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TOP TEN List of Late Night Hosts........

Here is my top ten list of late night hosts based on my perception of how they influenced late night tv and television in general:

1.) CARSON

2.) LETTERMAN

3.) STEVE ALLEN

4.) LENO

5,) JON STEWART

6.) JACK PAAR

7.) DICK CAVETT

8.) STEPHEN COLBERT

9.) MERV GRIFFIN

10.) ARSENIO HALL

We can have fun with this..........btw my number one is non negotiable
 
What? No Pat Sajak or Chevy Chase? :rolleyes:

The guy said, "based on my perception of how they influenced late night tv and television in general". Those two were on late night TV, but they came and went without making so much as a ripple. If you're going to stretch it to simply accumulate a list of every person who ever had a late night show, there are lots of names to throw out. But if it's about actually having an influence that affected late night TV and television in general, not everyone who had a show did that.

I'd throw out names like the real pioneers of late-night TV, like Morey Amsterdam, Jerry Lester, or Jennie "Dagmar" Lewis. And don't forget Ernie Kovacs, who alternated with Steve Allen hosting the Tonight show. And when they left, there was Jack Lescoulie and then Al Collins until Jack Paar came along. Les Crane and Bill Dana also had early late night talk shows, as did frequent Johnny Carson substitute host Joey Bishop, with Regis Philbin as his announcer/side-kick. But though some of those names might have had some influence over those who followed, I suspect most of them were pretty much forgettable.
 
No mention of Conan O'Brien? :confused:

Conan's show is very entertaining. But, what did he add to the world of late-night TV that influenced other hosts? How is the entire genre of late-night talk different because of the impact of Conan's show?
 
Griffin in late night on CBS was an unmitigated disaster. It easily challanges Sajak, Chase, Alan Thicke and 1967's "The Las Vegas Show" for the title of the "My Mother the Car" of late night.

David Susskind, Joe Pyne, Tom Synder and perhaps even Les Crane had more impact as an influence in the history of late night talk than Stewart or Colbert.

As for Letterman ahead of Allen? Anyone who ever watched Allen in his prime can clearly see where Letterman gleaned much of his late night schtick.
 
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Anyone who ever watched Allen in his prime can clearly see where Letterman gleaned much of his late night schtick.

Anyone old enough to remember watching Steve Allen in his prime probably can't remember watching Steve Allen in his prime. Someone in their 30's when Steve Allen was on would be in their 80's now.
 
Key word: "ever." You don't have to be in your 80s to have seen or to have been influenced by Steve Allen's work.
 
I have to agree that Merv does not belong on this list. He was bland and really brought nothing to the late-night party; his best ratings were in the afternoons or in primetime in some of the bigger markets like NY, LA, and Washington. The same could be said for Pat Sajak; too bland for late night, better suited for daytime (especially the mornings).
 
Key word: "ever." You don't have to be in your 80s to have seen or to have been influenced by Steve Allen's work.

I've seen clips of some of his stuff. But if you're going to us that reasoning, then Steve Allen was himself influenced by the radio shows that preceded television, who were themselves influenced by the comedians and comics of vaudeville and burlesque.
 
Mostly just "thinking out loud" here...but I'm reading over this and wondering more and more if anyone can truly do a definitive ranking of ten top influences. Letterman influences Kimmel - Carson influences Letterman - a radio comic like Jack Benny influences Carson, Paar or Allen - and so on. A generation from now you'll find hosts who consider Kimmel or Fallon or whoever replaces Dave as their top influence.

Up front, I have to question whether even Carson is Letterman's greatest influence. I'd suggest that title has to fall to Paul Dixon and Rich King - a pair of Cincinnati broadcasters who Letterman watched, listened to and learned from while growing up in Indiana. And you cannot discount the fact that generational shifts in society have also influenced all the hosts of late night too.

Late night has been based on Pat Weaver's original template for NBC Television's Tonight. For the first 40 years, NBC had that time mostly to themselves. CBS may have tried to challenge with Griffin or Sajak. ABC with Bishop or Cavett. Syndicated with Bill Dana's "The Las Vegas Show" or Arsenio Hall. None had much if any impact against Tonight until maybe Arsenio in 1989. If a ranking of network level television influence can be done, I'd contend that only those early Tonight hosts with the genre almost exclusively to themselves must be counted as the top three. Working off Weaver's foundational template, they built the late night television genre. All that have followed, from Cavett to Dave to Arsenio to Conan or Ferguson or Stewart have only adapted Allen, Paar and Carson's build out of Weaver's template to the changing tastes of their generation's society.

So I guess that means that at best, Letterman can only be considered as fourth on the list. Cavett's ABC show tried, struggled and eventually failed to create a younger, hipper version of late night going head to head against Carson. Letterman was the first to succeed in creating that younger, more hip late night show. But could Letterman have been a success had he launched his type of late night show against Carson on ABC or CBS? I don't think 1982's 11:30 PM audience would have been ready for a show like Letterman. Dave might have ended up with Merv and Pat in CBS late night's forgotten past.

No...what helped Dave establish himself was his time slot. He replaced Tom Snyder's "Tommorow Show" following Carson on NBC. And yes, without Letterman's first success on the 12:30 AM "Late Night," I doubt if there would have been an Arsenio who could compete head to head against Carson for that younger audience seven years later - with the resulting call for a younger Leno to replace Carson ending with Dave's move to CBS. Did Letterman break new ground? Not really. Letterman only built a show for his generation on top of that original late night foundation. Certainly Dave is an influence - but no one, not even Dave, can surpass the groundbreaking influence of the early Tonight hosts.

And if you think about it, even the guys like Griffin or Cavett or Chevy Chase who failed in late night influenced by teaching what not to do. Those who have followed the early NBC pioneers have only adapted the basics. There'd be no Letterman, Stewart or Fallon without Allen or Carson building on Weaver's foundation. You see guys who adapt for a new generation...or who adapt by taking a show toward more absurd comedy or toward more serious talk. Would there have been a Conan or Craig Ferguson without Dave? Would there be a Jon Stewart "Daily Show" without Bill Maher's "Politically Incorrect?"

If a list can be done, you'll always have far less than ten who will be counted as the true top influences of late night. The rest may have some influence, but mostly the rest are just followers.
 
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Here is my top ten list of late night hosts based on my perception of how they influenced late night tv and television in general:

1.) CARSON

2.) LETTERMAN

3.) STEVE ALLEN

4.) LENO

5,) JON STEWART

6.) JACK PAAR

7.) DICK CAVETT

8.) STEPHEN COLBERT

9.) MERV GRIFFIN

10.) ARSENIO HALL

We can have fun with this..........btw my number one is non negotiable

Why does your list have two hosts with only one name? Did one or both of them only have one name? If not, could you provide both their first names and last names (this would be helpful for folks who may assume you were referring to Carson Daly. Not including myself, since I have no idea which person with the name "Carson" you were referencing)
 
1. Johnny Carson

2. David Letterman - The NBC era of Letterman was magical. People often forget the absolute lunacy of Late Night with David Letterman and solely remember the older grouchy Dave on CBS. On NBC Letterman was challenging the establishment and thumbing his nose at authority.

3. Ted Koppel - Hear me out, before Koppel and Nightline came around there wasn't too many programs outside of 60 Minutes that were devoting the entire show to one particular news topic. Nightline put the Iran Hostages situation front and center to all Americans and didn't sugar coat the Carter Administration bungling the entire crisis. Nightline is complete pablum now but when Koppel helmed the ship the topics appeared newsworthy and important.

4. Jack Paar - Perfected the sit down interview and wasn't always going for laughs when the topic didn't warrant it.

5. Craig Ferguson - Always completely ignored when the topic of late night hosts comes up and is probably better off because of it. No one is doing what Craig does; Ad libbing the monologue with whatever happens to be rolling through his head at that particular moment and getting substance out of the guests he interviews instead of the plug for whatever they are pitching. The show doesn't fit everyone's tastes but it's not supposed to. With as close to zero advertising the show even exists, those that find it and enjoy it realize they are seeing something a lot different than what the countless others are doing. As much as I love Craig's show, it will be a shell of it's former self if he takes over the 11:35 slot and I think even Craig knows this. For that reason, I really hope he passes on taking over Dave's slot.

6. Jon Stewart

7. Arsenio Hall - Helped pave the way for blacks and minorities to hold court with the old guard of middle aged white men hosting television shows. Arsenio owes a debt of gratitude to Flip Wilson and has said as such. Flip was the one true pioneer but he didn't have a late night show however, Arsenio was definitely a study of how Flip achieved what he did and ran with it in his own way.

8. Dick Cavett - He may not have been a smash hit success but he was certainly noteworthy for being disenfranchised with the GOP to the point where the Nixon Administration were looking for ways to remove him from the airwaves by hook or by crook so his opinions could be silenced.

9. Joan Rivers - Not my cup of tea but she was the first woman to hold court on a late night show. That's worth the inclusion.

10. Tom Synder - I personally think Bob Costas did better one on one interviews when he hosted "Later" but without Tom, there would never have been a "Later With Bob Costas".
 
My take on the original list.

1.) jOHNNY CARSON

2.) JACK PARR

3.) STEVE ALLEN

4.) jAY LENO

5,) ARSENIO HALL

6.) DAVID LETTERMAN

7.) DICK CAVETT

8.) TOM SYNDER

9.) JON STEWART

10.) TED KOPPEL
 
I have to agree that Merv does not belong on this list. He was bland and really brought nothing to the late-night party; his best ratings were in the afternoons or in primetime in some of the bigger markets like NY, LA, and Washington. The same could be said for Pat Sajak; too bland for late night, better suited for daytime (especially the mornings).

I really enjoyed Merv's show. Unlike most of the others on when he was on, Merv tended to sit back and let the guests shine. I recall one show in particular when he had Richard Pryor and Rene Santoni on, and the two of them started riffing off each other like Jonathon Winters and Art Carney on Jack Paar's show. The only difference was the Merv just sat back and let the two of them be brilliant without trying to force himself into the bit.
 
Originally Posted by Mario500:

Why does your list have two hosts with only one name? Did one or both of them only have one name? If not, could you provide both their first names and last names (this would be helpful for folks who may assume you were referring to Carson Daly. Not including myself, since I have no idea which person with the name "Carson" you were referencing)



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