Why Do News and Sports Formats Do So Poorly in LA Ratings?

[Gregg]

Why are KNX and KFWB rated only around #23 - #25 in LA? In NYC, WINS (sister station to KFWB) is the #1 AM station, sometimes #1 in cume and sometimes #1 in morning drive. WCBS (sister to KNX) doesn't do as well. But it's usually the #3 AM station and is often in the Top 5 in morning drive. Even in morning drive, LA's all-news stations don't make the top 10.

Don't LA residents care about news? How about traffic every ten minutes? Aren't LA traffic jams worse then NYC where a larger part of the population uses subways? How about weather? Don't LA radio listeners want to hear a meteorologist give the weather forecast, something you don't get on other stations?

And why are all of LA's sports stations well below a 1 share? In NYC, WFAN is usually ranked around #15 or so. And it reportedly earns a lot of revenue. Meanwhile, KSPN and KLAC (with very good signals night and day) are ranked in the 30s. KMPC, the Sporting News station, and the powerful 1090 XEPRS don't even show in the ratings. (Yes, I know XEPRS is mostly about San Diego sports. But still with that signal, you'd think they'd at least make the LA book.)

I know stations that aim primarily at an Anglo audience will not do as well in LA as in other markets. But WINS boasts that it has a significant amount of Hispanic listeners who are conversent in English. Both WINS and WCBS use subway ads in Spanish.

If an AM talk station is #1 in LA, why the poor showing for News and Sports stations?




Gregg
[email protected]

 

[davideduardo]

Why are KNX and KFWB rated only around #23 - #25 in LA? In NYC, WINS (sister station to KFWB) is the #1 AM station, sometimes #1 in cume and sometimes #1 in morning drive. WCBS (sister to KNX) doesn't do as well. But it's usually the #3 AM station and is often in the Top 5 in morning drive. Even in morning drive, LA's all-news stations don't make the top 10.

Don't LA residents care about news? How about traffic every ten minutes? Aren't LA traffic jams worse then NYC where a larger part of the population uses subways? How about weather? Don't LA radio listeners want to hear a meteorologist give the weather forecast, something you don't get on other stations?

And why are all of LA's sports stations well below a 1 share? In NYC, WFAN is usually ranked around #15 or so. And it reportedly earns a lot of revenue. Meanwhile, KSPN and KLAC (with very good signals night and day) are ranked in the 30s. KMPC, the Sporting News station, and the powerful 1090 XEPRS don't even show in the ratings. (Yes, I know XEPRS is mostly about San Diego sports. But still with that signal, you'd think they'd at least make the LA book.)

I know stations that aim primarily at an Anglo audience will not do as well in LA as in other markets. But WINS boasts that it has a significant amount of Hispanic listeners who are conversent in English. Both WINS and WCBS use subway ads in Spanish.

If an AM talk station is #1 in LA, why the poor showing for News and Sports stations?

First, LA is 70% ethnic, with 42% Hispanic, 8% Black, 12% Asian, and about 10% Persian, Armenian, etc. Very light users of News radio.

In NY, the Hispanic population is half that of LA, and far more assimilated; those from the Caribbean have a long, long history of listening to news radio (the first all news staiton was in Cuba) while this was not a custom in Mexico. LA Hispanics are over 70% Spoanish dominant, with New York being far less. Neither KNX nor KFWB have much Hispanic or Asian appeal.

KFI has made its programming reflect "white fear" for the last 6 to 8 months. The call the mayor "Villalarza" and all the callers are pretty polarized (if not bigoted) whites. They are grabbing the 30% of the market that is non-Hispanic white and fanning the fire of their fears. To me, it is sick (although very well done and produced).

LA traffic is bad everywhere. Listening to the radio often is of no help. Weather here is pretty much the same all year round, so the only thing important is how to dress the next day... the temperature, in other words. This is like the weather in Miami... totally irrelevant unless there is a hurricane.

KNX and KFWB are huge billers, though. One is 8th and the other is 11th, as they do very well in the mortgage re-fis and other older aldult demo categories. Together, they took 8% of the revenue out of LA last year.

LA, for the same ethnic reasons, is not a good sports town. Spanish dominant Hispanics do not care about gringo sports. They are interested in Mexican and Latin American soccer, not baseball and basketball and (ughhh) American rule football. Since most syndicated sports talk is about baseball and basketball and footbal, you lose the bulk of the ethnic population. This is the same reason that... and the politicians don't get it... we do not have an NFL team.

 

[hamNcheese]

KFI has made its programming reflect "white fear" for the last 6 to 8 months. The call the mayor "Villalarza" and all the callers are pretty polarized (if not bigoted) whites.

LA, for the same ethnic reasons, is not a good sports town. Spanish dominant Hispanics do not care about gringo sports.

Bigot Whites?

You call them 'Gringo'?!

Bigoted?? Huh? Who?? Wha?? Gringo???!!!

No love for the white devil... ;D

 

[davideduardo]

KFI has made its programming reflect "white fear" for the last 6 to 8 months. The call the mayor "Villalarza" and all the callers are pretty polarized (if not bigoted) whites.

LA, for the same ethnic reasons, is not a good sports town. Spanish dominant Hispanics do not care about gringo sports.

Bigot Whites?

You call them 'Gringo'?!

Bigoted?? Huh? Who?? Wha?? Gringo???!!!

No love for the white devil... ;D

"Gringo" which derives from the Spanish word "griego" or "Greek" came, 500 years ago, to mean "outsider" or "foreigner."

To a Spanish dominant Hispanic, "gringo sports" are thoes that are foreign to the culture, particularly American rueles football.

If you thing the term "gringo" is offensive, be assured tha tit is not.

 

[jimbo]

> "Gringo" which derives from the Spanish word "griego" or "Greek" came, 500 years ago, to mean "outsider" or "foreigner."
> If you thing the term "gringo" is offensive, be assured that it is not.

Being on the receiving end of gringo I find the term offensive. Wikipedia notes that the American Heritage Dictionary classifies the term as offensive slang [1], though some who use it do not consider it pejorative. How would I be received if I described a Spanish station programming to the fears of beaners (a la Carlos Mencia)?

 

[davideduardo]

> "Gringo" which derives from the Spanish word "griego" or "Greek" came, 500 years ago, to mean "outsider" or "foreigner."
> If you thing the term "gringo" is offensive, be assured that it is not.

Being on the receiving end of gringo I find the term offensive. Wikipedia notes that the American Heritage Dictionary classifies the term as offensive slang [1], though some who use it do not consider it pejorative. How would I be received if I described a Spanish station programming to the fears of beaners (a la Carlos Mencia)?

"Gringo" can be even a term of endearment, while "beaner" can only be a pejorative. Another meaning of the work, while not the original, is "fair skinned." I had a friend in high school who was reddish blonde, and he was always called "El Gringo" Mantilla even though he was about 10th generation Ecuadorian.

Depending on context, "gringo" can be offensive, usually based on tone or the adjectives applied, like "pinche gringo" means, "damned gringo." But, alone, the term is neutral. Going back to high school again, a friend of mine and I DJed a US hits show called "gringolandia" on HCEG1, and nobody thought that was offensive.

Plus, it sure is easier to say "gringos" than "non-Hispanic whites" or, as Arbitron describes them, "other."

 

[fred flintstone]

I had understood the term "gringo" came from the US invasion of Mexico (1846 to 48) when Mexican troops applied the term to US troops who often sang the folk song "Green Grow the Lilacs."

For some reason, LA has always favored talk over news.

 

[davideduardo]

I had understood the term "gringo" came from the US invasion of Mexico (1846 to 48) when Mexican troops applied the term to US troops who often sang the folk song "Green Grow the Lilacs."

That is total, absolute and complete urban legend. References to "gringo" in Spanish and Latin American literature date back to the early 1800's, about 40 years before the American invasion of Mexico.

And the word itself is a corruption of "griego" which literally means "Greek" but in Spain, as early as the 15th Century, was used to denote an outsider or foreigner.

The early Argentine epic poem "Martin Fierro" has repeated use of "gringo" to describe a visitor to the Pampa of persons form the "big city" of Buenos Aires.

Here are the two widely associated uban legend versions:

Popular etymologies
A recurring fake etymology for the derivation of gringo states that it originated during the Mexican-American War of 1846-48. It has been claimed that Gringo comes from "green coat" and was used in reference to the American soldiers and the green color of their uniforms. Yet another story, from Mexico, holds that Mexicans with knowledge of the English language used to write "greens go home" on street walls referring to the color of the uniforms of the invading army; subsequently, it became a common habitual action for the rest of the population to yell "green go" whenever U.S. soldiers passed by. This is an example of an invented explanation, because gringo was used in Spanish long before the war and during the Mexican-American War. Additionally, the U.S. Army did not use green uniforms at the time, but blue ones. [[2]]

Another legend maintains that one of two songs – either "Green Grow the Lilacs" or "Green Grow the Rushes, O" – was popular at the time and that Mexicans heard the invading U.S. troops singing "Green grow..." and contracted this into gringo.

-- From Wikipedia.

 

[hamNcheese]

All racist terms have roots. just because you can trace the roots of a word doesnt mean it isnt a racist, derogitory, hateful word.

n***** and 's*** have roots in their meaning too. That means nothing. they are hateful and racist.

so is 'gringo'. just because you think it isn't and you can trace the meaning of the word doesn't mean it isnt dergatory slang.

You aren't impressing anybody with your mastery of knowledge of the words roots Mr.Eduardo.

Gringo = Racist

:'(

 

[davideduardo]

All racist terms have roots. just because you can trace the roots of a word doesnt mean it isnt a racist, derogitory, hateful word.

n***** and 's*** have roots in their meaning too. That means nothing. they are hateful and racist.

so is 'gringo'. just because you think it isn't and you can trace the meaning of the word doesn't mean it isnt dergatory slang.

You aren't impressing anybody with your mastery of knowledge of the words roots Mr.Eduardo.

Gringo = Racist

:'(

That is an ignorant statement to equate "gringo" with the N-word.

Again, from wikipedia.com:

"In informal Spanish speech, "gringo" offers a convenient shorthand to refer to a person from the U.S., since the term "American" is used to refer to anyone from the entire American continent (North, Central and South), while the more specific term "estadounidense" ("United Statian") is cumbersome to pronounce.

"Gringo" is used to refer to any native English speaker (regardless of race), though it is most frequently used with respect to white westeners (in particular those from the United States).

I have often been called this term by friends... it was my nickname at one of the stations I managed in Puerto Rico. It was never derogatory. It is, in some respects, like calling a person with red hair "Red." On LA's KNTQ, I actually hosted a talk show under the "El Gringo" airname. Offensive? Absolutely not.

Getting back to the subject of this thread, the reason Spanish dominant Hispanics do not listen to Sports radio in LA is that they do not like gringo sports, which is most of the content (basketball, baseball, American rule football). This is exactly the way that most people would use the term-... meaning "sports that have nothing to do with my background." In other words, "sports that are foreign to me."

 

[hamNcheese]

The American Heritage Dictionary classifies the term 'Gringo' as offensive slang.


Wilkipedia vs. The American Heritage Dictionary....


Wilkipedia is a joke.

The American Heritage Dictionary is, well...THE AMERICAN HERITAGE DICTIONARY.




Gringo = Racist.

 

[davideduardo]

The American Heritage Dictionary classifies the term 'Gringo' as offensive slang.

Wilkipedia vs. The American Heritage Dictionary....

Wilkipedia is a joke.

The American Heritage Dictionary is, well...THE AMERICAN HERITAGE DICTIONARY.

Gringo = Racist.

Of course, being of the culture for the last 45 years would not give me a certain ability to define the term as it is actually used? I used Wikipedia because the article there is accurate, finely written and debunks the urban legends about the word.

The term, unless used with negative or derogatory adjectives, is not of itself offensive. If you want to be offended, that is your priviledge, but you are just portraying yourself as being an ugly gringo (see, by putting a word ahead of "gringo" I changed the meaning, just like the "ugly American" defines the typical gauche US citizen abroad).

The best definition of the term, complete with the real origins and varied usage in Latin america, happens to be in this case, wikipedia. The Oxford American dictionary defines the term as "An American, espcially a white American."

There is nothing racist about the term. You are making it into an offense in your own mind... or, worse, your behaviour towards Hispanics may have caused you to be called a gringo with some expletive in front of the word. Is that the case?

 

[hamNcheese]

Racist.

 

[davideduardo]

Racist.

"Gringo" is not a "race."

 

[ercjncpr]

Hmmm...this is one very intelligent board. One or two replies on-topic and thest of you talking about what you think about the word gringo
:

 

[davideduardo]

Hmmm...this is one very intelligent board. One or two replies on-topic and thest of you talking about what you think about the word gringo
:

It is probably closer to the topic than most realize. The "gringo" (non-Hispanic white) population of the LA MSA is around 30% or less, which explains why white guys talking aobut football and baseball do not get very big ratings.

 

[hamNcheese]

gringo

SYLLABICATION: grin·go
PRONUNCIATION: grngg
NOUN: Inflected forms: pl. grin·gos
Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for a foreigner in Latin America, especially an American or English person.
ETYMOLOGY: Spanish, foreign, foreign language, gibberish, probably alteration of griego, Greek, from Latin Graecus. See Greek.
WORD HISTORY: In Latin America the word gringo is an offensive term for a foreigner, particularly an American or English person.


But I guess since we arent in latin america, it is ok for latin ameriicans to use the term and it isnt offensive or disparaging.



racist...

;D

 

[davideduardo]

gringo

SYLLABICATION: grin·go
PRONUNCIATION: grngg
NOUN: Inflected forms: pl. grin·gos
Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for a foreigner in Latin America, especially an American or English person.
ETYMOLOGY: Spanish, foreign, foreign language, gibberish, probably alteration of griego, Greek, from Latin Graecus. See Greek.
WORD HISTORY: In Latin America the word gringo is an offensive term for a foreigner, particularly an American or English person.


But I guess since we arent in latin america, it is ok for latin ameriicans to use the term and it isnt offensive or disparaging.
racist...

;D

Betcha' whoever wrote that sad and inaccurate definition has never been in Latin America and does not speak Spanish, either.

 

[hamNcheese]

gringo

SYLLABICATION: grin·go
PRONUNCIATION: grngg
NOUN: Inflected forms: pl. grin·gos
Offensive Slang Used as a disparaging term for a foreigner in Latin America, especially an American or English person.
ETYMOLOGY: Spanish, foreign, foreign language, gibberish, probably alteration of griego, Greek, from Latin Graecus. See Greek.
WORD HISTORY: In Latin America the word gringo is an offensive term for a foreigner, particularly an American or English person.


But I guess since we arent in latin america, it is ok for latin ameriicans to use the term and it isnt offensive or disparaging.
racist...

;D

Betcha' whoever wrote that sad and inaccurate definition has never been in Latin America and does not speak Spanish, either.

betcha its from The American Heritage Dictionary.

Instead of just admitting that you are wrong, that 'gringos' might find the term racist and offensive...keep telling yourself your right and nobody elses feelings or opinions matter. even when presented with definitions from AHD saying it is offensive slang. That is even worse then using the term itself.

Racist!

;D

 

[davideduardo]

betcha its from The American Heritage Dictionary.

Instead of just admitting that you are wrong, that 'gringos' might find the term racist and offensive...keep telling yourself your right and nobody elses feelings or opinions matter. even when presented with definitions from AHD saying it is offensive slang. That is even worse then using the term itself.

Racist!

;D

The issue is not what YOU think, erroneously I might add, the word means. The real point is that the word, as you might hear it in Mexico and around Southern California, is not meant to be offensive unless it is said in the context of an offensive statement. To say, "Vino un gringo a llevarse unos tacos..." just means that a non-Hispanic came to buy some tacos. You would not say, "vino un americano a llevarse unos tacos" because Mexicans and all Latin Americans are also Americans. So, since "Americans" is not the correct word, in Spanish, there is about one other option: gringo. It perfectly says, in 5 letters, "non-Hispanic white person."

Did you ever see the movie, "Old Gringo" from 1989? The term was not offensive... it was just descriptive of an old non-Hispanic white guy. Simple.

You are obcessed with a term that is not used by those who use it in the manner you thought it was uses. Sorry to prove you wrong, but maybe you will see Hispanics don¿t hate you... they just know you are a gringo!

Now, go back to listening to gringo sports on the radio!