My audiophile dad hated the sound of the Motown singles I'd buy and play on his turntable. I wasn't all that keen on it either -- very shrill, highs pushed way up. But yes, those tracks really stood out on the car radio.
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Song was mono - now "stereo" - which for radio?
- Thread starter kfbkfb
- Start date
The AM of WRKO-FM in 1966 was WNAC(AM), a sleepy talk station. When WNAC flipped to live, local Top 40 in March 1967, as WRKO(AM), that was the beginning of the end for WRKO-FM's automated format, which became part-time, then was discontinued for good by the end of the year.
Few charting pop singles before 1965 were pressed in stereo. Stereo wasn't even standard for consumer grade pop music on 45 RPM singles until the 1970s. Some of the last big mono-only pop hit recordings include Steam's "Na Na Hey Hey Kiss Him Goodbye" (1969) and Brian Hyland's "Gypsy Woman" (1970).
It's better to be faithful to which mode the radio or consumer 45s/LPs used on their original release. For 1950s to mid-1960s Oldies, they were typically in mono. If they offered an original (not fake) stereo version, use it.
After 1965, it was hit or miss with finding full stereo pop/rock albums/singles pretty much until the early 1970s. They were sold in both configurations until 1968 when albums by most major labels started to be released in stereo only. But singles from these post 1968 albums could be mono only.
Discogs is a great source of answers for each artist's original release vinyl discography and more of these deeper-end Oldies programming questions.
It's better to be faithful to which mode the radio or consumer 45s/LPs used on their original release. For 1950s to mid-1960s Oldies, they were typically in mono. If they offered an original (not fake) stereo version, use it.
After 1965, it was hit or miss with finding full stereo pop/rock albums/singles pretty much until the early 1970s. They were sold in both configurations until 1968 when albums by most major labels started to be released in stereo only. But singles from these post 1968 albums could be mono only.
Discogs is a great source of answers for each artist's original release vinyl discography and more of these deeper-end Oldies programming questions.
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The Motown mono single versions did have punch. Some of them were less cluttered arrangements, i.e. they buried certain elements. Edwin Starr's "Warr" is a classic example. On the stereo version that was put on Oldies formats when I was working at the format factory, you'd hear the guitar more (on the left channel? it was a cool riff) -- on the mono single, the horns really pounded out the main riff of the song. Tons more punch.
What CTListener perceived as trebly and tinny was probably somewhat intentional (for AM radio of the day), and also due to the limited tech Motown truly had. They had an echo chamber in the basement of the studio/house., which added some treble and high midrange.
They also did a considerable amount of reduction mixing, apparently -- not just on vocals, but also on instruments. I read somewhere that a few of their tracks had 2-3 layered drum tracks. In other words, the drummer doubled his parts, playing in unison with himself, to make the drums really stand out on the record. In some studios, when you had to make room on the tape for these sorts of creative overdubs, you lost a generation and the result was compensated for treble. This may also have happened at Motown until they started recording in California.
Then yeah, the mono singles were mixed for AM radio, mono, and they used car radios to test it. Other studios in LA did the same thing. Even Soundgarden tested their 1994 Superunknown tracks on a car stereo (albeit in stereo, naturally) to see how it sounded on consumer equipment.
What CTListener perceived as trebly and tinny was probably somewhat intentional (for AM radio of the day), and also due to the limited tech Motown truly had. They had an echo chamber in the basement of the studio/house., which added some treble and high midrange.
They also did a considerable amount of reduction mixing, apparently -- not just on vocals, but also on instruments. I read somewhere that a few of their tracks had 2-3 layered drum tracks. In other words, the drummer doubled his parts, playing in unison with himself, to make the drums really stand out on the record. In some studios, when you had to make room on the tape for these sorts of creative overdubs, you lost a generation and the result was compensated for treble. This may also have happened at Motown until they started recording in California.
Then yeah, the mono singles were mixed for AM radio, mono, and they used car radios to test it. Other studios in LA did the same thing. Even Soundgarden tested their 1994 Superunknown tracks on a car stereo (albeit in stereo, naturally) to see how it sounded on consumer equipment.
I've read that Motown in the 60s put much more care into mono mixes than stereo mixes. Stereo LP sales didn't pass mono sales until 1967, and the R&B market was even more shifted to mono. They weren't the only ones. Famously, the Beatles (except for the last couple of albums) would be in the studio for the mono mixes of their albums but leave the stereo mixes to producer George Martin and his engineers.
I can't speak for WRKO-FM in 1967, but I moved to Manchester, N.H. in the summer of 1968, and at that time 98.5 was a partial simulcast of the AM, the rest of the time was automated top 40, more or less the same playlist. Arco the shy but friendly robot was gone, strictly a jukebox. Didn't have a stereo receiver at the time so I don't know if any of the music was in stereo. Shortly after they moved to Government Center in late '68 they switched to Drake-Chenault's "Hitparade" format, which was replaced with D-C's "Solid Gold" (which was actually about 60% currents) after a couple years. Sometime in early '73 they went oldies, not sure if it was locally produced or syndicated. In those days the oldies format was almost exclusively pre-1962, an era that held/holds very little interest for me so I rarely listened.
I don't think they went live until the late 70s.
"Hitparade" was 60% current/40% gold. "Solid Gold" was 60% gold/40% current.
The 1973 oldies format was likely an in-house or at least RKO corporate format, replacing the Drake-Chenault syndication, as Drake walked out in May of that year.
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Harvey_Dogg
Guest
I'm all for cleaning up old recordings and making the music sound better than you've ever heard the song before now. Use stereo recordings whenever possible. Remove pops and clicks from old records.
But there are some purists out there who want old 78's to sound scratched and mono records to remain in mono.
But there are some purists out there who want old 78's to sound scratched and mono records to remain in mono.
Songs were not recorded with clicks and pops, but listeners do want "oldies" and classic rock and classic country and the like to sound "the way I heard it when it (and I) were new".
But do they really want to hear the awful hackjob edit on the original mono 45 of "House of the Rising Sun"? Because that's what was played on the radio when it was new -- not the album version that everyone plays now.
I think most want to hear the original. In many cases, the album version is not the original "hit."
By the way, I really HATE it when they take a mono recording and convert it to psuedo stereo. I'd rather hear it in mono.
By the way, I really HATE it when they take a mono recording and convert it to psuedo stereo. I'd rather hear it in mono.
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Harvey_Dogg
Guest
Guess if your listening with Alexa it's mono anyway. But Alexa has good sound. For the true 1960's sound, an antique transistor radio is what you need.
As for me, I like to hear the flutes and bells and feel the thump of a bass drum. And, most people aren't listening on the same sound system from 60 years ago. So the music will not sound the same as it did way back then.
As for me, I like to hear the flutes and bells and feel the thump of a bass drum. And, most people aren't listening on the same sound system from 60 years ago. So the music will not sound the same as it did way back then.
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Exactly. And---demographics.
If you heard "House of the Rising Sun" on AM radio in the 45 edit at age 4, you're 61 now. More likely you were 14. You're 71 now. No radio station is aiming for that listener.
Single edits are, for the most part, now irrelevant for a radio station. Any listener in the desirable demo most likely knows the song from the album version, which is what the artist had in mind to begin with.
Eric Records is one company that puts out stereolised CDs, for some time now.
I do remember in the 70s a lot of promo 45s have mono and stereo versions on each side. I got boatloads of those!
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Harvey_Dogg
Guest
There are the old original Leadbelly recordings of House of the Rising Sun, Rock Island Line, Midnight Special, In the Pines, and many other songs that became hits for other artists.
Yes. Mono on one side and stereo on the other became standard in the late 60's, early 70's. I have lots of them too. The problem with the album versions .... Most were not stereo remixes of the 45's. They were usually recorded after the songs became hits and didn't sound anything like the original releases.
Many of the radio releases were cut this way: AM stations could play/cart the mono side, and FM stations the stereo side.
AM stations were concerned about phase issues harming their loudness from airing fairly wide stereo songs, so the record companies offered mono versions too.
True. When I did mobile DJ eons ago I would use the original 45 and put those in the server. Many liked those better.
Could've been...it's been 50 years, but it seemed more current than that.
They played a lot of odd oldies, long on mid-charting songs and even some LP cuts. "Glory Road" - Neil Diamond was one I recall, never a single as far as I know. Not sure how they determined what oldies to play, maybe these were local L.A. hits?
I do recall that there were 2 different "announcers" that gave the song titles. Similar voices, but different delivery. I'm told one of them was the real Don Steele, though at the time I had no idea who he was.
All in all it was an interesting format, and tight too, unlike so many other automated formats of the day.
I'd have to think which version to play is almost entirely irrelevant. The amount of material recorded/mastered in mono after 1975 has to be tiny, and very little music before 1975 airs on the radio today.
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