracked on weekends @ wyld and star 1017
kat @ channel 1049- live on week nights ( most of the time ) voice tracked on weekends.....
these are all people i have worked with, and are friends. they arent lying when they tell me this is what they did. nikki blakk got paid for 4 hours a week to record her entire week of air time, and sometimes sent shows to the modesto clear channel affiliate.

i almost got a board op job at one time for channel 1049, because all the jocks were pre recorded and they needed board ops to run them
do i need to say more?
like i said... maybe KMEL and wyld got smarter. but i wouldnt say they dont use voice tracking at all, cuz they still do, no matter what you wanna believe.....

I guess that I'm coming in late on this one but first of all...we are west of the Mississippi so remember we have K stations not W. <KYLD or Wild but not WYLD that's an Urban AC in New Orleans> also as much as you would like to believe it Clear Channel does most of their shows live...the only people that are tracked are those that probably just suck which means their shelf life in nil. But as funny as you are with you blatant rants on nothingness, you really shouldn't name drop that bad and really research the broader scope than just your friends that you know in the business. But as far as Prophet...go head and use it - that's what it's made for.

 

[beef]

i almost got a board op job at one time for channel 1049, because all the jocks were pre recorded and they needed board ops to run them

hey cats and kittens leave poor LeeAnne alone. She knows of what she speaks. She's a high-powered mover and shaker in the SF radio scene. One time she almost got a board op job...at a Clear Channel station! Yay!

 

[Leeanne]

i almost got a board op job at one time for channel 1049, because all the jocks were pre recorded and they needed board ops to run them

hey cats and kittens leave poor LeeAnne alone. She knows of what she speaks. She's a high-powered mover and shaker in the SF radio scene. One time she almost got a board op job...at a Clear Channel station! Yay!

i have been on air for 6 years in san fran so, i didnt take the board op gig....
live 105 was paying me more anyway.
and i prefer live radio to voice tracking.

 

[beef]

Yeah 12 bucks an hour over 8 an hour. Snappy decision

 

[SFStatic]

Hate to tell you this, but some pt air talent in SF have made 3-4 times your dozen figure, and done so for years.

 

[Leeanne]

Hate to tell you this, but some pt air talent in SF have made 3-4 times your dozen figure, and done so for years.

this i know.....it is no secret we are underpaid at live 105.
when they can hire a board op for minimum wage to replace you, you just keep your mouth shut....

 

[Leeanne]

Hate to tell you this, but some pt air talent in SF have made 3-4 times your dozen figure, and done so for years.

nowadays that figure is(mostly) for union stations. non union stations do not pay that well...
and when ratings suck, the money isnt there to pay djs that much.....
and when everyone wants to work there, they tend to pay as little as possible.

isnt that what started this whole thread? the reason SF dj's suck? well ... other markets pay more . you get what you pay for....and voice tracked djs sound horrible....
there you go.

 

[LKellerIII]

Awhile back on this thread, Sirmusic, a Clear Channel 'insider' said: "Yes there's some tracking here, but KMEL is 90% live, KYLD is 99% live, KISQ is 95% live, Star is probably 80% live..."

I responded that Star 101.3 could only have 50% live programming even if the new afternoon guy (Darren McPeake) was live. I listened for about 20 minutes the other day, in the 5:00 PM hour - peak afternoon drive time. In that entire time, including at least 5 songs and 2 commercial breaks, Darren's voice was only heard once over a song fade out - a 10 or 15 second announcement plugging the Don Bleu morning show. There is absolutely NO way this guy is live - the show seems obviously voice-tracked, and badly voice tracked, at that. I see no reason that a good DJ- personality can't do a GOOD voice-tracked show, but Clear Channel doesn't seem to care about that. So it seems to me that Star is only live for Bleu and Chacon - if that's 9 hours a day, then Star is live less than 40% of the time.