Pa rock radio

[CassChopper96]

Do you think Rock is what radio listeners want in PA. WZZO WDVE WMMR WMGK and WRVV are all very dominant in their respective markets

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

People want lots of things. Rock, of various stripes, is one.

 

[CTListener]

Rock does well in markets with older populations and Pennsylvania is full of them. In fact, the state average population is 40, compared to the national average of 37. Pennsylvania is also nearly 78 percent non-Hispanic white, compared to about 62 percent for the nation as a whole, another good indicator for rock, which has historically underperformed in all other demos.

 

[barefoot]

I think that's far from too much, considering there are more than 100 signals catering to the black and Hispanic audience in PA. The white listener is far less discriminatory when it comes to music, example being, over 50 percent of white music lovers will embrace and listen to black and Hispanic formats but less than 2 percent of the black and Hispanic audiance would ever tune into any Rock formats, maybe an Alternative on occasion. No matter how you debunk this its true facts, this is what hurts Rocks radio ratings..

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

So....where does that random stat come from? (Was it obtained before or after Gunsmoke was on the air? The show with the eyeconic lawman?)

Oh, and if something is debunked that by definition means it isn’t a true fact.

 

[TheBigA]

Based on my time in PA, I'd say it's two very different states: The big cities on either side love classic rock. The farm country in the middle loves country music. When I used to go out to State College I'd see more cows per square mile than people. So yes, rock is big in some parts, but not in the country. I remember a lot of country music in Gettysburg, Harrisburg, and Hershey. It's also big in Scranton/Wilks-Barre.

 

[davideduardo]

I think that's far from too much, considering there are more than 100 signals catering to the black and Hispanic audience in PA. The white listener is far less discriminatory when it comes to music, example being, over 50 percent of white music lovers will embrace and listen to black and Hispanic formats but less than 2 percent of the black and Hispanic audiance would ever tune into any Rock formats, maybe an Alternative on occasion. No matter how you debunk this its true facts, this is what hurts Rocks radio ratings..

The term "Hispanic format" has always been used exclusively for stations broadcasting in Spanish. Non-Hispanic whites don't listen to those stations.

Black music crosses all manner of foundries. It is liked by groups of people around the world and by many different ethnicity and races in the US, too.

On the other hand, much rock music has a harder time crossing over from the white male demographic to broad groups that are not in that core.

And when you look at specific areas, such as Pennsylvania or individual markets in PA, you see that out of 100 total shares of audience, generally well below 10 of them go to rock stations today. And if you look at the under-35 demos, the number shrinks to something closer to 5%.

Rock is far less a part of CHR, and, of course, Hot AC and AC. It's pretty much among Classic Rock and, to some extent, Classic Hits where rock music, or some of it, still hangs on among older listeners. Alternative shares are not growing, as that is such a fragmented segment most partisans listen via streaming and not to OTA radio.

And as Mr. Simpson asked, where are the stats you quote to be found?

 

[barefoot]

Black music crosses all manner of foundries. It is liked by groups of people around the world and by many different ethnicity and races in the US, too.
On the other hand, much rock music has a harder time crossing over from the white male demographic to broad groups that are not in that core. Exactly what I was implying...

 

[CTListener]

Black music crosses all manner of foundries. It is liked by groups of people around the world and by many different ethnicity and races in the US, too.
On the other hand, much rock music has a harder time crossing over from the white male demographic to broad groups that are not in that core. Exactly what I was implying...

Part of the reason may be that much early rock 'n' roll was little more than a way for record labels to make black rhythm and blues "palatable" to white listeners, especially in the South, where Top 40 stations reluctant to play Little Richard or Chuck Berry would feel comfortable playing Elvis Presley or Jerry Lee Lewis instead.

As for rock's later struggles, those were largely brought on by its steady drift away from its R&B roots. Art-rock bands like Yes and folk-rock bands like the Byrds played music with far more emphasis on melody than beat. In the case of Yes and similar bands, the end product often bore a greatr resemblance to European-born classical music than anything that ever came from African American culture or Africa itself. Virtuoso solos on the electric guitar likewise would have little appeal to listeners used to the interplay of percussion instruments.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

"less than 2 percent of the black and Hispanic audiance would ever tune into any Rock formats" isn't implying, it's presenting a number as if it's based on something tangible.

 

[davideduardo]

... less than 2 percent of the black and Hispanic audiance(sic) would ever tune into any Rock formats, maybe an Alternative on occasion. No matter how you debunk this its true facts, this is what hurts Rocks radio ratings..

I asked for facts on this, but none were given.

The fact is that "Anglo" rock is quite popular in Latin America. In Mexico City, one of the very top billing stations is RadioActiva, a GRC station, that has a rock/alternative blend. There are classic rock derivatives all through the major cities of Latin America.

And if you broaden the focus a bit, a station that played only Argentine rock in Buenos Aires got up to a 22 share in that 200+ station market 20 years ago, and is still in the top 5 playing nothing but "Pure National Rock".

The problem is that rock everywhere is on a slow decline. Shares that summed over 20 for rock formats in some markets are now below a 10 or even less. The trend is toward rhythmic music, whether the listeners be Black, Native American, Hispanic*, White or Asian (hear K-pop or J-pop lately?).

Then you say there are 100 stations targeting Hispanics and Blacks. There are actually, excluding translators, 11 Spanish language stations in PA and 7 urban/urban AC/Gospel stations (per my listings... may be off by one or two), That is out of 536 stations. Of course, I don't include stations with formats that appeal to wide ranges of ethnic groups, like rhythmic CHR stations,

* Of course, I am mixing race and ethnicity. Hispanics may be of any race.

 

[davideduardo]

"less than 2 percent of the black and Hispanic audiance would ever tune into any Rock formats" isn't implying, it's presenting a number as if it's based on something tangible.

Mr Garcia and Mr Hendrix would have disagreed.

 

[TheBigA]

Mr Garcia and Mr Hendrix would have disagreed.

Then there's Hootie. I've gotten to speak with Darius a few times, and he told me he grew up listening to country music in Charleston SC. He knows the history better than a lot of white people I know. He also listened to a lot of rock, and has written two of the most classic rock songs of the 90s. Do lots of black people tune in to rock stations to hear Hootie songs? Probably not. But they know Darius. Ray Charles once said that he knew country music growing up in Albany GA. Lionel Richie says the same thing about growing up in Alabama. My point is that you never really know who is listening to what, and I've learned that sometimes the answer will surprise you.

 

[CTListener]

But do all the Ruckers, Richies, Charleses and Charlie Prides who grew up loving country music on the radio add up to much more than the 2 percent of all African Americans that Mr. Simpson say share their enthusiasm? And David, your experience with folks in Latin America supporting Anglo rock stations is interesting, but do Spanish-dominant listeners in the United States feel the same way about English-language rock, and if so, why aren't there Spanish-language broadcasters here playing it?

 

[FreddyE1977]

Based on my time in PA, I'd say it's two very different states: The big cities on either side love classic rock. The farm country in the middle loves country music. When I used to go out to State College I'd see more cows per square mile than people. So yes, rock is big in some parts, but not in the country. I remember a lot of country music in Gettysburg, Harrisburg, and Hershey. It's also big in Scranton/Wilks-Barre.

The old saying about Pennsylvania is that it consists of Philadelphia at one end, Pittsburgh at the other,
and Alabama in between. Having spent some time in Central PA around property I own I'd have to admit
there's a lot of truth to that.

The observation that PA is older and whiter than most states carries a lot of truth. Though I was never a big country fan growing up in Pittsburgh I knew a lot of people who loved it. And there are some rock format stations in the vicinity of the property that I own (WRKW, WKVE) that do quite well.

There is another old axiom which says if you learn that the world is going to end tomorrow, move to Pittsburgh because it always takes Pittsburgh at least 15 years to catch up to the rest of the rest of the world. Some truth to that too. People here cling to and relish the past in ways you don't find everywhere.

 

[FreddyE1977]

The term "Hispanic format" has always been used exclusively for stations broadcasting in Spanish. Non-Hispanic whites don't listen to those stations.

Though none of these stations exist in my immediate area, this non-Hispanic white guy does
enjoy listening to these stations when he travels. I find the music very interesting. Lively and upbeat.

I may even be learning some Spanish by osmosis.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

But do all the Ruckers, Richies, Charleses and Charlie Prides who grew up loving country music on the radio add up to much more than the 2 percent of all African Americans that Mr. Simpson say share their enthusiasm? And David, your experience with folks in Latin America supporting Anglo rock stations is interesting, but do Spanish-dominant listeners in the United States feel the same way about English-language rock, and if so, why aren't there Spanish-language broadcasters here playing it?

Just to be clear, I was challenging the assertion, as unsubstantiated by any verifiable data source.