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June '20 trends

C

ckg279

Some general notes(as always, this is 12+); I'll leave you to pick over the rest.

*WYRK still #1 overall as it has been the last 2 trends. WBEN surged .8 to finish #2, while WBLK plummeted over 2 points for an 8.0 .
*WGRF(97 Rock)picked up nearly a point, while Kiss 98.5 jumped a full point.
*WECK(at 3.4)is now withing striking distance of WMSX(96.1 the Breeze)(which is at 3.5).
*WGR REALLY needs sports to return; they're at 3.2 in the latest trend and tied with 103.3 the Edge.
*What in the HELL happened to WHTT? They land a 5.0, which is down .2 from the last trend and over a point from March's trend.
*WBFO keeps chugging along with a 3.9; down a bit but still doing decently.
*And I didn't expect this: CFLZ(101.1 More FM)and CJED(105.1 the River)FINALLY show up in a trend. More pulled a .5 while The River got a .3 .
*WJJL(now WEBR)shows up with a .2 .
 
Give WECK it's due. The 12+ ratings are trending up. There, I've opened the flood gate. Blame me.
 
TheBigA said:
No one ever said that old people don't listen to the radio. The hard part is making money with that demo. But Buddy is an expert at that.
Click to expand...

And Buffalo overall has less than 20% non-local revenue, meaning agency business from outside the market.

With 80% or more local dollars, it is not so hard to sell to retail and service clients who don't have product-based consumer goods targets that are mostly under 55.

As one example, the heating and A/C shop likely finds older customers to be "the best" as perhaps they don't want to change filters and do light maintenance themselves. So they love the senior customer. There are many retail and service accounts that feel the same way, but they need a station that can provide good copy and production, be able to change messages instantly and other personal services. If WBEN can do that, they will compete for a long, long time.
 
DN14224 said:
Except advertisers generally avoid 50+ demos, regardless of what "Neilson" reports. (and a dead giveaway that this new member is tied to someone whose business is on Genesee St...)
Click to expand...

Not true.

While agency accounts on a regional or national basis generally buy 18-49, 25-54 or some subset, local accounts are not totally motivated by Nielsen numbers. In fact, in communities where most radio business is retail and service accounts, not brand buys, 36-64 or just "customers" is the key.

Direct accounts may be influenced at the time of an initial buy by ratings, repeat business uses a different ratings device: the cash register. If using an older leaning station brings in customers, it continues to get bought.

Saying that "expert" advertisers don't buy 50+ is wrong. Agencies tend to have chain businesses and product accounts, and they do buy 25-54 the most often for general market. But that's not the case for local accounts... where the "expert" owners of established businesses tend to favor stations that get results, not just ratings.

In any case, in national and regional brand accounts using agencies, the demo does not stop at 49... it stops at 54 in radio. TV is very 18-49 on buys, but radio is predominantly 25-54 or some subset.
 
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TheBigA said:
It's all relative. When people brag about their 18-34 numbers, the critics say most of that is over 30.
Click to expand...

True, as was sometimes the case in the early days of AOR when a station might have been #1 Men 18-49. The bulk of that often was Men 18-24 or 18-34. Or if an AOR ranked top 3 Persons 18-34, the bulk of it's listeners were Men 18-34 (and in some cases, even narrower, Men 18-24.) Stations can power-up to top 3 in the 25-54 demo with a massive showing in any of the sub-brackets, 25-34 / 25-44 / 25-49; 35-44 / 35-49; 45-49 / 49-54; 50-54.

OTOH, WYRK is #1 Persons 12+ (-again-) and it wouldn't be a surprise to find that it's #1 Persons 25-54 across the board. And it wouldn't be a surprise if WYRK was top 3 Men 25-54 and very strong with Women 25-54, with the sweet spot being 35-49 for Men and Women. Just speculating.

No surprise that 97 Rock is up, but somewhat surprised that WHTT is down, at least from what can be seen here, Persons 12+ . Could be that the Classic Hits format here is getting pinched by Classic Rock on one side, and Oldies WECK on the other, plus a nibble from Adult Hits Jack FM. Again, just speculating.
 
Looks like the posts from KINGOFALLRADIO have been deleted. When you constantly spell Nielsen as Neilson, it blows your cover.
Hope Bud got some parting gifts.

WECK is proving that there is an audience for Oldies. The ratings are quite respectable. Time will tell if the "new" WEBR takes a small piece away...
 
tbolt909 said:
Looks like the posts from KINGOFALLRADIO have been deleted. When you constantly spell Nielsen as Neilson, it blows your cover.
Hope Bud got some parting gifts.

WECK is proving that there is an audience for Oldies. The ratings are quite respectable. Time will tell if the "new" WEBR takes a small piece away...
Click to expand...

They won't be in business in 12 months. My parting gift was being reinstated to the board so i can haunt you.
 
Buddy Shula said:
My parting gift was being reinstated to the board so i can haunt you.
Click to expand...

And it is not even Halloween!

Of course, if some AC stations are doing a Christmas music weekend, you can do "Halloween in July" too!

A very common cause for station failure is when a buyer gets into the business because they "know what is missing" on the radio... even though they have no radio experience.

The reincarnated ghost of WEBR is a classic case. Minimal audience, inadequate signal, no advertiser interest. It'll fall down and... can't get up.
 
TheBigA said:
I put it in the category of a hobby station. There are several around the country. The owner doesn't need the money, and he's programming for himself.
Click to expand...

The owner may not agree with you. Are the staff all unpaid volunteers? That's an expensive hobby. Someone on this board said it will be gone in 12 months. So much for rooting for the little guy...
 
tbolt909 said:
The owner may not agree with you. Are the staff all unpaid volunteers? That's an expensive hobby. Someone on this board said it will be gone in 12 months. So much for rooting for the little guy...
Click to expand...

The station is obviously a hobby. It has no signal. It has a schizophrenic format. I give Bill much credit for fulfilling his dream, but you do not survive by call letters alone. A person over 80 would have a problem listening, if they can even get the station. WEBR was a Buffalo station. This station is not. It’s one thing to buy a station, it’s another thing to run it successfully. I could of bought this station. I passed in a second. I hope it gets a 100 share. It’s good for the AM dial. But it will be lucky if it goes past a .4.

This is no threat to any station in Buffalo. Not even a little. No advertisers, no signal, no format, no listeners, no experience. It’s a hobby.

WECK is a player in Buffalo radio. It is run very successfully. It has 4 metro signals. It’s a total metro station. It has great people, it has great ratings.

There is no comparison.
 
I put it in the category of a hobby station. There are several around the country. The owner doesn't need the money, and he's programming for himself.
Click to expand...
The owner needs the geetas to pay the staff. No mohanski, no payroll. Sure, radio nuts on message boards will talk the station up, but to the average mook in the street, how "special" is this station? Not enough mooks to make a difference.

A very common cause for station failure is when a buyer gets into the business because they "know what is missing" on the radio... even though they have no radio experience. The reincarnated ghost of WEBR is a classic case. Minimal audience, inadequate signal, no advertiser interest. It'll fall down and... can't get up.
Click to expand...

I said as much in a post two months ago on the WEBR is back thread.
The WEBR call letters are cool to radio people, but outside of the 70+ demo, they mean little if anything. Just another Ancient Modulation station playing WEBR-type standards that will appeal to a small and getting smaller audience. But hey, good luck with that.
Click to expand...
 
tbolt909 said:
The owner may not agree with you. Are the staff all unpaid volunteers? That's an expensive hobby. Someone on this board said it will be gone in 12 months. So much for rooting for the little guy...
Click to expand...

If an owner has the money, they can have a hobby station.

Many years ago, I had a trio of top rated and top billing AM stations in a market of about a million. Since my first job was at an FM, I wanted to have the first FM in my market and in my country. So I put one on. I did a very modified type of Beautiful Music, adapted to the country's culture with lots of Latin American folk music.

I had no rate card. I did not attempt to sell spots. It was a thrill, a hobby. Finally, after over a year of doing it for the pure fun of having the only FM on the dial, a friend insisted he wanted spots. I quoted about 4 times my highest AM rate, and he said "yes". It made big money afterwards.

But when I built it, it was a pure hobby. It was fun to build, fun to drive up the mountain to the 13,000 foot AMSL antenna, fun to add stereo. It was a lot less fun when it was a business, so I built another and did classical music. I even did the playlists myself. Fun for a while, too.

So, if someone wants to have a station just for the pleasure and it serves a sliver of the audience, let them.
 
It amazes me what a little man Buddy Shula is! Alan Pergament called him out today for putting up billboards in Buffalo that refer to WECK as Buffalo’s number one radio station. It’s not! Only in Buddy’s mind! He admitted as much in Pergament’s article. Shameful! Such billboards affect the credibility of our industry! Then, does he have to take such a shot on this board at WEBR? I don’t know what will happen with that station. Yes, it’s AM signal is marginal at best. Some of their hosts are pushing the Internet stream. But I will say this. I refuse to listen to WECK because of Shula’s obnoxiousness. He’s someone who alienated Buffalo radio’s most iconic personality — Danny Neaverth. I AM listening to the WEBR stream. Right now, at 11:25pm on a Thursday night, they’re playing Brubeck’s “Take Five.” I may be in a minority. But, to me, this is radio! And I’m no where near 80 years old. If this is Bill Yuhnke’s hobby, count me in! I’m happy to support a man with integrity as opposed to someone who has none! I know we’re not supposed to get personal on this board. But I’m stating facts. Shula admitted to Pergament that “in his opinion,” WECK is number one. Then, he goes on to say that WEBR will be history a year from now. Shula should just be happy to revel in the ratings he has earned so far. His station is doing well. Yet, he feels the need to disparage other people posting here as well as other station owners. So, I hope I have the right to call him out on this board.
 
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