Changing Technology: A British Perspective.

[kevtronics]

Some examples of how bad DAB radio sounds in the UK. The bitrates are far lower than the originally recommended minimums. And instead of using the more efficient codec of DAB+ to improve audio quality, they're using it to make the bitrates even lower, to squeeze in more channels:

 

[Harvey_Dogg]

I never considered paid services like SiriusXM to be a threat to radio. The internet and smart phones and dmart speakers are another matter.

 

[Harvey_Dogg]

The cost of digital broadcasting equipment is prohibitive for most radio stations. Yet an old junk computer can put a high quality
digital stream on the internet. And, asking Alexa to play your station is easier than tuning a radio.

 

[ZantennaG1]

Some examples of how bad DAB radio sounds in the UK. The bitrates are far lower than the originally recommended minimums. And instead of using the more efficient codec of DAB+ to improve audio quality, they're using it to make the bitrates even lower, to squeeze in more channels:

Glad to see another Techmoan fan on here, and this was the exact video I was thinking of earlier.

 

[Kelly A]

This is the #1 reason I've never subscribed to SiriusXM. The music channels sound so flat that it's almost unlistenable to me.

This was more of a problem with Sirius in particular. Part of that was cramming a lot of channels, and the other was Sirius parks their satellites in Geosynchronous orbit, so one must make up for Doppler shift.
Since SXM has started cutting-over their new Sirius replacement birds to live status, the audio quality has gotten much better. The XM birds have always had superior audio quality, mainly because of more bandwidth and they're parked in Geostationary orbit.

Months ago they said they were launching new satellites and planning to offer better quality audio on at least some of their music stations, but each time they open the service and offer it free during a given weekend I'll tune in and give it a listen. From what I've heard it still can't hold up to FM or streaming from an audio quality standpoint.

Depends on the channels. My wife's car has a Sirius receiver, and I noticed the difference in the music channels immediately. Of course, talk and news channels can be much lower bitrate in the statmux, since it's just voice quality. My convertible and pickup truck have XM radios which typically have always sounded pretty good.

 

[Kelly A]

It would be perfectly ironic if cell phone companies bought out medium wave spectrum only to discover *gasp* that there is too much RFI noise and so they petition the government to crack-down harder on it, hence circling back around to when MW was good.

Cell companies would never have any use for MW frequencies. Or for that matter; anything below 700Mhz. Too much terrestrial and atmospheric noise, plus digital modulated data to make one phone call, would eat up ten of the entire AM bands end to end.

I tend to not notice the bitrate on the music, but it makes the announcer's voices sound so tinny. To me, that is not worth the $5 dollar subscription that will eventually jump into the double digits. And, I too will listen to SiriusXM on their free trial when it comes out (the nationwide coverage is nice), but yeah, the bitrate is a concern.

That's always been an amusing, yet ironic thing that defenders of AM say: 'I don't like the sound of digitally encoded audio' Ummm, and you think AM with all of the noise, distortion, and narrow frequency response sounds good?
More like hearing is colored by nostalgia, not actual technical specifications.

 

[ZantennaG1]

Cell companies would never have any use for MW frequencies. Or for that matter; anything below 700Mhz. Too much terrestrial and atmospheric noise, plus digital modulated data to make one phone call, would eat up ten of the entire AM bands end to end.

I was being a little sarcastic.

That's always been an amusing, yet ironic thing that defenders of AM say: 'I don't like the sound of digitally encoded audio' Ummm, and you think AM with all of the noise, distortion, and narrow frequency response sounds good?
More like hearing is colored by nostalgia, not actual technical specifications.

About 4/5ths of my listening time is on FM, with a limited fraction left for AM, Internet streaming, and Satellite. As for the AM thing, it's not perfect, but I almost always see someone on here talking about a time when stations had wider bandwidth on the band. Apparently, the range of full human hearing is 15khz, and those stations came close. AM does not have the best sound, Satellite does not have the best sound; That award has long been awarded FM/CD/Internet. Therefore, I choose AM not because of sound quality, but because it's free to listen to and has competition, whereas the Sirius/XM merger means that everything goes through one company who can squeeze as many channels as they wish even if they are mediocre, and raise the prices on it despite some channels now having commercials. (Sadly though, this is happening to FM and AM as well when the same national program can be heard on every station, but it's not to the extent that satellite is).

 

[ZantennaG1]

anything below 700Mhz.

In that case, the phone companies should give us back channels 38-51 if they aren't going to use them!

 

[Kelly A]

In that case, the phone companies should give us back channels 38-51 if they aren't going to use them!

The difference is: The carriers bought all of that spectrum. There is no giving it back.

 

[Kelly A]

I was being a little sarcastic.

Sure you were.

The average GSM-modulated spectrum used from just T-Mobile cell/PCS towers is roughly 400Mhz wide.

 

[Kelly A]

I was being a little sarcastic.

About 4/5ths of my listening time is on FM,

Really? So your preferred listening time is spent listening to stations "run by crooks"? If you hate radio so much, why would you listen at all?

 

[ZantennaG1]

Really? So your preferred listening time is spent listening to stations "run by crooks"?

I sure hope my local stations are NOT being run by crooks! If so, I should be able to find someone who is *less* of a crook than the last one.

If you hate radio so much

Um....What?

Sure you were.

The average GSM-modulated spectrum used from just T-Mobile cell/PCS towers is roughly 400Mhz wide.

 

[davideduardo]

The cost of digital broadcasting equipment is prohibitive for most radio stations. Yet an old junk computer can put a high quality
digital stream on the internet. And, asking Alexa to play your station is easier than tuning a radio.

Digital in the Western Hemisphere is a limited radio concept. In nations where authorized, it is HD Radio or nothing at all. There is no new digital band (tried, and failed, in Canada). Pure digital seems to get the greatest momentum in nations where the government dominates and controls radio.

So the expense in the available and authorized HD countries is the additional transmitter gear and the liicense fee. Neither are prohibitive. The question most smaller market stations... and even a few in larger ones... have is what the cost benefit is. A few lease HDs for niche broadcasters. Others use them to justify a translator. Some use the HD for a socially responsive or "woke" format to show corporate awareness.

But in general, HD is not a revenue or ratings producer. That, not the cost, is the major factor here.

 

[davideduardo]

Sure you were.

The average GSM-modulated spectrum used from just T-Mobile cell/PCS towers is roughly 400Mhz wide.

For the uninitiated, the whole AM band is just over 1 (one) Mhz wide. All of FM is 20 Mhz.

 

[davideduardo]

Depends on the channels. My wife's car has a Sirius receiver, and I noticed the difference in the music channels immediately. Of course, talk and news channels can be much lower bitrate in the statmux, since it's just voice quality. My convertible and pickup truck have XM radios which typically have always sounded pretty good.

One factor almost always ignored in the discussion of satellite audio quality is the fact that listening to the satellite (and terrestrial fill-in transmitters) is almost entirely done in vehicles. Engine and road noise and the acoustics of a metal box called a "car" or "truck" make quality comparisons without considering the effects of background noise to be futile.

 

[davideduardo]

Besides utility and operations costs, most of the BBC MW stations are overdue for substantially expensive capital equipment replacement. The sunset timing of the band is no doubt timed to the calculated end of life for those old MW transmission systems.

I read that one of the UK longwave facilities was destined to be closed "when replacements" were no longer available. The high power tubes for half-megawatt LW transmitters are not made, and there is a limit to how many times one can be rebuilt. In fact, there is a limit to how long rebuilders will stay in business.

As was stated in the link; smart speakers are WAY more popular than DAB these days, which when you think about it, makes a lot of sense. Especially around the holidays, smart speakers see a lot of growth as gifts because they do more than just play news or music, where DAB is relegated to just playing radio programming.

It's amazing how much we can grow to employ the knowledge of Alexa. I've gotten to where I can get a rather precise answer to things like "how much is 2.6 cm in inches" without resorting to the calculator on my phone. When I was an early adopter, motivated by the "fun factor" rather than usefulness, friends who I demonstrated the unit to were rather amazed and most went home to buy one.

The smart speaker is to the home what the cellular is to mobility. And, of course, I now have the Alexa app on my iPhone.

Of course, I am a sucker for tech. I bought an Apple Newton, too!

 

[Harvey_Dogg]

Remember DXing AM? Hearing KORL on 650 or the BBC on 648 were very rare catches. Now, just ask Alexa and distant stations are loud and clear. The future is here.

 

[davideduardo]

Remember DXing AM? Hearing KORL on 650 or the BBC on 648 were very rare catches. Now, just ask Alexa and distant stations are loud and clear. The future is here.

Nothing changes. We did not "get" KORL to listen, we got it to add a catch to the list. And if it came in, then we tried for the more magnificent catch, 250 watt KIKI on 830.

We don't do that any more because the channels are so jammed that waiting in Ohio for KIMN and KJR to sign of so we could try for the early sign on of LR3 is impossible today.

 

[boombox4]

Nothing changes. We did not "get" KORL to listen, we got it to add a catch to the list. And if it came in, then we tried for the more magnificent catch, 250 watt KIKI on 830.

We don't do that any more because the channels are so jammed that waiting in Ohio for KIMN and KJR to sign of so we could try for the early sign on of LR3 is impossible today.

Some of us DXed to listen. I did. Always have. It's part of the point of it -- to hear what's happening in the next metro, or what is going on several states away.

 

[Kelly A]

And the bottom line to this discussion becomes: It's certainly okay to wax nostalgic about the days of growing up enjoying one form of media in particular. As a society we went from story telling in small groups, to printed news, broadcasting, and now digital offerings. It doesn't mean one is superior over another; or that somehow you're a traitor because you purchased an Alexa. Just goes to show that the one constant in life; is all things eventually change. Not everything is a competition.