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Adult Standards Returns to Los Angeles

Right, because per the linked article, that frequency has hosted several iterations of adult standards. To the best of my knowledge, the classical format is one of the longest lasting formats on there, almost five and a half years, which will come to an end tomorrow (sorry for not including the date of the flip in my original post). The 50s/60s oldies format (my favorite one out of all of them) that it had in the mid 2000s lasted 10 months, from August 2004 to June 2005.

I wonder why 1260 keeps going back to adult standards if the audience for that is even older and less desireable to advertisers than for 50s/60s oldies. Sounds to me like Mount Wilson FM Broadcasters, Inc. is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
 
I wonder why 1260 keeps going back to adult standards if the audience for that is even older and less desireable to advertisers than for 50s/60s oldies. Sounds to me like Mount Wilson FM Broadcasters, Inc. is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

There is no market for this format among ad agencies and advertisers who use ratings. But there may be enough business among local direct accounts to make a go of it.

One issue is the number of folks 70 and over in the coverage area. My impression is that any retired person who can leaves the LA area because of the excessive cost of living, pollution and difficulties in getting around. This would leave a reduced number of potential listeners (who would pretty much have to all be non-Hispanic whites due to the format) in a limited coverage area.
 


There is no market for this format among ad agencies and advertisers who use ratings. But there may be enough business among local direct accounts to make a go of it.

One issue is the number of folks 70 and over in the coverage area. My impression is that any retired person who can leaves the LA area because of the excessive cost of living, pollution and difficulties in getting around. This would leave a reduced number of potential listeners (who would pretty much have to all be non-Hispanic whites due to the format) in a limited coverage area.

Saul has his own in-house automated format for this. It's called "Unforgettable", and it's been running on KKGO HD-3 since March of 2015...as well as on KNRY-AM (1240) in Monterey (same feed---localized IDs and sweepers trigger in between the music). I'm a fan of the music, so I'll listen when I'm in Monterey or L.A. (the stream has been down for some time now). I have NEVER heard an ad....not one. So it's not even working on a local direct level.

As for 65+ demographics, David, the Census shows 10% of Los Angeles County is over 65...but factor out non-Anglo, factor in the limited signal and there's a very small audience.l.

The KNRY signal's no great shakes, either, but it covers the cities of Monterey and Carmel just fine. 15.5% of Monterey's residents are 65+, and 35.7% of Carmel's. If there was a local direct pitch to be made, that'd be where I'd expect it to work. Saul's got sales people up there for his FMs...but it doesn't look like there's money to be made on "Unforgettable".
 
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Wonder if standards will work this time on 1260? Saul has tried this in the past and always kept flipping to something else. Was their any audience for classical music on AM? Only reason it is on i LA is because it's a locally owned station. Yes, I know it's a very difficult sell and the demos are the highest they can be, but personally I am glad there will be a choice on the radio dial in SoCal. I've heard his "Unforgettable" format on line and it's well done, Kudos to Sal for giving Southland listeners a choice and serving an older,but very niched audience.

I'm 67 and I have loved that music since I was a teen when artists like Sinatra,Como and The Lettermen were mixed in with the other hits of the day in the 60's.
 
Everything Saul Levine does works. He beats to a different drum than his competition and making money is not the highest priority in the Levine empire. I always thought Saul Levine was cheap and paid the lowest wages in town. Then I was offered a half year contract at KQKE at $50K a year. Because of my knowledge of Mount Wilson I passed and took a job with benefits at GTE for $15K a year. Was it a mistake, well yes and the Quake shut down months later anyway. I even tried to get him to consider changing 1260 in 1994 to Quake Country after the Northridge Earthquake, no interest at all.
 
I wonder why 1260 keeps going back to adult standards if the audience for that is even older and less desireable to advertisers than for 50s/60s oldies. Sounds to me like Mount Wilson FM Broadcasters, Inc. is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
So you're saying they are insane? :)
 
I'm hardly try to find a stream and website. But not yet?

I doubt there will be a stream. It went offline months ago. The K-Mozart stream is still carrying K-Mozart.

As for a website, there's this:

http://knry1240.com/

It hasn't been touched in about a year and a half. I wouldn't bet on Saul spending time or resources adding 1260 in Los Angeles to it.

All I can figure, given that I've never heard a single ad on Unforgettable, is that it's purely a placeholder for Saul. He has something he wants to do with or a price he wants for his AMs, but it's not time yet. So he puts this on with no attention and no billing and just treads water. For those of us with an affinity for the music, it's fine...but I won't be surprised the day it's gone.
 
KNRY was streaming about a year ago. Mt. Wilson cut all of the Monterey streams about the time they decided to shop the cluster.
 
This might be legitimate:

Facebook page link: https://www.facebook.com/Unforgettable1260/

Future website link (hosted by GoDaddy as of this posting): http://unforgettable1260.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Somewhat related:

On KKJZ HD2 (88.1) is a jazz + standards vocal channel that might be the template for what's airing on 1260 AM (or at least closely related).
Player link: http://www.jazzandblues.org/programming/listen/vocals/
Direct streaming URL link: http://1.ice1.firststreaming.com:8000/kgil_am.aac
 
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This might be legitimate:

Facebook page link: https://www.facebook.com/Unforgettable1260/

Future website link (hosted by GoDaddy as of this posting): http://unforgettable1260.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Somewhat related:

On KKJZ HD2 (88.1) is a jazz + standards vocal channel that might be the template for what's airing on 1260 AM (or at least closely related).
Player link: http://www.jazzandblues.org/programming/listen/vocals/
Direct streaming URL link: http://1.ice1.firststreaming.com:8000/kgil_am.aac

pjc1961:

Very nice detective work! The Facebook page has posts going back more than a year, with a focus on Northern California. I'm betting this was the "Unforgettable 1240" page until yesterday. And only 60 "likes" in a year and a half....which kinda makes the point that this skews very old.

The KKJZ HD-2 feed is exactly what "Unforgettable" sounds like apart from liners and the ID, so there's the answer. Saul's got it running as the HD2 of a non-com and is feeding KKGO HD-3, 1260 in Los Angeles and 1240 in Monterey. There aren't any commercials because there's no place for them on the mothership, which is owned by CSULB but managed and programmed by Saul.

Ultimately, it costs him next to nothing, but there's no potential for revenue on the AMs in L.A. and Monterey, which makes me wonder what Saul is thinking. Saul sold or donated his Monterey FMs a couple of months ago and is now down to AM 630 and 1240...so maybe Saul just wants "Unforgettable" on a terrestrial, non-HD signal once he unloads the Monterey stations.
 
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Maybe it's a way for Saul to slowly get back into the oldies market for the Los Angeles area and bring back some nostalgia in the radio scene for L.A., which has been sorely missing for over 20 years it seems. Since KRTH is headed to the 90's, maybe down the road, real oldies can return to L.A in some form.
 
Maybe it's a way for Saul to slowly get back into the oldies market for the Los Angeles area and bring back some nostalgia in the radio scene for L.A., which has been sorely missing for over 20 years it seems. Since KRTH is headed to the 90's, maybe down the road, real oldies can return to L.A in some form.

Because of Michael's comments about the Monterrey "Unforgettable" station running with no commercials, I suspect that the format may simply be a personal choice of a sole owner who reports to nobody but himself.

In a market like LA, agencies buy young... 18-49 and 25-54. Advertisers with multiple locations generally have an agency. Single location (or single zone) advertisers can't use radio efficiently because they will pay for loads of coverage that is in areas where customers are too far away. With traffic getting worse and worse in LA, folks will not drive across town for a single store.

So the local direct money is limited.

And I don't need to remind you that standards are very different from "real oldies" and that for many "oldies" partisans standards are a turn-off. There is no blend or transition between those two genres; it is either-or. And I do not detect that Saul Levine has any preference for "real oldies" in the manner that he does for jazz, classical and standards.
 



And I don't need to remind you that standards are very different from "real oldies" and that for many "oldies" partisans standards are a turn-off. There is no blend or transition between those two genres; it is either-or. And I do not detect that Saul Levine has any preference for "real oldies" in the manner that he does for jazz, classical and standards.

I don't understand this. Can you explain in more detail?
 
I don't understand this. Can you explain in more detail?

Most standards listeners don't want 50's and 60's pop oldies, and most oldies listeners don't want standards.

We saw evidence of this when many markets had, long ago, both standards (of the "Music of Your Life" type) and oldies stations. There was very little sharing of the listener base.

The implication is that if you mix the two genres, you will get less listeners than were you to do either genre separately.

Of course, standards is a 70 and over format, so the listener base is dwindling.
 
Given the prices asked for AMs in the LA market, somebody is making something and even those without the ratings must be because they are still there. In my experience radio owners don't change formats unless it is not working. Owners seem to be acutely aware of money draining from their bank accounts and a format change is always to stop losing money or at least lessen it. Contrary to popular belief, radio station owners haven't a money tree in their backyard to harvest at will. They only have so much money and tend to want to hang on to it, meaning they don't run stations to lose money. Saul might like jazz and classical and try to make a go of a format he likes but the intent is to always produce a positive income. Sure, AM is greatly challenged compared to FM.

I doubt a move toward oldies would happen. If that were the case why not just go oldies. You're already changing the format. Perhaps he is tidying things up to get ready to sell. Perhaps Unforgettable is less overhead, something potential buyers look at. Perhaps the feeling is Unforgettable will attract a wider base audience than classical on AM. It seems it would. My feeling is more classical listeners would prefer FM over AM for classical music.

Unforgettable is very different in my book than true oldies. Yes there is a good amount of crossover but Unforgettable is based more on what we once called MOR and Easy Listening while Real Oldies is based on Rock and Roll Era material. While Frank Sinatra might be heard on both formats, The Dave Clark Five would not. Likewise you you less apt to hear Mitch Miller on Real Oldies than Glen Campbell. Both might play Elvis but Crying In The Chapel fits Unforgettable while All Shook Up is strictly True Oldies. I'd say it is more of an either/or based on the charts and true formats.

With that said, many so called Nostalgia stations sound more like soft Top 40 oldies these days, so where Saul draws the lines is what counts.
 
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