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November Ratings

B

Buddy Shula

I noticed no one really started a thread about this, so I figured I would.

One station I noticed in particular is one called WECK. A 1KW AM. Top ten with a bullet, beating WBUF, WMSX (great minds at Townsquare). WEDG ( should be country ) WLKK ( total waste land as I predicted the day it started), and just a share behind STAR ( next station to automate and
Syndicate)

In demo WECK is top 4 , 45 plus. Not bad, but needs to be better

I have a feeling , the Christmas music effect may not be that strong this year, as consumers have found other places to hear this music. This rating period ran thru Nov 11, well inside when star and msx started Christmas

On top of this, the last three weeks of Dec, there is no Nielson. survey period, so when people may be listening to Christmas radio, there will be no diaries going out until the beginning of Jan.

I have said it before, I don’t agree with Nielson, good or bad. I think it is an archaic method, but is all we got.

The industry is in for a major shake up next year. A bad one. I look forward to talking to the bankruptcy judge when these companies file.
 
Element9 said:
Here's a link ... for what it's worth.

Buffalo-Niagara Falls November Persons 12+

And yes, WYRK is #1. Again.
Click to expand...
Which is why Townsquare didn't flip WBUF to Country. They want to keep WYRK in the top spot.

WLKK posted another 0.8. David Field is a glutton for punishment. He fully intends to die on his Alternative Hill...
 
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"David Field is a glutton for punishment. He fully intends to die on his Alternative Hill..."
Click to expand...


Renamed, now Broke Bank Mountain
 
tbolt909 said:
Which is why Townsquare didn't flip WBUF to Country. They want to keep WYRK in the top spot.

WLKK posted another 0.8. David Field is a glutton for punishment. He fully intends to dies on his Alternative Hill...
Click to expand...
Yrk would still be in top spot. Totally different audience. Old country listeners do not like today country. New country listeners do not like the older stuff. Would make total sense.
 
The "beauty pageant" tells us a slice of the story. What do the demographics say? Would WEDG do significantly better with a 3 share in country? OTOH, has their format shift gained listeners (females) that wouldn't have been there with the modern rock format? Is the current format more advertiser-friendly, especially when sold in combo with other Cumulus stations?

The WBUF format switch won't likely show much in the way of results - good or bad - for six months.

One more thought: What would an FM shift to "Classic Country" do to WECK? A lot of those folks who don't like modern country may be listening to oldies on WECK. It would likely be a 50+ audience making that choice, and that would likely impact WECK.
 
I did not say a classic country would not hurt WECK. Although there is a much smaller group of classic country listeners, than there is Oldies listeners

EDGE would make a ton more money with a 3 share if it had a country format. A ton more. It would be the number 2 country station in the market. The number 1 has been the top biller for 25 years.

I have said before, of all advertising dollars for radio in Buffalo, 50 percent go to country, news, talk and sports. Those are advertiser money formats.

The buf format change will show no results, except perhaps for sampling in the beginning. It’s a nothing burger. It will sell for 5 dollars a spot, just like jack, or perhaps free.

Plus, no one but us really even knows they changed. And they will continue not to know because they don’t promote

I can turn on classic rewind on satellite or anything on pandora and get the same jukebox. That station is, and always has been a mess past the year 2000.
 
TheBigA said:
A lot of people don't want to pay for radio. If they can get the same thing without paying, they'll listen.
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It depends. Very few people are listening to WLKK (Alternative) or KB 1520 (Sports). WBUF is a big signal with puny ratings. Its latest rehashed format offers nothing new. Many stations around the country have low ratings.

Commercial Radio may be "free" as you say, but it doesn't guarantee listeners. Listeners will tolerate commercials (and maybe find some useful) if they like a particular station. The problem for Radio is very few new listeners exist. Stations may try to take some away from a rival station. Nobody is looking to "discover" something fresh on Radio...
 
The radio industry without a doubt is losing listeners as bolt said. Consumers may “ put up” with terrestrial radio if they are forced to, meaning they have no other choice.

When Nielson says “ audio” is up in car, satellite is in that equation. I was told recently that if satellite radio was measured for ratings, satellite would win.

local is the key to everything for terrestrial radio. We do it pretty well at WECK, but I have no shareholders to answer to. So I can use my own dollars and take gambles The major radio companies are not looking to spend a nickel more on anything. Talent, promotion, marketing, nothing.

it’s gonna get much worse next year. Get ready for the IHEART model of cutting to prosperity , to come here, to all three of the Wall Street players.

I remember when a format change was a big deal in the market. Now, nobody even knows they happen. Not 1 person I have talked to who is not in radio knew that buf changed format. Not 1.

plus, they are playing a month without commercials. Try telling an advertiser why they are eliminating commercials. The station is basically saying ,” listeners hate commercials so we are going to be commercial free to try to get a great start “ when a station says “ commercial free” it’s admitting listeners hate commercials! WTF!

what if the Buffalo news said they are going advertising free for 12 months? They would lose half their subscribers! What if the super bowl said, no commercials this year? Viewers would be pissed.

radio is its own worse enemy. If I had an auto dealership and talked to a radio rep about advertising, and the rep told me that they do a commercial free workday or something like that, I would ask why? The rep would have to say, because radio gets better ratings without commercials, basically tell the auto dealer is a bad investment, because people tune out.

it’s absurd how stupid the radio industry is. Their only source of revenue, advertising, and they talk on the air like commercials are bad.

“ programming geniuses “ that know nothing about business . Here’s some homework, go through a drive through for coffee or something and ask the server how they get their music and what station they listen to. They will not say radio. Just try it. Especially the younger servers.

I love radio, I just wish it was all local again. That’s never gonna happen without local owners, and even some local owners are doing syndicated stuff. I just don’t get it.
 
Buddy Shula said:
local is the key to everything for terrestrial radio.
Click to expand...

And yet there's nothing local about satellite or streaming, and that's where all the listeners are going. Name all the live & local talent on Pandora. The 10% that want to pay for radio aren't spending it on local radio stations. They're spending it on Sirius and Pandora. If local was the key to everything, there would be incentive for radio stations to stay local. But there isn't. If all it took to get new listeners back to radio was local talent, radio companies would be hiring all day. If there was a direct connection between hiring local talent and increased advertising, it would be an easy decision.
 
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A few other notes from the most recent book:

-CFLZ/101.1 More FM cracks a 1.0; it's been trending upward for the last 3. Byrnes' other station; CJED/105.1 the River, drops to a .1

-WBFO still stable in the 4.0 range.

-WEBR/1440 clocks in with a .5 despite a HORRID signal.
 
TheBigA said:
If local was the key to everything, there would be incentive for radio stations to stay local. But there isn't. If all it took to get new listeners back to radio was local talent, radio companies would be hiring all day. If there was a direct connection between hiring local talent and increased advertising, it would be an easy decision.
Click to expand...
Yet, if you looking at ratings in market after market the top-rated stations are the ones with the most live and local talent. Of course, with the massive cuts at iHeart we'll see what the effect of more syndication will be, but most studies show that people still sample radio, but they don't find a lot worth staying for once they've got what they came for - news, weather, traffic, whatever. In Buffalo, the top 10 stations are live and local in drivetime. Some are live and local in additional dayparts. The stations that are all syndication are at the bottom of the ratings.
 
SirRoxalot said:
Yet, if you looking at ratings in market after market the top-rated stations are the ones with the most live and local talent.
Click to expand...

What effect did the staff cuts have at Star? WBLK runs the syndicated Steve Harvey show in morning drive. Has that hurt them? WBEE is running the Entercom national mid-day and evening show. They're still #1. WBUF hasn't has any hosts for 15 years.

My point isn't about ratings, but revenue. How does local talent increase advertising? How much outreach do they do?
 
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Have you looked at the numbers for Mix? Or Star, for that matter? The trends over the last year are downward, not upward. Entercom is cutting the (i)heart out of stations, following the lead of iHeart. WBEE is still live and local in drive times and is living on it's past reputation. Let's see what happens in the next year. WYRK, WBEE, and WBLK are legacy stations in their formats and have a locked in, loyal audience. They're hanging on, not trying to build a new audience. Part of the reason for growth in streaming and satellite is the lack of compelling content and promotion in music formats on terrestrial radio. And, when you talk about satellite, you're comparing 120+ formats to far fewer terrestrial formats in most markets. What are the ratings for a single stream? Do any of those challenge terrestrial radio? Post those numbers if you've got 'em.
 
I think BIGA brings up a pretty decent point. However, STAR is tanking. Personally, I think it's because of their passive format. In my estimation, they will be the next to follow the WLKK model of syndication with everything

It probably comes down to content. The best content, local or syndicated will do the best.

It's an interesting insight BIG A brings up

There 100% is a correlation between local live talent and advertising. Advertisers love endorsements from trusted personalities. But in the same vein, a Howard Stern endorsement would probably do great as well.

Great discussion points
 
SirRoxalot said:
Part of the reason for growth in streaming and satellite is the lack of compelling content and promotion in music formats on terrestrial radio.
Click to expand...

Didn't you just tell me how there's all this live & local talent in drive time? Maybe the live & local talent isn't compelling.

But there has to be a reason for someone to choose to pay money for something they can get for free. Where is the compelling content on satellite and streaming? Sure they can get fringe formats that isn't heard on commercial radio. But some of those formats are available on non-commercial NPR stations.
 
Buddy Shula said:
There 100% is a correlation between local live talent and advertising. Advertisers love endorsements from trusted personalities.
Click to expand...

In your case, that's absolutely true. You hired credible and trusted local talent who people know and love.

Can that be said of the talent at Kiss?
 
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