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91.7 changed callsigns from KXNG to KHVU on 8/20
- Thread starter HTX
- Start date
It’s what they are accustomed to . Has nothing to do with religion .So they won't give money unless they get some self promotion? Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle.
Well it seems the vast majority of christian broadcasters are only interested in pushing their brand and not their actual religion.Not to be racial, but we’re talking about Spanish language churches. Not all churches think the same.
Just look around the dial.
Where is the lie? It's easier to call someone ignorant than to see what's in front of you.BamaTX - Man are you ignorant about protestant churches.
These christian broadcasters (specifically Protestant) typically (not always) promote their church over their religion. Just look at the number of subchannels on TV that advertise one specific church. Same deal with megachurches who promote the hell out of their church. You'd think Lakewood Church was worshipping Joel Osteen and not "Jesus".
Now correct me if I'm wrong, but the entire purpose of religious institutions using media is to spread their "gospel" and not themselves, right? It seems the goal here is to grow their congregation and theirs only. More people = more $$$. I don't typically see this type of behavior with Catholicism, but then again I'm not going out of my way to watch/listen to their content.
If these non-profit businesses were really about "God", they wouldn't be asking for air-time in return. Just knowing that their contribution helped spread the gospel should be enough. But here we are with churches fighting over block programming in exchange for cash payments.
Bama TX said
"So they won't give money unless they get some self promotion? Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle."
Let's start here. A random comment of a poster is not factual. Your assume it to be fact. Therefore you believe they should not be allowed the same status as any other religious organization and you show your general hatred.
"Where is the lie? It's easier to call someone ignorant than to see what's in front of you."
Just what is that lie before me?
"These christian broadcasters (specifically Protestant) typically (not always) promote their church over their religion. Just look at the number of subchannels on TV that advertise one specific church. Same deal with megachurches who promote the hell out of their church. You'd think Lakewood Church was worshipping Joel Osteen and not "Jesus"."
Virtually every ministry promotes their way. It's the way that works for a certain group of people. The Bible says to go out and evangelize the world. Seems they're doing so. To sustain that infrastructure to do so takes a base of financial support. I believe Lakewood is a supporter of KSBJ because they can gain new members that will supply the manpower and financial support to keep the evangelism going.
"Now correct me if I'm wrong, but the entire purpose of religious institutions using media is to spread their "gospel" and not themselves, right? It seems the goal here is to grow their congregation and theirs only. More people = more $$$. I don't typically see this type of behavior with Catholicism, but then again I'm not going out of my way to watch/listen to their content."
The same thing happens with the Catholic Church. They have quite an infrastructure that needs subscribers of the Catholic way to sustain themselves.
Having worked in Christian radio I can tell you there are some good and bad ones out there. Some are led by people on power trips. A few are con artists. Most are sincere and trying to juggle the financials to make it all work. Many times the amount of cash is not anywhere close to the amount you'd think it would be...at least for the most sincere.
Religion like anything else has a common message but different ways to communicate this primarily because people are different and have differing needs. Some people need more structure than others.
It would seem by your statement McDonalds should not teach their way to make burgers because the subject is the burger. It would apply to football in that the Dallas Cowboys should not teach their plays for getting to the goal line because New England or Green Bay have their plans too. Certainly, as you mentioned Catholics, should not teach the Catholic way.
Simply put, you seem to feel if a Church or denomination teaches their path they are not worthy. That's hard to wrap ones head around.
Likely the worst of your words is your lumping all in the same pile: "Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle."
"If these non-profit businesses were really about "God", they wouldn't be asking for air-time in return. Just knowing that their contribution helped spread the gospel should be enough. But here we are with churches fighting over block programming in exchange for cash payments."
Here you assume a mere posted statement to be factual.
For some reason you feel it is wrong for anyone to have a path to "Jesus" via their denomination is inherently wrong. So, the objective is to evangelize ad bring people to 'Jesus'. If it's so terrible to have a path (denominational way) to do so, then how might one get from point A to point B? I can't wrap my head around your comment. It makes no sense to me.
Finally, your response has nothing to do with your original post about being Protestant ministries being a scam.
"So they won't give money unless they get some self promotion? Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle."
Let's start here. A random comment of a poster is not factual. Your assume it to be fact. Therefore you believe they should not be allowed the same status as any other religious organization and you show your general hatred.
"Where is the lie? It's easier to call someone ignorant than to see what's in front of you."
Just what is that lie before me?
"These christian broadcasters (specifically Protestant) typically (not always) promote their church over their religion. Just look at the number of subchannels on TV that advertise one specific church. Same deal with megachurches who promote the hell out of their church. You'd think Lakewood Church was worshipping Joel Osteen and not "Jesus"."
Virtually every ministry promotes their way. It's the way that works for a certain group of people. The Bible says to go out and evangelize the world. Seems they're doing so. To sustain that infrastructure to do so takes a base of financial support. I believe Lakewood is a supporter of KSBJ because they can gain new members that will supply the manpower and financial support to keep the evangelism going.
"Now correct me if I'm wrong, but the entire purpose of religious institutions using media is to spread their "gospel" and not themselves, right? It seems the goal here is to grow their congregation and theirs only. More people = more $$$. I don't typically see this type of behavior with Catholicism, but then again I'm not going out of my way to watch/listen to their content."
The same thing happens with the Catholic Church. They have quite an infrastructure that needs subscribers of the Catholic way to sustain themselves.
Having worked in Christian radio I can tell you there are some good and bad ones out there. Some are led by people on power trips. A few are con artists. Most are sincere and trying to juggle the financials to make it all work. Many times the amount of cash is not anywhere close to the amount you'd think it would be...at least for the most sincere.
Religion like anything else has a common message but different ways to communicate this primarily because people are different and have differing needs. Some people need more structure than others.
It would seem by your statement McDonalds should not teach their way to make burgers because the subject is the burger. It would apply to football in that the Dallas Cowboys should not teach their plays for getting to the goal line because New England or Green Bay have their plans too. Certainly, as you mentioned Catholics, should not teach the Catholic way.
Simply put, you seem to feel if a Church or denomination teaches their path they are not worthy. That's hard to wrap ones head around.
Likely the worst of your words is your lumping all in the same pile: "Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle."
"If these non-profit businesses were really about "God", they wouldn't be asking for air-time in return. Just knowing that their contribution helped spread the gospel should be enough. But here we are with churches fighting over block programming in exchange for cash payments."
Here you assume a mere posted statement to be factual.
For some reason you feel it is wrong for anyone to have a path to "Jesus" via their denomination is inherently wrong. So, the objective is to evangelize ad bring people to 'Jesus'. If it's so terrible to have a path (denominational way) to do so, then how might one get from point A to point B? I can't wrap my head around your comment. It makes no sense to me.
Finally, your response has nothing to do with your original post about being Protestant ministries being a scam.
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Again, you're just calling it a lie and that's that. Your truth is not supreme.Let's start here. A random comment of a poster is not factual. Your assume it to be fact. Therefore you believe they should not be allowed the same status as any other religious organization and you show your general hatred.
You quoted the "lie".Just what is that lie before me?
"These christian broadcasters (specifically Protestant) typically (not always) promote their church over their religion. Just look at the number of subchannels on TV that advertise one specific church. Same deal with megachurches who promote the hell out of their church. You'd think Lakewood Church was worshipping Joel Osteen and not "Jesus"."
Except they're not "evangelizing" the world. They're seeking their church brand. Most people wouldn't even know what denomination churches like Lakewood are or what movement Ken Copeland is peddling.Virtually every ministry promotes their way. It's the way that works for a certain group of people. The Bible says to go out and evangelize the world. Seems they're doing so. To sustain that infrastructure to do so takes a base of financial support.
You know more of these televangelist than you know of their religion. Wouldn't you agree? Their faces are featured more on commercials, telecasts, and pamphlets than "Jesus Christ". Remind me, who are we supposed to be worshipping here?
So a business!? Is Lakewood asking for block space in return? Should they be happy with converting a non believer into any Christian church? That's the goal, right? Make believers out of non-believers?I believe Lakewood is a supporter of KSBJ because they can gain new members that will supply the manpower and financial support to keep the evangelism going.
The reason I didn't call out the Catholics is because outside of the Pope, they don't have several prominent figureheads that are famous. If the priest at Church "A" converted you to Catholicism, he wouldn't care which congregation you joined, just as long as you converted. You can go to the Catholic church on the other side of town and they'll be happy. That's the goal.The same thing happens with the Catholic Church. They have quite an infrastructure that needs subscribers of the Catholic way to sustain themselves.
It doesn't seem to be the same with these Protestant religious broadcasters who only advertise their congregation.
Yes, I've said such.Having worked in Christian radio I can tell you there are some good and bad ones out there.
But I'm not arguing about religion itself. I'm arguing about the broadcasting churches and ministries who have become so famous that you can't even determine what denomination they are.Religion like anything else has a common message but different ways to communicate this primarily because people are different and have differing needs. Some people need more structure than others.
I'm going to stop you right there. Because if you want to compare religion with "for-profit" businesses, then you're making the point for me.It would seem by your statement McDonalds should not teach their way to make burgers because the subject is the burger.
As non-profit religious broadcasters, their goal shouldn't be to sell "their" burger. It should be to get people to try any burger.
That's not my argument. What I'm telling you is that many of these religious broadcasters aren't teaching their "path". They're selling their brand. You really think Ken Copeland would consider it a success if his content inspired YOU AND YOUR MONEY to join a Pentecostal church that isn't affiliated with his Pentecostal network?Simply put, you seem to feel if a Church or denomination teaches their path they are not worthy. That's hard to wrap ones head around.
Again, I didn't lump anyone. You're free to re-read my original post.Likely the worst of your words is your lumping all in the same pile: "Christian Protestant broadcasters are a bigger scam than turn signal fluid. We need to strip religion institutions from their tax exempt status. Let them pay for their faux Jesus jerk circle."
Well how is it not? Calling something a lie as a counterargument isn't much of a counterargument.Here you assume a mere posted statement to be factual.
Again, you're misconstruing my argument into something that it's not. That's not what a lot of religious broadcaster are doing. They're promoting their church before their religion.For some reason you feel it is wrong for anyone to have a path to "Jesus" via their denomination is inherently wrong. So, the objective is to evangelize ad bring people to 'Jesus'. If it's so terrible to have a path (denominational way) to do so, then how might one get from point A to point B? I can't wrap my head around your comment. It makes no sense to me.
I didn't call Protestant ministries a scam. I called religious Protestant BROADCASTERS a scam (well, a good chunk of them at least). That's the way I view them and I'm not the only one with that belief. I'm not trying to change your mind here, but it is what it is. If you don't want to see what's in front of you, then that's fine by me.Finally, your response has nothing to do with your original post about being Protestant ministries being a scam.
(And we haven't even touched the shady translator invasion by these church organizations. But that's probably for another topic.)
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I see your point: because some are essentially cons, they all are. Because I have first hand knowledge of many ministries, both local and nationally, I certainly don't know what I'm talking about. You made a blanket statement. I called you on it. I know lots of good guys out there. You likely wouldn't know a bunch of their names since they're typically not huge.
If you're run a church or ministry you know it has the same bills as a business. They don't get free rent or no utility bills and only if they get the approval of the IRS do they get tax exempt. In most cases the 'minister' is responsible for getting the dollars in to pay the bills. Typically that means filling the pews in hopes the offering plate is a but fuller.
To use your argument, I'm sure KSBJ and KHVU could care less if you listen to them as long as you found Christ via their airwaves. They'd be just as happy if you decided to listen to and support Air 1, correct? After all, if that's not the case, per your statement, they're a scam. That's my reading of your statements.
If you're run a church or ministry you know it has the same bills as a business. They don't get free rent or no utility bills and only if they get the approval of the IRS do they get tax exempt. In most cases the 'minister' is responsible for getting the dollars in to pay the bills. Typically that means filling the pews in hopes the offering plate is a but fuller.
To use your argument, I'm sure KSBJ and KHVU could care less if you listen to them as long as you found Christ via their airwaves. They'd be just as happy if you decided to listen to and support Air 1, correct? After all, if that's not the case, per your statement, they're a scam. That's my reading of your statements.
Again, you're misconstruing my argument. I didn't say ALL. It seems you keep arguing from an emotional standpoint on the count that you are (or at least were) a stakeholder for a few religious broadcasters. You keep taking what I'm saying and running with it in several different directions at 100 MPH. Slow it down a bit.I see your point: because some are essentially cons, they all are.
That's exactly what I'm saying. Isn't the goal for them to get as many people as possible to find "Christ"? If KSBJ does that but doesn't receive any money from it, it's still mission accomplished, no?They'd be just as happy if you decided to listen to and support Air 1, correct? After all, if that's not the case, per your statement, they're a scam. That's my reading of your statements.
Where we disagree is not the mission but sustaining the mission. One has to have the means to continue the mission. The hope is for the new convert to join up with their team to further the mission. We live in a monetary system and it takes money and volunteers to sustain. This is why Church A succeeds in the mission and then wants the convert to support the 'team' or Church A so to speak. You can bet if KSBJ is why a person came to Christ, their goal is to get them on the team to volunteer or give financially because that is how they maintain the ministry and continue the mission. They would not be happy if their convert chose to support Air 1, for example. In a few instances (and Houston has some glaring examples) of bad apples in the bunch. My second point is because there are some bad apples doesn't make all the apples bad.
I'm not a part of any ministry. In my job, I had a good number of ministries as clients for a couple of decades. Most were good. A few were on a power trip and a couple were pure cons. In each instance, they wanted new converts to join the denomination not only to sustain the ministry but their 'way' resonated as the best path in their minds. Converts were not required or even guilted to become involved but that was evidently the goal. Continuing the mission is paramount and thus, getting that convert to 'dance with the one that brought them', replenished the volunteer base and financial base to continue.
I'm not a part of any ministry. In my job, I had a good number of ministries as clients for a couple of decades. Most were good. A few were on a power trip and a couple were pure cons. In each instance, they wanted new converts to join the denomination not only to sustain the ministry but their 'way' resonated as the best path in their minds. Converts were not required or even guilted to become involved but that was evidently the goal. Continuing the mission is paramount and thus, getting that convert to 'dance with the one that brought them', replenished the volunteer base and financial base to continue.
No, I think you're just not understanding or reading my posts correctly. There is sustaining an operation (and even growing it), and then there is promoting your church to the point where you're rich and it's all about you.Where we disagree is not the mission but sustaining the mission.
Even if you put aside the megachurches, you still have smaller operators getting rich off of their congregation (therefore it is in their best interest to grow the congregation via TV/Radio). Just look at the massive amount of subchannels with "religious" representatives advertising their church over their religion. Or better yet, look at the most recent translator 'scandal'. So many unanswered questions.
Look, it's obvious you have a stake in these sort of operations. You're misinterpreting my posts so much that I have no interest in correcting myself over and over. Therefore, I think it's best we leave it at that and stop cluttering the board.
You are making outright lies now. I am not, nor have I ever had a stake in any ministry as you assert. But, let's leave things. We have differing views and I may be misunderstanding you and you may not get what I am trying to explain. I got a couple of football sponsor orders to write and a commercial to write, so time is catching up with me.
I didn't specifically say ministries. The operations I'm referring to is religious media operations.You are making outright lies now. I am not, nor have I ever had a stake in any ministry as you assert.
And you did say the following earlier in the thread;
You're (or were) a stakeholder.Having worked in Christian radio.
....
I'm happy to let things be, but I do feel the urge to address accusations of lies. It's become a pattern where you keep misconstruing my messages into something they aren't, which leads to you calling me a liar.But, let's leave things.
get over it BamaTx its not that big of a deal, ok you are a Liar so what.I didn't specifically say ministries. The operations I'm referring to is religious media operations.
And you did say the following earlier in the thread;
You're (or were) a stakeholder.
....
I'm happy to let things be, but I do feel the urge to address accusations of lies. It's become a pattern where you keep misconstruing my messages into something they aren't, which leads to you calling me a liar.
Please quote my lie.you are a Liar so what.
BamaTX said: Look, it's obvious you have a stake in these sort of operations.
That is a bold face lie.
BamaTX said:
And you did say the following earlier in the thread;
Yes, I worked for a radio station that sold time to various ministries. You obviously do not understand the relationship between a radio station and the client. A radio station is essential like a retail space. That retail space is rented to various companies that conduct their business from these spaces. The landlord, aka retail space owner, has no say in these businesses and no stake in the business. In respect to radio, we have space we rent to those that will pay the rent. It is the one paying the rent that determines what happens with the time and the radio station simply collects the rent check.
A stakeholder is someone with a financial investment in an entity or at minimum has a say in what an entity does. I was not a stakeholder. At the same time I sold several non-English programmers time on the station. I did not have a stake in these client's businesses either.
In fact, I sold an advertising package to an insurance company and an auto body shop today. I have no position as stakeholder in either of these businesses.
That is a bold face lie.
BamaTX said:
And you did say the following earlier in the thread;
You're (or were) a stakeholder.Having worked in Christian radio.
Yes, I worked for a radio station that sold time to various ministries. You obviously do not understand the relationship between a radio station and the client. A radio station is essential like a retail space. That retail space is rented to various companies that conduct their business from these spaces. The landlord, aka retail space owner, has no say in these businesses and no stake in the business. In respect to radio, we have space we rent to those that will pay the rent. It is the one paying the rent that determines what happens with the time and the radio station simply collects the rent check.
A stakeholder is someone with a financial investment in an entity or at minimum has a say in what an entity does. I was not a stakeholder. At the same time I sold several non-English programmers time on the station. I did not have a stake in these client's businesses either.
In fact, I sold an advertising package to an insurance company and an auto body shop today. I have no position as stakeholder in either of these businesses.
Mods: This thread is veering way off track. Let's get back to figuring out the reasons for Hope Media changing the calls on the NGEN stations.
Okay, back to the original topic:
In my opinion, the original NGEN branding and execution was a bunch of boomers and Gen-Xers trying to do Stuff Millenials Like. I don't think the brand means anything to its target audience. So, it's expendable.
You'll notice that as they've just been pushing the frequency the station has performed better. The station has definitely grown, and I don't see them blowing it up.
I don't know anyone in there who could tell me anything, but when I see those new call signs, I see U, and it's easy to build a brand around You.
In my opinion, the original NGEN branding and execution was a bunch of boomers and Gen-Xers trying to do Stuff Millenials Like. I don't think the brand means anything to its target audience. So, it's expendable.
You'll notice that as they've just been pushing the frequency the station has performed better. The station has definitely grown, and I don't see them blowing it up.
I don't know anyone in there who could tell me anything, but when I see those new call signs, I see U, and it's easy to build a brand around You.
A
AnyHuman
Guest
Maybe short for "voodoo"... I know this is very unlikely though LOL
I agree that NGEN is not going to be blown out. It's history is much longer than it's over the air history. I'd just call it a retooling of the branding versus the format and you can bet there's been lots of research done of perceptions long before we heard anything about a call letter change.
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