Kimberly & Beck?

[flybynight]

Let me expand on my question:

Should an on-air host be able to say anything they want?
Where do you draw the line?

 

[Small Market Guy]

Let me expand on my question:

Should an on-air host be able to say anything they want?
Where do you draw the line?

I draw the line somewhere further down from this. Maybe somewhere near the point where the FCC starts doling out fines.

Who's the real thug? We're talking about an unprovoked attack by DJs on a music station. If it was funny or entertaining, you'd have a point. But it wasn't. This is not a proper use of the public's airwaves.

Who are you to determine that? I didn't find it entertaining either, but I'm also not arrogant enough to think that only what I consider entertaining is entertaining.

And to answer the first part: The REAL thugs are people who demand someone get fired over WORDS.

 

[Goat Rodeo Cowboy]

I draw the line somewhere further down from this. Maybe somewhere near the point where the FCC starts doling out fines.



Who are you to determine that? I didn't find it entertaining either, but I'm also not arrogant enough to think that only what I consider entertaining is entertaining.

And to answer the first part: The REAL thugs are people who demand someone get fired over WORDS.

Here is this philosophical dilemma that we face today: We are a nation that has decided we want to implement a form of "self government" and after over 200 years we are still working out some of the wrinkles... in fact we are still uncovering wrinkles we never recognized before.

And here is where Talk Radio and Self Government get on this collision course of taking "the high ground" and traveling down the freeway of self-government or taking a bumpy ride through the drainage ditch that runs along parallel to the freeway.

A great hue and cry from the Conservative Right is that citizens take their own responsibility for their lives. Get a job! Don't expect government to take care of you. Welfare dependence will make you into a miserable person. Take some responsibility and manage your own life in a responsible way!

But when it comes to Talk Radio, you don't want, you don't promote, this same self-control, this same personal responsibility. What you are posting here is the same mentality that we assigned to the "Cadillac-driving welfare queen" of the 1960s. "I wan't what I want, and I want it now, and I want it MY WAY!"

We have built the American system of communication and journalism around the concept that those people who choose to be communicators and publishers and broadcasters and journalists and other spokesmen will exercise some good judgement, self control and some amount of self regulation.

So how is it that the missionaries of the message of self-control of our lives come to the scene of the "Talk Radio" mechanism and want to work from the concept: I can and will do and say anything I want and it is my job to push up to the point that the FCC starts doling out fines.

So tell me Hoss... do you picture your job in Talk Radio as that of "a patriot who sets the example" of how self-government works... or do you see your job in Talk Radio as that of "the mythical Welfare Queen who grabs and takes everything you can until the government gives you a fine." ?????

(Tee Hee! I wish I had tapes from my days in Talk Radio. From this post, you can only imagine what some of my on-air conversations were like! )

 

[Element9]

BTW, the "Cadillac driving welfare queen" was a myth promulgated by the Reagan administration, which subtly implied that the WQ was "of color." The media bought into the meme until it was soundly debunked, but by that time, the weed had taken firm root and had spread across the front and back lawns. The Great Communicator, when later pressed, denied that he meant the "WQ" was of color.

"Professional Outrage Industry?" So... is this the same POI that protested building a mosque in Manhattan a few blocks from ground zero to replace the one that was already established and for years had been in the general area. The same POI that every year insists that "Christ" is being taken out of Christmas. That Professional Outrage Industry?

There have been some compelling points made in this thread. It should be noted that Entercom management made the decision to fire the offending morning show, not the POI or community groups. In fact, the local chapter of the LGBT community offered to educate and work with the offenders. Could Entercom have taken that route and survived the turmoil? After all, time heals all wounds. Did the company take the easy way out? Could the whole mess have become a teachable moment and lent itself to some good? Could it have generated some informative and entertaining radio? Could it have generated ratings and revenue? I think it could, but it would have taken effort and asbestos underwear.

BTW, by the looks of the D&C photo, one could get the impression that Beck might have a collection of colorful ties in his closet and enjoy Broadway musicals. And lovely Miss Kimberly just might benefit from a daily salad and brisk stroll on a treadmill. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

See. This is how it works.

 

[chas108]

"And to answer the first part: The REAL thugs are people who demand someone get fired over WORDS."

I don't like the idea of "hate speech". It's not that there isn't speech that isn't hateful, but should there be Government regulation of that speech?

NO.

But public outcry - and the reaction to it - is simply the free market working. Can't get more American than that.

Barry Beck's been in at least one unfortunate situation before, here in Pittsburgh stuck with a female sidekick hired as the grand prize in a talent hunt. It was her first ever gig and with respect to all, she sounded it. I'd have to describe the result as a morning show that was dirty without being funny.

At least Jeff Kaye had the good sense to hire a professional when 'KB's Great American Talent Hunt took place 41 years ago.

Shame because I think Beck by himself's really good...at least he was when in my current cluster in 1998, after the "Beck and Stephanie" show - for another cluster in the market - went away in a format change...although I question the validity of ANY bit going T W E L V E minutes outside the Talk format.

Finally, some companies' cultures may take a more case-by-case or laissez-faire approach when an employee crosses the line, but from what I've observed over the years, that's not Entercom.

In short...Kimberly & Beck. Should. Have. Known. Better.

 

[flybynight]

BTW, the "Cadillac-driving welfare queen" was a myth cooked up by the Reagan promo-pub squad, who subtly implied that she was "of color." The media bought into the meme until it was soundly debunked, but by that time, the weed had taken firm root and had spread across the front and back lawns. The Great Communicator, when later pressed, denied that he meant the "WQ" was of color.

"Professional Outrage Industry?" So... is this the same POI that protested building a mosque in Manhattan a few blocks from ground zero to replace the one that was already established and for years had been in the general area. The same POI that every year insists that "Christ" is being taken out of Christmas. That Professional Outrage Industry?

There have been some compelling points made in this thread. It should be noted that Entercom management made the decision to fire the offending morning show, not the POI or community groups.

You make a great point about the talkradio poutrage industry that regularly overreacts to, well, everything. They also call for heads to roll all the time in situations where they don't even have the full story. They still celebrate how "they" are the reason Van Jones was fired, not to mention Shirley Sherrod, who by way of heavily edited video, was made to look like she was saying some things that she wasn't saying at all...and was forced to resign.

By the way, Entercom has some experience with this Kimberly & Beck scenario. It's very similar to what happened to one of their FM morning shows in Sacramento a few years ago. Right down to the firing.

 

[chas108]

Exactly, flybynight. I will state that if the corporate culture is like what I experienced 20 years ago, one MIGHT get the impression that they might get away with such inappropriate humor...But the record shows otherwise. Cross the line, cause a public outrage, get fired.

Yeah the topic IS Hot Button, Topical, and Local but also a third rail. At my cluster we have a policy about third rails...have a discussion with the PD FIRST. Then attack it according to plan. (A Plan that would not include calling someone a Nut Job).

I'm assuming none of that happened here.

 

[TheBigA]

The REAL thugs are people who demand someone get fired over WORDS.

Sorry...all words aren't created equal.

Kimberly didn’t help by tweeting out this message – “Freedom of speech includes the freedom to offend others. You aren’t granted a right to not be offended in this life #getoverit #ROC.”

She clearly doesn't understand the First Amendment, because the FCC has rules about what can and can't be said.

 

[TheBigA]

It WAS Funny & Entertaining and Good Edgy Radio in my opinion. But here is an idea,... if you don't like it, don't listen.

Radio is beyond that. Maybe in the old pre-internet days that worked. But today, what you say goes viral. That can work FOR you if it's good. It can work against you if it's bad. And I'm sure there were some people who, like you, found it funny. But we live in a judgment world. That's what reality TV has done. It makes us want to vote people off the island.

 

[TheBigA]

Kimberley & Beck have now issued this statement:

"We are very sorry for the hurt and pain we have caused anyone, especially those in the Transgender community and their friends and families. What we said and the manner in which we handled ourselves was wrong, we take full responsibility and we deeply apologize to any and all that we offended.

Our attempt was to discuss a controversial healthcare issue; however our lack of sensitivity and understanding of the Transgender people and their plight created 12 minutes of radio we that wish we could take back.

We fully understand ENTERCOM’s position and their decision to dismiss us. It is their right and we accept their decision and our responsibility in it.

ENTERCOM has been and will continue to be a strong advocate for the LGBT community and we are proud to have been helpful in ENTERCOM’s efforts over our 13 years with the company.

It is our hope that this situation can be a time of learning and understanding about the Transgender community and not a time for additional anger and insensitivity. This is a community of individuals that struggle painfully to be themselves and find the support and comfort they deserve. We believe that this can be a chance for all of us to stop the ignorance and find our humanity."

 

[flybynight]

It is our hope that this situation can be a time of learning and understanding about the Transgender community and not a time for additional anger and insensitivity. This is a community of individuals that struggle painfully to be themselves and find the support and comfort they deserve. We believe that this can be a chance for all of us to stop the ignorance and find our humanity."

I think it would go a long way in demonstrating contrition if both Kimberly & Beck went through gender reassignment surgery. They could even still remain Kimberly & Beck. Reversed, of course.

 

[dand5780]

Sorry...all words aren't created equal.

Kimberly didn’t help by tweeting out this message – “Freedom of speech includes the freedom to offend others. You aren’t granted a right to not be offended in this life #getoverit #ROC.”

She clearly doesn't understand the First Amendment, because the FCC has rules about what can and can't be said.

She is spot on, but was something said that violated FCC rules?

 

[TheBigA]

She is spot on, but was something said that violated FCC rules?

Didn't say that, and they haven't weighed in on this yet, but she obviously violated her company's policy, and said so in their apology:

"We fully understand ENTERCOM’s position and their decision to dismiss us. It is their right and we accept their decision and our responsibility in it."

 

[TheBigA]

I think it would go a long way in demonstrating contrition if both Kimberly & Beck went through gender reassignment surgery. They could even still remain Kimberly & Beck. Reversed, of course.

Who would pay? Insurance, of course!

 

[dand5780]

Didn't say that, and they haven't weighed in on this yet, but she obviously violated her company's policy, and said so in their apology:

"We fully understand ENTERCOM’s position and their decision to dismiss us. It is their right and we accept their decision and our responsibility in it."

Right...but that has nothing to do with what the "tweet" said.

 

[TheBigA]

Right...but that has nothing to do with what the "tweet" said.

Sure it does. She now recognizes and admits that freedom of speech comes with responsibility. And she's taken it.

 

[Small Market Guy]

Sure it does. She now recognizes and admits that freedom of speech comes with responsibility. And she's taken it.

I guess the people who expressed false outrage and demanded her firing never have to be held accountable, right?

Where does this end? Exactly what point does the MOB MENTALITY come to a stop? You say you've worked on the air. How about the first time you said something that made one person mad, you got fired? How'd you like that? Because that's what we've come to. One person with an official sounding organization name and title can get a radio personality fired.

I don't know how long its been since you worked on the air in talk radio, but there is literally someone trying to get some hosts fired on a DAILY basis. This "accountability" and "responsibility" you speak of goes both ways. The outrage industry absolutely HAS to be held accountable. We're perilously close to a heckler's veto situation in radio.

I sincerely hope you step on the wrong toes one day and have to be held "accountable" just so you learn what it's like. Maybe then you'll stand up for people in our industry.

 

[TheBigA]

I guess the people who expressed false outrage and demanded her firing never have to be held accountable, right?

You're assuming it was "false outrage." If there are actual transgender people who were personally offended, it's not false.

Where does this end? Exactly what point does the MOB MENTALITY come to a stop? You say you've worked on the air. How about the first time you said something that made one person mad, you got fired?

That's a good question. I never said anything that offended anyone, and consequently I never got fired. Then again, I was a DJ who took my job description seriously, and stuck strictly to the music. That's what these folks should have done, and they'd still have jobs. We're ALL accountable for what we do, in one way or another. I stand up for people who are wrongly fired. These two weren't wrongly fired. I didn't stand up for Imus either.

But as for the mob mentality thing, I think I addressed that already. We live in a judgmental world, brought on by reality TV and too much information. It makes us want to judge everyone. Earlier, I gave the Dixie Chicks example. Where do they go to get their careers back? They made a movie about their experience called "Shut Up & Sing." I recommend watching it.

 

[Small Market Guy]

You're assuming it was "false outrage." If there are actual transgender people who were personally offended, it's not false.

If they weren't listening in the first place it's false outrage. Someone had to be monitoring it and put up the "Bat signal" for them to spring into action. Like I said, I guarantee 99% of the people who signed that "petition" weren't listening, and 99% of them weren't even in Rochester. Hell, the outraged people I saw complaining online weren't even transgender. It's just a lynch mob of politically correct thugs that can't STAND someone disagree with them.

I didn't stand up for Imus either.

Then you're a sorry excuse for a radio personality. Sorry for being harsh, but you are. Maybe you're a good person, and it seems like you are. But you absolutely do not deserve to work in this business.

That's my opinion. The difference is, I am not going to get a bunch of people who know NOTHING about this together to get you fired.

 

[flybynight]

We're perilously close to a heckler's veto situation in radio.

Thanks to the tea party, and aided by talkradio, we already have that in congress.