Philadelphia Radio PPM Ratings: September 2017

[Jul]

The September 2017 ratings (August 17 - September 13)

http://ratings.****************/cgi-bin/rol.exe/arb007

http://www.allaccess.com/nielsen/q/market/89/philadelphia-pa

The October 2017 ratings (September 14 - October 11) will be released on 10/30/2017 . Any thoughts?

 

[Jul]

1210 AM's cume went down 20,000 , 16th with a 2.7, 22nd in cume. WIP's ratings spiked to a 6.4 in 4th place, cume went up 166,00 (WIP 11th in cume). No doubt the Eagles had something to do with WIP's rise in the ratings.

 

[TheBigA]

No doubt the Eagles had something to do with WIP's rise in the ratings.

And probably not the Phillies.

 

[radiodx10]

Glad to see Radio 104.5 holding on to its 11th position. Solid mid-range ratings, likely going to stay alt rock for a while. Crazy to see how well WBEB is billing, but I reckon since more people are out and about with september beginning school, you got a lot of soccer moms driving kids around everywhere so they put 101.1 on to shut everyone up since their music is about as pre-packaged as it gets.

WDAS-FM made a HUGE spike from 6.0 to 7.1- no real reason why- I guess it's just if you don't like Bore, hahah I mean More-FM, you go to WDAS-FM instead.

 

[davideduardo]

Glad to see Radio 104.5 holding on to its 11th position. Solid mid-range ratings, likely going to stay alt rock for a while.

In its current format, the station is doing well in ratings, but it's the lowest billing in the cluster... 18th in the market overall last year. In fact, it surprises me that they have not changed format long ago.

Crazy to see how well WBEB is billing, but I reckon since more people are out and about with september beginning school, you got a lot of soccer moms driving kids around everywhere so they put 101.1 on to shut everyone up since their music is about as pre-packaged as it gets.

It's a lot more than that. The station has #1 to #3 in just about every sales demo and daypart, making it a much better buy for most accounts.

WDAS-FM made a HUGE spike from 6.0 to 7.1- no real reason why- I guess it's just if you don't like Bore, hahah I mean More-FM, you go to WDAS-FM instead.

WDAS has been on a gradual increase since Summer of 2015, with a strengthening in the core demos. In the case of stations that have a tight target or go after ethnic listeners, it is far better to use three month (or more) rolling averages, since they are high TSL and lower cume formats. WDAS has less than half the cume of WBEB on average, meaning that a tiny change in panel can create full share point variations.

 

[Jul]

I honestly don't know if CBS/Entercom is going to put up with the terrible 6 plus numbers for 96.5 and 1210 AM much longer. I think much needed changes are overdue for both stations.

 

[radiodx10]

Incredible insight David- thank you so much! Either way, I'm glad that WRFF has't changed formats. They're a staple for many college kids in and around philly, playing a lot of music people our age enjoy, without being so patronizing like some other stations can be. They're not perfect by any means, but they're a station that is unique and stands out on the FM band, besides the obvious alternatives like 91.7 WKDU, WDBK 91.5, and WXPN.

And Jul- you've been saying WPHT is needs to switch formats like a broken record. They're not going to swtich formats in years! CBS will leave it be until they're down to 10 or so people are listening to it. Believe you me, I do not know anyone, and I mean ANYONE, who listens to it. Their audio is trash, their programming is canned and disgustingly conservative, and it's only good for those in the midwest to DX. It's a blowtorch signal, but one that is wasted entirely. However, it'll never change for years to come. It'll maybe go to religious, spanish, or just sign off for good MAYBE in the next 5-10 years.

 

[davideduardo]

I honestly don't know if CBS/Entercom is going to put up with the terrible 6 plus numbers for 96.5 and 1210 AM much longer. I think much needed changes are overdue for both stations.

Jul, you keep saying the same thing about 1210 over and over. The fact is that the station is billing better than it could with any other format and is likely moderately profitable.

The sports niche in Philly is now an FM proposition, and KYW owns the news position. Either they stay with what they are doing or they sell the station to a religious operator... unlikely as long as there is some kind of profit.

On 96.5, we need to wait until the ownership transfer is completed; the more likely possibility is that they try to improve the existing format.

 

[Gunsmoke]

So I guess they should of blown up the only Alternative station in over a 70 miles radius years ago, that has been pulling in great numbers the 10 years of their existence, for yet another Urban or Ethnic floundering format, current R1 properties and Rumba proved that (are their about 100 in the area now and still growing) makes great logic. Not going to happen, no matter what haters of the format think.

 

[CTListener]

So I guess they should of blown up the only Alternative station in over a 70 miles radius years ago, that has been pulling in great numbers the 10 years of their existence, for yet another Urban or Ethnic floundering format, current R1 properties and Rumba proved that (are their about 100 in the area now and still growing) makes great logic. Not going to happen, no matter what haters of the format think.

The "haters" aren't the radio professionals, who don't have a dog in this fight. What makes alternative rock an endangered format is the attitude of advertising agencies and their clients. Alternative pushed the wrong demographic buttons. Its listeners are largely male in a radio universe dominated by female listeners. They are largely young and don't have much disposable income. More worrisome, they are more likely to be cynical and resistant to advertising pitches than the average listeners to other musical formats. No stereotype is 100 percent accurate, but enough alt-rock fans apparently fit the cynical-young-slacker stereotype to make stations that play the music unpalatable to Madison Avenue.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

So I guess they should of blown up the only Alternative station in over a 70 miles radius years ago, that has been pulling in great numbers the 10 years of their existence, for yet another Urban or Ethnic floundering format, current R1 properties and Rumba proved that (are their about 100 in the area now and still growing) makes great logic. Not going to happen, no matter what haters of the format think.

This nonsense again?

David noted he was surprised and backed his statements with data, not exaggeration and hyperbole.

Only one number ultimately matters, and that is the bottom line. In that context it can fairly be said it is a surprise that there has not been a change. No more, no less.

 

[TheBigA]

enough alt-rock fans apparently fit the cynical-young-slacker stereotype to make stations that play the music unpalatable to Madison Avenue.

Which is why in some markets, alternative is becoming a format for non-commercial radio, as it's become in New York City.

 

[davideduardo]

So I guess they should of blown up the only Alternative station in over a 70 miles radius years ago, that has been pulling in great numbers the 10 years of their existence,

The "great numbers" station owners look for are sales figures. Having lots of listeners that most ad campaigns do not want to reach is the same as having no listeners at all.

The reason why many alt rock stations have the unemployed young white audience is supported by the way bail bondsmen and pawn shops use them as their primary ad outlet.

for yet another Urban or Ethnic floundering format, current R1 properties and Rumba proved that (are their about 100 in the area now and still growing) makes great logic. Not going to happen, no matter what haters of the format think.

Stations founder when they can't find revenue. Or when the format is poor or poorly executed. Or when the signal is not competitive.

Rumba was a poorly executed format that did not properly target the local audience. WRFF is a station that properly targets an audience, but where fewer advertisers don't want to reach that audience.

 

[Jul]

Hello.

 

[Jul]

Jul, you keep saying the same thing about 1210 over and over. The fact is that the station is billing better than it could with any other format and is likely moderately profitable.

The sports niche in Philly is now an FM proposition, and KYW owns the news position. Either they stay with what they are doing or they sell the station to a religious operator... unlikely as long as there is some kind of profit.

1210 AM as it is right now is not going to last forever, given the ratings, given the current landscape of Philly radio, talk radio, AM radio, etc, CBS/Entercom should think about what to do with 1210 AM now and not wait.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

1210 AM as it is right now is not going to last forever, given the ratings, given the current landscape of Philly radio, talk radio, AM radio, etc, CBS/Entercom should think about what to do with 1210 AM now and not wait.

You know what's not going to last forever as it is right now? Nothing. Nothing will last forever. Such a criteria is absurd.

And guess what? People who are paid to do such things do think about long-term viability of all of their properties. When they feel the time is right, they make a change. They're making the decision about what to do with 1210, and that is to generally leave it be--and collect the revenue. When that dries up, THEN is the time to make the next move.

 

[davideduardo]

1210 AM as it is right now is not going to last forever, given the ratings, given the current landscape of Philly radio, talk radio, AM radio, etc, CBS/Entercom should think about what to do with 1210 AM now and not wait.

Think of 1210 as if it were a rental office building. The owner knows that at some point in the future, he or she will have to remodel the lobby and hallways. They know that the AC will likely need to be changed and new technology will require rewiring for fiber or whatever comes next.

But for the moment, the building is fully rented, makes nice money and any immediate changes would likely annoy the current tenants and just cause needless expenses. The changes will, inevitably, come in the future. But for the moment, it is best to make money until such point that tenant demands require an investment in change... but not a moment before that happens.

So it is indeed best and highly prudent to wait. Way too many pioneers get shot.

 

[CTListener]

You know what's not going to last forever as it is right now? Nothing. Nothing will last forever. Such a criteria is absurd.

And guess what? People who are paid to do such things do think about long-term viability of all of their properties. When they feel the time is right, they make a change. They're making the decision about what to do with 1210, and that is to generally leave it be--and collect the revenue. When that dries up, THEN is the time to make the next move.

I wouldn't be surprised if WPHT and most other AMs go dark in the next 15 years, maybe 10, maybe earlier. With AM "revitalization" all about further crowding the FM dial and not about increasing listenership to AM at all, it seems only a matter of time before AM broadcasting goes the way of international shortwave.

 

[radiodx10]

Hey CTL- Shortwave is still alive and really cool. I would not mind if AM becomes more like SW. You got some real free thinkers on SW. a lot of idiotic "prophets of god" too though.

 

[davideduardo]

Hey CTL- Shortwave is still alive and really cool. I would not mind if AM becomes more like SW. You got some real free thinkers on SW. a lot of idiotic "prophets of god" too though.

While there are a few shortwave operations on the international level still operating, what is left is a ghost of shortwave 30 to 50 years ago.

And domestic shortwave, once the principal manner of communications in many nations, ranging from China to Ecuador, is pretty much gone.