cbs radio disney freq.

[Unregistered]

Does cbs buy am990 in order to have a outlet for news?

 

[davideduardo]

Does cbs buy am990 in order to have a outlet for news?

That is one horrible signal, and it does not cover most of the English speaking persons in the MSA.

Further, Miami is a bit small of a market to sustain an English language news station, particularly since the MSA is over 50% Hispanic.

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

If CBS is going to invest anything in Miami (and given that they're making moves to get out of radio, I doubt that they will), it will be on FM. Besides, they already have a poorly-performing AM to work with: WQAM. If they're going to do anything on AM, that's where it will be.

 

[davideduardo]

If CBS is going to invest anything in Miami (and given that they're making moves to get out of radio, I doubt that they will), it will be on FM. Besides, they already have a poorly-performing AM to work with: WQAM. If they're going to do anything on AM, that's where it will be.

The question was whether CBS might pick up another AM to do all news.

WQAM is suffering from a degraded signal, and the increasing ethnicity of the market. The primary centers for non-Hispanic white listening are increasingly on the fringe of the WQAM signal.

Of course, WQAM is also suffering from the loss of Neil Rogers from which they never recovered. That, and the hit many talkers took with the introduction of the PPM took the station out of the running. The pre-PPM billing was around $18 million and now it is about 1/4 of that.

 

[FredLeonard]

Sorry for my fuzzy memory on this but wasn't WINZ all news at one point, following the Group W 1010 WINS format (possibly to appeal to retirees and snow birds from Noo Yawk)? Seems like Miami did try all news at one point.

 

[davideduardo]

Sorry for my fuzzy memory on this but wasn't WINZ all news at one point, following the Group W 1010 WINS format (possibly to appeal to retirees and snow birds from Noo Yawk)? Seems like Miami did try all news at one point.

Yes, it was all news long ago.

It changed from news/talk to news sometime between the Spring 1985 and the Spring 1986 book. By Spring of 1987 it was #2 with a 6.3 share. But by Spring of 1988 it was back to news and talk. By Spring of 1989, it was down to 14th with a 3.5 share. Its audience was quite old, even then, though.

It apparently did not work well enough to sustain the high costs. It was obviously restricted by the high ethnic population of the market, since all news does not index well against Blacks or Hispanics, particularly in the Sunbelt.

Likely one of the issues is that snowbirds generally don't get into the sample for ratings of any kind... but that would be a smaller part of the real problem which was not enough available revenue in a smaller market to sustain the costs.

It would be interesting to hear from anyone who was involved with the brief period of all news who might further explain what happened.

 

[Mike Sheridan]

The question was whether CBS might pick up another AM to do all news.

WQAM is suffering from a degraded signal, and the increasing ethnicity of the market. The primary centers for non-Hispanic white listening are increasingly on the fringe of the WQAM signal.

Of course, WQAM is also suffering from the loss of Neil Rogers from which they never recovered. That, and the hit many talkers took with the introduction of the PPM took the station out of the running. The pre-PPM billing was around $18 million and now it is about 1/4 of that.

For the life of me I can't figure out what CBS wants with WQAM in the first place. Didn't Beasley get the better part of that deal?

 

[artfuldodger]

Yeah, this signal is non existent in Broward during the day. At night, it gets better, but not by much. I remember when 980 WHSR (the old WWNN moved site to Parkland), that caused WMYM's signal to be redirected. Its something crazy, like 8 towers. Mike made a point of what the heck CBS wants with QAM. I think that applies even more to WMYM. They were off the air for years and years, until Disney rescued it. Outside of a church or religious group, I don't see anyone who would want it. The best buy would be a broadcasting group in the Bahama's takes it, makes a go of it.

 

[artfuldodger]

Oh wow. The things we remember. WINZ was all news...way the heck back when.

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

The question was whether CBS might pick up another AM to do all news.

AM in general suffers from a degraded signal. The format is irrelevant.

Oh wow. The things we remember. WINZ was all news...way the heck back when.

Oh, the memories... I remember Saturday afternoons in the car with my father listening to WINZ in the all-news era. As I recall, they were running CBS network news at the time. That was when I fell in love with that classic sounder.

For the life of me I can't figure out what CBS wants with WQAM in the first place. Didn't Beasley get the better part of that deal?

Very much so.

 

[davideduardo]

AM in general suffers from a degraded signal. The format is irrelevant.
.

AM signals are the one thing that has not been degraded.

Unless stations have been poorly maintained, their signal strengths are no different than they were decades ago for the same facility.

What has impeded AM is the rise of man made noise. That simply means that a stronger signal is needed to overcome the noise than in decades past.

Add to that poorer quality radios, and what it means is that only the best AM facilities are fully competitive. But that is nothing new, as most markets grew out of the coverage of the regional channel stations they have shortly after W.W. II as urban sprawl move populations outside many stations' coverage areas.

The fact is that for the last 40 years or so, there have been an average of less than two AMs per top 100 market that cover 80% of the population or more day and night. Those stations with lesser signals survived up to the early 70's but as FM grew, people switched to the band that had more good signals and more different formats.

But saying AM has been degraded is not correct. AM is what it is; FM just does the OTA radio thing better.

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

What has impeded AM is the rise of man made noise. That simply means that a stronger signal is needed to overcome the noise than in decades past.

Add to that poorer quality radios, and what it means is that only the best AM facilities are fully competitive. But that is nothing new, as most markets grew out of the coverage of the regional channel stations they have shortly after W.W. II as urban sprawl move populations outside many stations' coverage areas.

The fact is that for the last 40 years or so, there have been an average of less than two AMs per top 100 market that cover 80% of the population or more day and night. Those stations with lesser signals survived up to the early 70's but as FM grew, people switched to the band that had more good signals and more different formats.

And all of that means what to the average listener? "Degraded signals." They don't know the technical details or why AM sounds like crap, they just know that it's gotten worse in their experience over the years, and thus, they think that AM in general has been degraded. Which, in a general sense, it has.

 

[davideduardo]

And all of that means what to the average listener? "Degraded signals." They don't know the technical details or why AM sounds like crap, they just know that it's gotten worse in their experience over the years, and thus, they think that AM in general has been degraded. Which, in a general sense, it has.

Then why didn't you say, "listeners perceive that AM sounds worse now..." instead of saying something that, on face value, was untrue?

 

[AM IS DEAD]

Nobody cares about AM anymore!

AM signals are the one thing that has not been degraded.

Unless stations have been poorly maintained, their signal strengths are no different than they were decades ago for the same facility.

What has impeded AM is the rise of man made noise. That simply means that a stronger signal is needed to overcome the noise than in decades past.

Add to that poorer quality radios, and what it means is that only the best AM facilities are fully competitive. But that is nothing new, as most markets grew out of the coverage of the regional channel stations they have shortly after W.W. II as urban sprawl move populations outside many stations' coverage areas.

The fact is that for the last 40 years or so, there have been an average of less than two AMs per top 100 market that cover 80% of the population or more day and night. Those stations with lesser signals survived up to the early 70's but as FM grew, people switched to the band that had more good signals and more different formats.

But saying AM has been degraded is not correct. AM is what it is; FM just does the OTA radio thing better.

Who cares? No one. AM is also DEAD. FM's years are short too. Get with times.

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

Then why didn't you say, "listeners perceive that AM sounds worse now..." instead of saying something that, on face value, was untrue?

Because, at face value, it wasn't untrue. AM has been degraded by electronic noise and overpopulation of the band. Most everyone understood what I meant regardless of the technical details. Interesting that you, being the all-knowing sage of radio, did not. One has to wonder if that was by choice.

 

[Ai4i]

Yeah, this signal is non existent in Broward during the day. At night, it gets better, but not by much.

For all points everywhere, Tiger Radio's signal is seven (7) dB stronger in the day than at night.

...that caused WMYM's signal to be redirected...something crazy, like 8 towers.

Six, in a two next to two next to two arrangement similar to the APE's, uh, I mean WOKV's.

 

[davideduardo]

Because, at face value, it wasn't untrue. AM has been degraded by electronic noise and overpopulation of the band. Most everyone understood what I meant regardless of the technical details. Interesting that you, being the all-knowing sage of radio, did not. One has to wonder if that was by choice.

How do you know that even one person understood your intent?

Your statement said that "AM had been degraded".

That would, on first review, mean that something was done to AM stations themselves, such as having the FCC downgrade their power levels.

The conditions that have made AM less viable began in the post-War 40's when urban sprawl began and gradually grew with the usage of things like fluorescent lamps. If people even think about such things, analysis shows that the changes have taken place over a 60 year period and are not recent.

In fact, in your "clarification" you fail to mention the biggest factor that limits FM: most significant AMs were licensed in the 30's and the powers needed to cover a market then are totally inadequate for covering the much larger geography of today's geographically larger markets. The flood of AMs licensed after W.W. II all had to protect those original AMs and could even less be expected to cover growing metros.

Noise has made the ability to cover markets even more difficult, but the problem is decades old. "Crowding" of the AM band was done mostly in the 40's and 50's and into the 60's. It has not been much of a "new" factor for several decades.

 

[Mike Sheridan]

If you look at the CBS/Beasley deal it looks like Beasley came out better. I don't know how the billing compares so that obviously is the key.

As for WQAM I keep thinking CBS has something interesting planned. The CBS Radio Director of Engineering is Glen Walden who spent many years as the Chief Engineer of stations WEDR and WWOK. Maybe he has some insight.

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

How do you know that even one person understood your intent?

Because I'm a broadcaster, and I tend to phrase things in a way that most of the general public would understand. Very few people have trouble understanding my intent. You seem to be one of them on a regular basis.

The conditions that have made AM less viable began in the post-War 40's when urban sprawl began and gradually grew with the usage of things like fluorescent lamps. If people even think about such things, analysis shows that the changes have taken place over a 60 year period and are not recent.

LED lightbulbs in traffic signals. Home computers. Laptops. Electric cars. All exploded in use within a 15-20 year period. All affect the quality of AM reception. That recent enough for ya?

In fact, in your "clarification" you fail to mention the biggest factor that limits FM: most significant AMs were licensed in the 30's and the powers needed to cover a market then are totally inadequate for covering the much larger geography of today's geographically larger markets. The flood of AMs licensed after W.W. II all had to protect those original AMs and could even less be expected to cover growing metros.

I think you meant "the biggest factor that limits AM," not FM, but regardless of the timeline, that still contributes to the noise on the band. I never said the problems were entirely recent. I never even implied it.

Are you done trying to find excuses to argue with me now, or are you going to continue this pissing match just out of spite?

 

[JoshTheRadioDude]

...similar to the APE's, uh, I mean WOKV's.

Boy, you wanna talk about directional night patterns? WHEW!