WGN to move transmitter

[CADXER]

There are plans to move the WGN transmitter within the same property in Elk Grove village in order to make room for a new data center:

Data center campus proposed for portion of WGN transmitter site near Elk Grove

The parent company of WGN radio has proposed relocating the station's transmission tower to the north end of its 100-acre property near Elk Grove Village to make way for a three-building data center campus on the south end, under a plan being considered by village officials.

www.dailyherald.com

 

[radioman148]

Interesting.

 

[Deleted User]

a data center near a high power transmitter..... been there done that .... had to put the servers in a faraday cage..... copper mesh screen all around the equipment to keep WRKO from screwing things up.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

Will the ground system extend to the buildings like some other shared sites? Otherwise, if they don't have a full ground system, there would possibly be some compromise of the service. What about the Auxiliary tower?

The FCC really has to think about what Mexico has done, moving nearly all AM stations to FM. It's a shame though. WGN has to be one of the 10 best legacy stations nationwide.

It's a shame to compromise this most impressive facility. Will the FAA allow them to have a new tower of the same height? People have said that KFI just isn't the same with the shorter sectionalized tower.

 

[Deleted User]

great idea, now tell me how in a market like Boston, where every available spot is taken up by a Station, translator, repeater, or LPFM where you are going to squeeze in all the AM stations.

 

[drt]

great idea, now tell me how in a market like Boston, where every available spot is taken up by a Station, translator, repeater, or LPFM where you are going to squeeze in all the AM stations.

I know the FM band is crowded in the Boston area after having spent a week in nearby Wakefield; and trust me, it’s not just Boston, in the Tampa/St Pete and Miami/Fort Lauderdale markets, even the “pirates” are having a difficult time finding available frequencies! 😂

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

great idea, now tell me how in a market like Boston, where every available spot is taken up by a Station, translator, repeater, or LPFM where you are going to squeeze in all the AM stations.

According to some, Mexico allows FM stations in the same general local area on second and third adjacent channels now. Translators in the US are Class D, and can be bumped. If AM stations are allowed to be interfered with, then other countries have a solution. Or PREFERABLY, expand the band. Just TWO more MHz could be used to replace all Class IVs and 1 kW Class Bs 1250 and above. Generally, these could be 200 kHz apart with collocation or near collocation, with 1 kW/100 meters and 3 kW/100 meters in less congested areas. The protected contour in my model is 63 dBu, and can accommodate all Class C AM, all general areas have 6 or less, and another four for lower power Class B AMs in virtually all markets.

 

[kevtronics]

Since it's staying on the same property, could they move the tower but keep the existing ground system? Or does the ground system need to be directly surrounding the tower to work well?

 

[Kemosabe]

Since it's staying on the same property, could they move the tower but keep the existing ground system? Or does the ground system need to be directly surrounding the tower to work well?

The latter. Ground wires are arranged radially from the tower.

 

[cyberdad]

According to some, Mexico allows FM stations in the same general local area on second and third adjacent channels now. Translators in the US are Class D, and can be bumped. If AM stations are allowed to be interfered with, then other countries have a solution.

Then there's Italy, which David Eduardo referred to as "The Wild West" He was 100% correct. I spent a week about 30 miles south of Florence in 2016. Forget about our notion of "first adjacents". The FM dial was full of stations operating on what we could consider half and even quarter adjacents. 101.0, 101.05.101.1, 101.13, etc. Many of those signals being unlicensed. If you hit the scan button seeking to search the entire dial, it's probably a good idea to pack a lunch while you wait for it to finish! Somehow, it seems to work, and the authorities....per what David told me....have given up, and now simply look the other way. The only "sacred" area when it comes to split frequencies are the channels where the RAI network operates.

Meanwhile the entire daytime AM band is all but empty. Just two stops on the scan button in my rental Toyota. The RAI outlet on 657 from Pisa, and what was an apparent semi-local on 1170.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

Many FM radios with digital tuning have a switch to set for 50 kHz spacing. What is the allowed frequency deviation allowed in Italy? Are licensed stations operating with 50 kHz spacing? A lot of noise rejection for FM transmission depends on the modulation index, the ratio of the maximum frequency deviation to the audio modulation frequency. 50 kHz spacing would presumably compromise the quality of the audio. Listening to analog TV audio in the old days demonstrated that loss of quality with just 25 kHz deviation vs. 75 kHz for FM broadcast. Anyone know what deviation Franken FMs actually use?

 

[davideduardo]

The latter. Ground wires are arranged radially from the tower.

That is for optimum performance. When I built my first large market AM, at least 25 of the other local AMs used longwire antennas and the ground was typically a couple of car or truck radiators buried in the ground. One buried an old truck chassis.

Anything works... some things just work better than others.

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

Anybody know how well the KTNQ 1020 KEIB 1150 diplex performs, and how the Faraday cage limits the signal in the offices below it? Like actual field strengths below, within the cage?

When I was in a graduate program, they had an electrodiagnosics lab with the subject inside a Faraday Cage. There was a TV inside, and a nearby TV station could be watched on rabbit ears when the door was open, but disappeared completely when the door was closed. Quite effective.

https://www.oldradio.com/archives/stations/LA/ktnq.htm

 

[Kemosabe]

That is for optimum performance. When I built my first large market AM, at least 25 of the other local AMs used longwire antennas and the ground was typically a couple of car or truck radiators buried in the ground. One buried an old truck chassis.

Anything works... some things just work better than others.

Perhaps WGN could scavenge a few wrecks from the Eisenhower Expressway to boost its ground system.

 

[davideduardo]

Anybody know how well the KTNQ 1020 KEIB 1150 diplex performs, and how the Faraday cage limits the signal in the offices below it? Like actual field strengths below, within the cage?

I have been at the KTNQ site many times. Inside the building, you can get 1020 and 1150, but they do not overload radios. On the other hand, listening to anything else is impossible. }

The field strengths were measured when the diplexing was done about 23 or 24 years ago. Whatever was considered "safe" was met.

When I was in a graduate program, they had an electrodiagnosics lab with the subject inside a Faraday Cage. There was a TV inside, and a nearby TV station could be watched on rabbit ears when the door was open, but disappeared completely when the door was closed. Quite effective.

The sheet metal cage I had in Puerto Rico required an outside antenna for the AM and FM air monitors. The FM was 60 feet above us, and the AM with 10 kw was about 4 air miles away and aimed right at us.

 

[Ai4i]

Perhaps World's Greatest Newspaper should revisit the controversial and questionable cross-field antenna.
Who remembers that one?

 

[Schroedingers Cat]

I have been at the KTNQ site many times. Inside the building, you can get 1020 and 1150, but they do not overload radios. On the other hand, listening to anything else is impossible. }

The field strengths were measured when the diplexing was done about 23 or 24 years ago. Whatever was considered "safe" was met.

The sheet metal cage I had in Puerto Rico required an outside antenna for the AM and FM air monitors. The FM was 60 feet above us, and the AM with 10 kw was about 4 air miles away and aimed right at us.

From what you describe, my guess is several V/m. Safe, but I wouldn't want 24/7 exposure. There were two or three fairly well known radio people who spent 8 plus hours a day close to straight down from FM antennas within 150 feet or so for quite a number of years, and they got strange blood dyscrasias which were fatal. Not sure if they were connected, but it made me wonder. There was an 80 kW ERP station that was on top of a building, and the studios were within 100 feet, and they soon moved out to the country. Years later, they tried to put a 6 kW facility on the same mast, and they had to do some modifications to limit downward radiation.

 

[Negin]

Not sure why they can't put the Data-centre somewhere else.

 

[KeithE4]

Not sure why they can't put the Data-centre somewhere else.

Maybe the price was right for the land? Did WGN sell, or is it being leased?

 

[CADXER]

Not sure why they can't put the Data-centre somewhere else.

I am sure it's all about money. The price for the land they are getting at the WGN site must be just right. I am not sure if this is the same company, but in 2020 there was a plan to build a data center in neighboring Itasca, Illinois at an existing golf course. That plan was turned down by the Itasca Village Board. After this they probably looked for other options and the WGN site might be the answer.