Rock music popularity

[davideduardo]

Not on a radio station that mostly plays currents. However both get airplay for their past hits on classic country stations. .

And what is the appeal of gold-based country stations vs the current based ones.? It’s a more limited radio cume base. My favorite Sirius/XM channel is The Highway, but I am out of terrestrial radio demos… and only went to perhaps 5 or 6 country concerts a year. And I am as likely to go see FGL as Dwight.

 

[Cordelia Chase]

There is a small, stand-alone station in Williamsburg, Virginia where essentially, "new artists are born and old artists go to die."


While 92.3 The Tide helped introduce groups like Foster The People and Of Monsters and Men a few years back, they also played


"Dirty City" by Steve Winwood featuring Eric Clapton, "Sad Songs" by the Cars as well as something new Springsteen had released


at that time. Classic Rock stations would not touch these new songs from heritage artists, so I was glad there was a place for them


to be heard. IIRC, Williamsburg native Bruce Hornsby had a stake in WTYD at one point. As a maturing artist himself, he would


be acutely aware of the need for a station like this.

 

[MVB13]

Hip Hop is declining as a radio format because radio can not play the majority of songs that today have lyrics that would cause FCC issues but are fine on streaming sources.

That is a separate issue.

Rock has lost most of its under-35 following. Rock formats that appeal to the older demos continue, but it's not looking good in the younger demos.

And, while there are later generation Hispanics who like rock, among the foreign-born and the first generation, there is little appeal. Yes, there are rock stations in Latin America, but vastly fewer than ever before... and they appeal predominantly to upper income listeners who don't migrate to the US. The big rock station in Buenos Aires which had over a 20 share in 2000 now gets a 4 share. In fact, the only rocker in Puerto Rico, WCAD, was sold recently because it was losing money; it is now a K-Love network station.

Maybe the FCC should loosen the reigns.

 

[TheBigA]

And what is the appeal of gold-based country stations vs the current based ones.? It’s a more limited radio cume base.

My point is there is a radio format for those artists. The trick for the artists is they can either play to the fans they have, or attempt to compete with current artists and try to appeal to audiences half their age. At some point, they have to become comfortable with who they are and all they've accomplished as artists and super-serve their existing fan base. Otherwise, they'll become bitter and miss out on the status they've achieved as legends. Haggard struggled with that for a while until he reached his 70s. I think some of these 90s artists are starting to become comfortable with their age and stockpile of hits. They don't crab about not getting current airplay any more.

 

[davideduardo]

My point is there is a radio format for those artists. The trick for the artists is they can either play to the fans they have, or attempt to compete with current artists and try to appeal to audiences half their age. At some point, they have to become comfortable with who they are and all they've accomplished as artists and super-serve their existing fan base. Otherwise, they'll become bitter and miss out on the status they've achieved as legends. Haggard struggled with that for a while until he reached his 70s. I think some of these 90s artists are starting to become comfortable with their age and stockpile of hits. They don't crab about not getting current airplay any more.

I've talked with a number of artists who are not current hitmakers but have huge fondness among an earlier generation... both in country and in Latin music and most are, as you say, in agreement with delighting their core with the songs they made famous.

In Latin music, I created the first all salsa station anywhere back 42 years ago. In the last Puerto Rico Nielsen's, its simulcast network is the #1 music station after four decades and it sounds pretty much the same as it did on December 30, 1978 when it went on the air. But the audience is now mostly over 40 as the station aged with the audience and there is little new music and fewer new artists today. Yet the concerts and shows with those artists can fill major venues.

But not all artists are Garth Brooks or the Rolling Stones or Vicente Fernández. Most play smaller venues, but do most well from the shows, the merchandise and the royalties.

 

[davideduardo]

Maybe the FCC should loosen the reigns.

Look at the average age of the committee heads in the House and Senators overall... and you'll see why "legalizing profanity" is not likely today.

 

[landtuna]

Look at the average age of the committee heads in the House and Senators overall... and you'll see why "legalizing profanity" is not likely today.

Nor should it be.

 

[macattack]

I find it interesting that through all these pages of discussion that no one has brought up that "Beggin" by Maneskin has been blowing up on streaming services and is on the verge of hitting the top 10 on pop radio. It's a true rock song, not a synth or 808 in sight, and its popularity was driven by youth on TikTok. Its radio callouts are also apparently strong despite it sticking out like a sore thumb in a sea of trap music.

We also have A-OK by Tai Verdes in the pop top 20 whose opening line is literally "Doesn't this guitar sound so good?" and is influenced by 70's soft rock/early alternative like Velvet Underground.

Yes it's only two songs in the pop radio top 20 but considering rock has spent entire years without a top 20 entry on pop radio that should say something. Halsey isn't far off from the top 20 either with a tune that is basically a Nine Inch Nails song with her vocals. Machine Gun Kelly just had the biggest hit of his career with a pop-punk song too.

You all are proclaiming the death of rock when the signs are there of rock coming back. Who are the ones out of touch?

 

[TheBigA]

I find it interesting that through all these pages of discussion that no one has brought up that "Beggin" by Maneskin has been blowing up on streaming services

It's one song. Hard to build a radio format around one song. You say it's a "true rock song," but the chorus features a rhythmic rap. We've talked about this song before. It has "good sh*t" in the lyrics.

 

[macattack]

It's one song. Hard to build a radio format around one song. You say it's a "true rock song," but the chorus features a rhythmic rap. We've talked about this song before. It has "good sh*t" in the lyrics.

This is a big problem with radio; you all just keep searching for problems instead of identifying solutions. Obviously its just one song but Smells Like Teen Spirit was just one song, and Pumped Up Kicks was just one song. One song can be an indicator of something much larger.

And as I've mentioned it isn't just one song either. It's multiple. And we've had a number of rock Hot 100 entries this year with no radio help, and not all of them have been white guys for those of you obsessed with racial demos.

 

[TheBigA]

This is a big problem with radio; you all just keep searching for problems instead of identifying solutions.

No I'm just stating the facts. The solution is with the music and musicians. They need to focus on recording better songs.

Teen Spirit was part of an entire movement of grunge songs at that time, as was The Clash when they came out ten or so years before. I will tell you that Teen Spirit wasn't universally accepted at rock radio at the time. Some big city rock stations stayed away from it. They ended up being one hit wonders. The problem with rock crossover is it leads to negative reaction from alternative purists. Sure Billie Eilish was just one song, and she and her brother organized a movement. It's paid off for her.

 

[b-turner]

Then buy a station and invest your money! You can do it just like any of us. There are some real deals out there. I'm talking killer deals.

What you are missing is those of us working in radio are working for owners that tell us what they want to happen. If we don't produce the numbers they want, we're gone.

This isn't about bashing rock. I like rock myself. It's about running a radio station to reach as many people as possible. Right now rock does not accomplish this. It has been waning in universal appeal for years. I'm not talking classic rock.

Now a few will point out all your friends like rock are this market or that market has a successful rock station. There are exceptions to everything. And for your friends, we all tend to associate with those that are likeminded.

If rock had the universal appeal it once did there'd be stations with big numbers in every market and this thread would have never been written.

After we try to explain again, we're the ones 'out of touch'. That gets a bit tiresome and frustrating.

 

[Mikey Radio]

Then buy a station and invest your money! You can do it just like any of us. There are some real deals out there. I'm talking killer deals.

What you are missing is those of us working in radio are working for owners that tell us what they want to happen. If we don't produce the numbers they want, we're gone.

This isn't about bashing rock. I like rock myself. It's about running a radio station to reach as many people as possible. Right now rock does not accomplish this. It has been waning in universal appeal for years. I'm not talking classic rock.

Now a few will point out all your friends like rock are this market or that market has a successful rock station. There are exceptions to everything. And for your friends, we all tend to associate with those that are likeminded.

If rock had the universal appeal it once did there'd be stations with big numbers in every market and this thread would have never been written.

After we try to explain again, we're the ones 'out of touch'. That gets a bit tiresome and frustrating.

^^^ Well-stated post. It's easy for someone who's not involved in programming or station management (even some lower level employees and jocks who are actively employed in the industry) to say "I could make XYZ format work" or "If I were programming, I'd do XYZ" and a few of them may be right, and a few jocks who've had a slightly different way of thinking about programming or were willing to think outside the box did go on to be successful MDs, PDs and consultants. However, for the overwhelming majority, they eventually find there's a very big difference between what they personally think would work vs. what's mass appeal enough to attract large amounts of listeners and drive revenue. This is especially true when terrestrial radio is also competing with so many other forms of media and entertainment from the internet to satellite radio to a plethora of apps that offer music, many of them customizable and commercial free.

The bottom line is that radio broadcasting, especially now more than ever, is about the bottom line. Well-programmed stations and formats that are right for the particular market and demographic where a station is located attract listeners, which drives ratings, which drives sales to advertisers which drives revenue, which pays the bills, keeps the lights on and the transmitter humming. Broadcast a format which is limited appeal for a particular market and the station is most likely doomed to fail, unless the owner or management group have deep pockets.

For the record, I'm also a rock fan, and when the market I was in shuttered its only rock station I was pissed and chalked it up to an extremely limited playlist with too much repetition, especially of older music. That said, the ownership changed format to AC and after some tweaks, now lead the market in ratings or come close to it, so in that instance, I guess they knew the market better than I, or at least had a solid take on what would work.

 

[MVB13]

Look at the average age of the committee heads in the House and Senators overall... and you'll see why "legalizing profanity" is not likely today.

Makes sense sadly.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

And for that geriatric crew to be deciding what constitutes indecency as if we are still frozen in time living in some bygone era is even more laughable.

 

[Cordelia Chase]

Teen Spirit was part of an entire movement of grunge songs at that time, as was The Clash when they came out ten or so years before. I will tell you that Teen Spirit wasn't universally accepted at rock radio at the time. Some big city rock stations stayed away from it. They ended up being one hit wonders. The problem with rock crossover is it leads to negative reaction from alternative purists. Sure Billie Eilish was just one song, and she and her brother organized a movement. It's paid off for her.

Maybe I misunderstood what you were saying, but neither The Clash or Nirvana are one hit wonders. In addition to "Rock The Casbah," The Clash has other well-known songs such as "Should I Stay Or Should I Go," "London Calling" and "Train In Vain."

As for Nirvana, "The Man Who Sold The World," "Heart-Shaped Box," and "Lithium" are just a few of their songs still played today! In fact "Lithium" is the name Sirius XM chose for its channel dedicated to Grunge and similar 90s music.

 

[Cordelia Chase]

It has "good sh*t" in the lyrics.

It's certainly not a rap song, but so does "Money" by Pink Floyd, LOL.

 

[CTListener]

It's certainly not a rap song, but so does "Money" by Pink Floyd, LOL.

"Good bulls**t," to be precise.

 

[TheBigA]

Maybe I misunderstood what you were saying, but neither The Clash or Nirvana are one hit wonders.

I probably should have been more specific. Nirvana had more hits on Alternative radio, but they only had one that crossed over to pop. The Clash had one Top 10 in Mainstream Rock (Rock The Casbah) and one Top 5 in pop (Should I Stay or Should I Go).

 

[CTListener]

The Clash had one Top 10 in Mainstream Rock (Rock The Casbah) and one Top 5 in pop (Should I Stay or Should I Go).

Are you sure about that? I definitely remember drumming on the steering wheel to Rock the Casbah on Top 40 stations up here when it was current in 1982, and not becoming familiar with Should I Stay or Should I Go until I heard it on classic rock stations much later. I wasn't listening to current AOR at all in the early and mid '80s -- mainly Top 40 and country -- although I did keep an eye on MTV a lot.