Wouldn't it be great to get Smooth Jazz back onto FM commercial radio?

[SJFAN]

While most of us Smooth Jazz fans have moved on wouldnt it be nice for this format to return to FM radio in cities accross the united states?

Even though many radio concultants will tell you smooth jazz attracts an older audience I tend to disagree.

The ad sales staff at many radio stations accross the country didnt know how to sell the smooth jazz format to advertisers.

Is is possible that smooth jazz could return to FM commercial radio in a few markets?

 

[Tim]

SF Fan...As an advertising sales rep for decades...I totally agree. Hope what you're suggesting begins to happen.

Nitch formats rarely pull big ratings. Nitch formats exist because of a moderate sized weekly cume audience of listeners who love their station, and who have desirable levels of disposable income that advertisers will want to reach. It's rarely about ratings.

The sales reps in a nitch format like smooth jazz can't wait by their computers for e-mailed orders from big ad agencies or national rep firms. They need to hit the streets and develop personal relationships with local/regional advertisers who seek their nitch format's core listeners.

 

[majaman78]

While most of us Smooth Jazz fans have moved on wouldnt it be nice for this format to return to FM radio in cities accross the united states?

Even though many radio concultants will tell you smooth jazz attracts an older audience I tend to disagree.

The ad sales staff at many radio stations accross the country didnt know how to sell the smooth jazz format to advertisers.

Is is possible that smooth jazz could return to FM commercial radio in a few markets?

Come on, guys.

There's a lot of great sounding product out there right now. I agree it ain't gonna be on FM radio, but seriously you sound like my parents did when they didn't want to subscribe to cable back in the '80's!! ;D

You gotta think of AM/FM radio the same as UHF/VHF TV signals some 30 years ago.

New platforms made them obsolete. And if you really want to watch something you want...well...rabbit ears ain't getting you anywhere...

It's happening with radio right now as I type this.

Mark my words.... in 10 years or less AM/FM will be talk/weather/info etc. Nothing more and nothing less.... and if you want music and variety...well...you know what the the answer will be and exactly where to find it....I think!!!!

 

[Nock]

I have had the opportunity to listen to the Seabreeze Destin Florida this week. Funny because I was actually paying attention to the commercials as much as I was the music. Still a great sounding station and was amazed at the spot load that was airing. Seem to really be targeting the listener of this genre and it wasn't wheel chair ads. Nice Mercedes Benz promo, lot of high end restaurants, couple of banks is what I heard. To Maja's point, outside of Destin, I have been paying for the tunes in my car for the last 8 years and love it! Almost a daily event to read about another AM talk station moving over to FM. Aside from this week, I would have never known the AM and FM on this radio even worked. Terrestrial is TOAST.

Nock

 

[AC Tones]

Hey guys. My two cents worth, but living and working in a big market area (DC/Baltimore), I completely concur that I just don't see a terrestrial radio comeback for this format, at least in larger markets. There will soon be another 24/7 News/Talk station on the FM dial here, competing with longtime ratings king 103.5 FM WTOP and Conservative talker 105.9 FM, which just so happens to be the former Smooth Jazz 105.9 FM, WJZW.

I agree with Tim, Nock, and Majaman78 for different reasons. Since mobile broadband is still costly and can be considered a luxury in these tough financial times, I have always opined, with the right presentation, a commitment to your target audience (which I believe at its core are intelligent and affluent in the way they live or WANT to live), and marrying them with logical sponsors, this format can work on traditional radio in smaller markets in resort areas. Destin is a great example. My home away from home, Rehoboth Beach, Delaware, is another example. Of course, BA screwed that one up (WQJZ). But in the end, here's the challenge. With many terrestrial radio stations being about the bottom line and dealing with overhead, and knowing this format has never fetched huge ratings, there will be fewer and fewer takers---because it is a risk, and we know radio is all about playing it safe. Like it or not, the Internet IS the future of this format, and radio in general. Embrace it. Celebrate it. Resist your urge to lament it. Because it ultimately means more choices for you, and programmers working harder and harder to win your loyalty. That means larger playlists and sharper programming. What's not to like? ;D

 

[Tim]

Actually, I agree with everybody!

Add me to the list of media people who believe in a few short years, "radio" stations will be heard via the internet...not coming out of towers.

But, as AC pointed out...the current cost of unlimited, reliable broadband is an extra monthly expense...and that doesn't even count the initial cost of a decent I-phone.

However, the biggest hassle to me is having to constantly remember to charge up a phone I'd have on all the time, listening to streaming radio stations. And, unless you have great headphones on, fairly lousy audio quality.

Traditional radio is highly portable, in cars, in homes, and except for battery-powered walkman-type radios, there's no recharging. Regular radio is far easier to use at any time in almost any scenerio...and no monthly broadband bill.

The main limitations is the obvious: you have a limitied number of stations you can hear over the air.

Still, obviously the radio coming out of towers clock is indeed ticking.

 

[crainbebo]

I agree. Bring back KKSF, WQCD, WJJZ, KWJZ, the former 105.9 in Portland, and MANY others heard in the past and I'll be happy!

The stations on now (WSBZ, KYSJ, KUJJ, WAEG, etc.) will probably switch format in a few years, even less.
No general people care about listening to "sleep" music anymore, it's all CHR and Rock for most in the younger generations. I still do, and miss my local 98.9 KWJZ. The Modern AC format really SUCKS on there right now. I don't want to see "Information Radio 610 and 101.9 KONA" in the Tri-Cities please, which unfortunaly may happen in the near future since KONA-AM is owned by the same company (Cherry Creek Radio). Plus, the huge amount of iPods is growing too, meaning less radio listening.

-crainbebo

 

[Tim]

The 1996 Tel-Com bill allowed companies to own many stations, and in theory make more money and hopefully provide many interesting, appealing formats.

Sadly, our industry has chosen instead to dumb-down the tastes of the average listener over the past few decades by providing us with lifeless, passionless same-same-same-same programming, that's now the standard all over the country.

Now, live (even voice-tracked) human beings on the radio...the supposed content between the songs, is on the endangered list. All of this so costs can be absolutely minimal.

Have any of you noticed that today, most "content" on the radio between songs or at the end of music sweeps is contesting plugs or advertising-driven station promotional announcements? That's NOT content....that's hype that 95% of us could care less about.

Anybody in radio knows most people never play radio contests, and who cares about silly remote broadcast plugs that 99% of listeners never attend? Programmers say that creates "buzz" for the station. Well, folks...buzz about stuff most listeners have nearly zero interest in is in fact "clutter"...and not a positive.

THINK LIKE THE LISTENER...NOT LIKE A RADIO PERSON. Geesh...is anybody in our business doing any critical thinking any more?????

And, we wonder why a wonderful format like smooth jazz has been exiled to on-line (no offense to our friend the world-wide web)?

 

[Jimmy128]

Majaman78 is absolutely right. Where I live in the Boston area, more and more FM stations are turning to talk or sports talk. In Boston we went from two smooth

jazz stations to none in a matter of months in 1999. One went to talk the other to AC. http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-8557081.html Also the AM band here

is dying a slow death. I live close enough to a

signal to get smooth jazz on HD2, WMJX HD2. But a friend of mine showed me how to get anything you want on his T-Mobile phone when I was in Vermont.

For good Internet stations try these:


http://www.cjazzchannel.com/

http://smoothinseattle.com/#

 

[crainbebo]

And now you guys in Boston have two sports stations on FM too. Again, that takes a big toll on FM music radio, as more and more stations are switching to N/T and Sports. We lost Hot AC "My FM 92.5" in Sacramento not too long ago to a simulcast of KFBK. We lost KUSS (Country) in San Diego to a simulcast of KOGO 600. A few months ago, WYSP (94 Rock) in Phily switched to "94 WIP" (Sports). I wouldn't be surprised to see KYSJ or WAEG switching formats soon.

-crainbebo

 

[Bill Harmonic]

We've talked about this through out various threads and IMO the only way this will happen, outside of a very few small markets (like Destin), is that an independent operator in a larger market will get tired of being the third AC or the fourth country station and realize they can control a niche and bring back a new form of the format. They will go back to the original business premise, blueprint and foundation in super serving a core but they will not be able to go back to the way the format was excuted. They will have to lower the age of the listeners and they will have to sell locally and ignore Arbitron. National buys will be few and far between and everything coming in for the bottom line will be based on relationships between seller and client. The big companies will not touch this again unless one of these mavericks starts to get traction and as the lemmings they are, could possibly engage and embrace the music all over but don't hold your breath. But there's a bigger movement going on that supercedes this line of thought and that is that the whole industry is in movement and it has happened before. In the late 60's to early 70's there was a major migration from AM to FM. All the music (along with everything else) was on AM and you could not give an FM away. Then the progressive rock stations started up and operators saw where the future was headed. The music migrated to FM and the AM stations became new/talk, spoken word, sports, etc. The same thing is happening now as we move toward the internet. We can all see how FM's are changing to sports or news and the music stations are so dumbed downed that they simply challenge anyone to listen. The new world is on the web and that's where the creators are moving. People like myself, Chris Acton, Steve Hamilton, Carol Handley and many others are now putting new visions into motion. We want to be ready when the hardware catches up to the programming. The same thing happened before when all they made were AM radios and we had to wait for the FM's to be added to everyone's box. So, would it be great to have the format back on FM? Why? I can now create something that I don't have some half assed consultant tell me won't work. I can now create something that has no limitations of tower. I can now create the next generation and the evolution of the music. I've got to be honest that for someone like me who loves the music, I get a real joy out of listening to everyone instead of being stuck with just my old local station and I can do it all on my phone. It's a brave new world out there and instead of wishing it would come back to FM, start to open your ears to what is going on now and where the possibilites are heading. If you really think this is coming back to terrestrial radio then you need to call a proctologist so they can help you get your head out of your rear end. The audience is still there and the music is better than ever. Embrace the future because we can not bring back the past and you don't want to. We can only learn from it and that light at the end of the tunnel is where we need to go to build a better listening experience.

 

[AC Tones]

Bill, God willing, you and I will still be plugging away when "today's AM" becomes "tomorrow's FM" in everyone's cars and homes. We may never set any Arbitron records. And with all I have going on in my life right now, I can't pound the pavement like we all need to right now. But at the end of the day, it's all about serving those who have hung with us and supported us since day one. We also owe it to ourselves out of pure love for this music, and being committed to its survival. While on the surface there seems to be tons of choices out there now, the reality is, in relative terms, there are only a small handful of guys who truly "get it" (to include the folks you mentioned) and realize what a critical time this is for our music. We are still years away from the Final Frontier. Our challenge is keeping the format fresh and interesting in the meantime. It won't be easy, and much depends on the artists not losing faith and continuing to produce great music. If they don't, there is still tons of older material out there that still sounds great today. But I think the core artists who may have been bitten by the Smooth A/C bug have gotten the message, Lima Charlie (loud and clear). And the young guys coming out on the scene? They never needed a message, as they were exposed to and influenced by this music as kids when this format was at its height and the music was terrific.

Best of luck to you, my friend. It's a pleasure to serve on the battlefield alongside of you.

 

[Tim]

I am hopeful for a revival.

2012 could be a great year for the format we all love. Fingers crossed, guys.

 

[Bill Harmonic]

Saw this yesterday from the Cleveland Scene (ignore the snide comments from the writer...he's one of those hipper than thou kind of guys) and Tom Taylor here at RI also reported it this morning that the new owners of WNWV in Cleveland are bring back the format to 107.3. On one side that's great news but on the other side, what is it coming back as? If they are going to do the same old thing, the same old problems will still be there and if this is truly a reboot for the format then it will have to be done right coming out of the box. If it's a smooth AC they are wasting their money. It it's snooze jazz they are flushing their cash down the drain. Rubber City Radio has a huge opportunity right in front of them and let's see if they get it.

http://www.clevescene.com/scene-and...12/08/v-1073-to-return-to-snooze-music-format

 

[AnotherCat]

Traditional radio owners are not in a position to do anything that will give this music a positive image and until they can it is best that they leave it alone. We are just breaking free of artists being forced to strip everything exciting out of their music and record slow, bland musical wallpaper and covers of burnt out sings. Artists are starting to find their own voices again. Any terrestrial station that runs this format is going to play it super safe and go with the BA formula (pop songs, covers, "unobtrusive" instrumentals) whether they affiliate with the network or not. This

1. damages the image of all contemporary instrumental music and keeps people from even wanting to explore and dig deeper, especially younger people and people who grew up with rock.
2. puts the artists back in the position of recording songs that put people to sleep and don't showcase their skills

A lot of artists are putting out their best work in years (the new Lorber just kills!) and we don't need to pull the reins back in. Reinvention would not be possible in a corporate ownership/PPM world so this genre really needs to move camp to the internet.

 

[crainbebo]

Maybe if the SJ flips keep going, it could stretch out to Pittsburgh, Starview, PA (someday I would like to see a revival of WSJW, miss 92.7!), New York (FM News 101.9 is all fluff talk IMO), Phily, Baltimore, etc.

-crainbebo

 

[MRFLASHPORT]

Hey guys. My two cents worth, but living and working in a big market area (DC/Baltimore), I completely concur that I just don't see a terrestrial radio comeback for this format, at least in larger markets. There will soon be another 24/7 News/Talk station on the FM dial here, competing with longtime ratings king 103.5 FM WTOP and Conservative talker 105.9 FM, which just so happens to be the former Smooth Jazz 105.9 FM, WJZW.

I agree with Tim, Nock, and Majaman78 for different reasons. Since mobile broadband is still costly and can be considered a luxury in these tough financial times, I have always opined, with the right presentation, a commitment to your target audience (which I believe at its core are intelligent and affluent in the way they live or WANT to live), and marrying them with logical sponsors, this format can work on traditional radio in smaller markets in resort areas. Destin is a great example. My home away from home, Rehoboth Beach, Delaware, is another example. Of course, BA screwed that one up (WQJZ). But in the end, here's the challenge. With many terrestrial radio stations being about the bottom line and dealing with overhead, and knowing this format has never fetched huge ratings, there will be fewer and fewer takers---because it is a risk, and we know radio is all about playing it safe. Like it or not, the Internet IS the future of this format, and radio in general. Embrace it. Celebrate it. Resist your urge to lament it. Because it ultimately means more choices for you, and programmers working harder and harder to win your loyalty. That means larger playlists and sharper programming. What's not to like? ;D

Also worth noting is that WJZW is now ONLY available off air on HD2, Cumulus axed the stream on December 1st. I used to listen to this station quite a bit on my Verizon Iphone using TuneIn Radio. It actually had a real HQ stream, a good playlist and was a good soundtrack. Oh well, bet Verizon is happy I'm not burning through 8-12GB a month of data (still on unlimited).

Recently bought an HD radio for my car hoping I could get this format off the air in the ATL, as 106.7 (also a Cumulus station) supposedly has it on their HD2, only to find out that WYAY lost their HD signal due to antenna problems. They say it will come back one day, but I'm not holding my breath.

Radio needs to go back to being LOCALLY programmed for it to appeal. That's where it went wrong 15 years ago. The Internet isn't in everyone's dashboard, and high speed mobile broadband is costly and not available in most parts of the country but terrestrial radio is. If the industry is intent on committing suicide, then keep doing what you're doing.

 

[Tim]

MRFLASHPORT: Love your comments....especially the last sentence.

 

[Tim]

Maybe this is old news to most people on this forum, but....did you guys know Alan Kepler bought back BA from Clear Channel a year or so ago?

CC & the other big radio chains never really understood NAC/SJ....in programming or sales efforts, kept screwing with the music in order to make their NAC/SJ stations much more mass appeal AC, and bascially wrecked the format.

So, about 4 or 5 years ago, these big chain operators gave up, declared the format dead, just about every NAC/SJ owner copy-cat'ed and dumped the format, and eventually CC sold BA back to Alan, at I'm sure was pennies on the dollar.

I keep hearing that there's about 10 million disenfranchised NAC/SJ fans in mostly larger, top 30-sized markets who'd love the format back on radio. Granted, most of these listeners are in their 40's and 50's, but that's OK: they have money to spend (a reality you'd think most direct advertisers would welcome).

Kepler is in the process of trying to re-establish NAC/SJ as a viable radio format and continues growing smooth AC as a second format in his group.

Hopefully NAC/SJ will be successful, and come back strong on radio and let the music be broad & deep enough to please true P1 fans, but still commercially viable.

Several posters are 100% correct: affordable and available portable broadband service for most people just isn't available in 2011.

p.s.: I hate 95% NAC/SJ remakes of old top 40 songs. Yuck!

 

[AC Tones]

Maybe this is old news to most people on this forum, but....did you guys know Alan Kepler bought back BA from Clear Channel a year or so ago?

CC & the other big radio chains never really understood NAC/SJ....in programming or sales efforts, kept screwing with the music in order to make their NAC/SJ stations much more mass appeal AC, and bascially wrecked the format.

So, about 4 or 5 years ago, these big chain operators gave up, declared the format dead, just about every NAC/SJ owner copy-cat'ed and dumped the format, and eventually CC sold BA back to Alan, at I'm sure was pennies on the dollar.

I keep hearing that there's about 10 million disenfranchised NAC/SJ fans in mostly larger, top 30-sized markets who'd love the format back on radio. Granted, most of these listeners are in their 40's and 50's, but that's OK: they have money to spend (a reality you'd think most direct advertisers would welcome).

Kepler is in the process of trying to re-establish NAC/SJ as a viable radio format and continues growing smooth AC as a second format in his group.

Hopefully NAC/SJ will be successful, and come back strong on radio and let the music be broad & deep enough to please true P1 fans, but still commercially viable.

Several posters are 100% correct: affordable and available portable broadband service for most people just isn't available in 2011.

p.s.: I hate 95% NAC/SJ remakes of old top 40 songs. Yuck!

Hey Tim. I think many opine that Kepler's hands have blood on them where the demise of this format on terrestrial radio is concerned, and that's all I really have to say about that. Fair or unfair, many industry insiders (broadcasters, artists, promoters, and labels) privately agree.