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enough ads!

S

Shredder

Anyone else find that the more ads that are placed on a station, the more unlistenable it becomes? sometimes even ruining the flow of the show?

before I gave up WPLJ, it seemed like they announced a sponsor for everything they did....hell, their blast off video alone wasted 45 seconds showing nothing but sponsors.

Now CBS seems to be following suit. First they add a double traffic tag. I think Nolan hates doing it, because sometimes he doesn't bother with it at all. As a listener, it ruins the flow of how you've been hearing things for 25 years.

After the traffic, they did some super weird dan taylor car ad where he recorded it from a phone audio. it popped up out of literally nowhere.

Do the sales people not care that when you throw in too many ads, that it turns listeners off?
or am I just the only one who cares?
 
You think you have an issue, I cannot even tolerate enhanced underwriting since I began listening to these guys!
 
WBLS is the worst offender with ads. One evening they had a single commercial block that was over 11 minutes long! Talk about unlistenable!
 
Shredder said:
Do the sales people not care that when you throw in too many ads, that it turns listeners off?
or am I just the only one who cares?
Click to expand...

This is one of these internal battles that happens every day at every radio station in the country. It's the conflict between sales and programming. Similar to Israel and Palestinians. Two different cultures, two different motivations, both equally important.
 
enough ads! Reply to Thread

TheBigA said:
\

It's the conflict between sales and programming.
Click to expand...

Actually it's a battle within the programming department too!

There is an ongoing debate about how to (and how much to) bunching up of spots, to free up stopsets elsewhere.

Right now, the researching data is leaning to longer stopsets and longer sweeps.

From what I can see, the thinking is that the don't expect you to listen through 11 minutes of spots...but they DO expect to keep you for the other 49 uninterrupted minutes....(that sort of thing). ;-)

That's the tradeoff.
 
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The better tradeoff is higher rates and fewer ads.

Of course, justifying higher rates would require better programming. Better programming would attract more listeners, but the cost might eat up the higher rates. It's a fine line. Since today's management seems willing to take that risk I wonder how much longer ad supported radio can survive the downward spiral.
 
Wimmmex said:
Actually it's a battle within the programming department too!

There is an ongoing debate about how to (and how much to) bunching up of spots, to free up stopsets elsewhere.

Right now, the researching data is leaning to longer stopsets and longer sweeps.

From what I can see, the thinking is that the don't expect you to listen through 11 minutes of spots...but they DO expect to keep you for the other 49 uninterrupted minutes....(that sort of thing). ;-)

That's the tradeoff.
Click to expand...

But if the tradeoff leads to tune-out, both the station and the advertiser lose. There must be a "happy medium" somewhere.
 
JeffM said:
But if the tradeoff leads to tune-out, both the station and the advertiser lose. There must be a "happy medium" somewhere.
Click to expand...

I'd be willing to put up with 6 minute ads. If it's a show I like, and don't want to mis content, I won't change the station or switch to my own stuff... anything LONGER than 6 minutes (and six minutes is rather long!) is way too much.

however, if the show is nothing but info tainment (Big Joe Henry like shows where the breaks are 3 minutes or less) I'm tuning in and out of stations till the commercials are over. If the show isn't long enough to bother with, there's no point listening to a long commercial break.

That's why I like watching CBS. Back inthe day, I think they always had the shortest commercial breaks during daytime. normally 2 or 3 spots.. made them seem to go by real quick

I'm amazed commercials even work anyway, considering what's trying to be sold these days. I just heard one for a 'college laptop' service, complete with hip hop soundtrack in the background. not sure what that one is supposed to be targeting.
 
wadio said:
The better tradeoff is higher rates and fewer ads.

Of course, justifying higher rates would require better programming.
Click to expand...

Advertisers don't buy programming. They buy audience. So no connection between ad rates and "better programming." Advertisers don't want to pay more for fewer impressions. They want more impressions for less money. So raising rates for fewer ads guarantees advertisers will take their money someplace else.

Increasing rates would also put radio out of reach for most advertisers. As it is, you're hearing a lot of ads for insurance and drug companies. Smaller mom & pop stores can't afford radio. So increasing the rates is not a good idea.


JeffM said:
But if the tradeoff leads to tune-out, both the station and the advertiser lose. There must be a "happy medium" somewhere.
Click to expand...

We do studies on this all the time, as do the major ad agencies. The fact is the majority of listeners don't tune out when commercials start. Hard to believe, but it's a fact. Why? Some listen in the workplace, and it's too much trouble to keep changing the station. A lot of offices have a station for a day rule. They pick a station, and it stays on all day. My local post office and car repair place both do this. Anyone wearing a PPM who goes into either of those places gets counted as a listener.
 
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How about a station that does great marketing but never has ANY program material...just all continuous commercials with maybe some fifteen second news/traffic/weather breaks sandwiched in a few times each hour?
 
ai4i said:
How about a station that does great marketing but never has ANY program material...just all continuous commercials with maybe some fifteen second news/traffic/weather breaks sandwiched in a few times each hour?
Click to expand...

the movie demolition man had something like that :)
 
ai4i said:
How about a station that does great marketing but never has ANY program material...just all continuous commercials with maybe some fifteen second news/traffic/weather breaks sandwiched in a few times each hour?
Click to expand...

About 15 years ago, one local station switching from alt-rock to top 40 did just that as a stunt for a week or so; "real" commercials, spoof commercials, and old time radio commercials for Ovaltine, etc. Was hilarious! I have an aircheck somewhere...I think...
 
TheBigA said:
Advertisers don't buy programming. They buy audience.
Click to expand...
National advertisers, yes. But for local advertisers that's simply not true. They buy personality, they buy buzz, they buy hearing their names (and sometimes their own voices) on the radio. They buy a Joan Hamburg because she schmoozes them. They buy John Gambling on a pea-shooter signal because they equate his name with success, or because their friends listen. They buy Imus because he's an icon. Ratings have nothing to do with it.
 
wadio said:
National advertisers, yes. But for local advertisers that's simply not true. They buy personality, they buy buzz, they buy hearing their names (and sometimes their own voices) on the radio. They buy a Joan Hamburg because she schmoozes them. They buy John Gambling on a pea-shooter signal because they equate his name with success, or because their friends listen. They buy Imus because he's an icon. Ratings have nothing to do with it.
Click to expand...

Most of the advertisers who are on significant stations, whether local or national accounts, buy through ad agencies. There are, in fact, many ad agencies that don't sign national or even regional accounts and who specialize in local accounts like car dealers, local retailers and such.

As part of negotiating with local stations, local agencies often request "value added" which may include some on-air mentions, appearances of talent at a business location, etc.

And when they buy a 50,000 watt "pea shooter" that has less audience that some other 50,000 watt stations, they pay a price that is appropriate for the audience size. Radio advertising is sold to a greater extent than not based on audience size. The more audience, the higher the rate to be paid.

Sure, there are some emotionally driven buys at all levels... but local accounts are well equipped to understand when their ads work and when they do not, and they don't stick with an ineffective medium for long.
 
wadio said:
National advertisers, yes. But for local advertisers that's simply not true.
Click to expand...

You're talking about selling talk vs selling music, not local vs. national.

Regardless, increasing the ad rate for fewer ads is not going to work. Advertisers want the most impressions for the fewest dollars. If there's something they really want, like the Super Bowl, they'll pay any price. But it won't affect the number of spots.
 
I think this is part of what is killing WABC. I cannot listen to the station anymore since I find the constant Ad breaks intolerable.
 
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