Yet *ANOTHER* terrible move by the Eagle

[Marcos_C]

Either this is the weirdest format flip in the history of radio, or it’s a stunt, or music must still be involved in new format. No one has addressed it on air? No logo and no set on air line up yet?

But here's the thing: the flip hasn't happened yet. The station is still 97.1 The Eagle. To those who neither visit these boards nor read RadioInsight, the change will be sudden, like numerous other format changes before it. However, those who tune in to the station just for The Ben and Skin Show will still have their shooting-the-breeze show at the same time after the flip. That show will certainly fit the new format more than it does the current one. After all, I would tune in to a rock station to listen to rock music, not to listen to a bunch of people talking about animals in their homes and some party that took place three decades ago.

 

[macattack]

But here's the thing: the flip hasn't happened yet. The station is still 97.1 The Eagle. To those who neither visit these boards nor read RadioInsight, the change will be sudden, like numerous other format changes before it. However, those who tune in to the station just for The Ben and Skin Show will still have their shooting-the-breeze show at the same time after the flip. That show will certainly fit the new format more than it does the current one. After all, I would tune in to a rock station to listen to rock music, not to listen to a bunch of people talking about animals in their homes and some party that took place three decades ago.

And this is why KVIL won against KEGL despite being the loser in nearly all head-to-head matchups for several years.

 

[101tm]

Either this is the weirdest format flip in the history of radio, or it’s a stunt, or music must still be involved in new format. No one has addressed it on air? No logo and no set on air line up yet? Not to mention how the name of the station is named after an upcoming concert they’re doing in a few weeks? Flipping to talk on a Friday?

A format like it sounds like they’re trying to put together takes a while to put together, but I wouldn’t expect some moves to start being made until tomorrow or so.

 

[TheBigA]

Either this is the weirdest format flip in the history of radio, or it’s a stunt, or music must still be involved in new format.

We'll know when we know. That's how these things work.

 

[Old Grey Coyote]

on the topic of the Rock Music changing and Russ refusing to play it, bascally it's the "Grandpa Simpson effect" and Russ used to be with it (in this case 1980s hair metal rock) then they change what it was (to Grunge and later Nu Metal, post grunge and other forms of today's rock) and then what the it that Russ was with isn't it anymore and what it is seemed weird and scary to him and it is all happening to us eventually. the it in question is the sound of Rock Music in general, today's Rock is starting to become not it to me and what it's becoming is starting to seem weird and scary to me.

Grandpa Simpson's quote sums up what we viewed as our "age of new rock" and aging out of it for the new generation and this generation of rock isn't strong enough to sustain a successful hard rock station in a market that the white demos that kept it alive has been replaced by Latinos who listen to Spanish language music, people of African American descent listening to hip hop and R&B, the youth listening to Top 40 as well as Hip Hop and other youth friendly formats, and the fact most white people here in this area would listen to Kiss FM, Jack FM, Lonestar, and maybe Star 102.1 and 102.9 Now as well as classic rock on Lonestar 92.5.

Today's rock isn't mainstream enough to play, is pretty much entering a period where the only way to hear it on the radio in Dallas is via internet connection, HD Radio (if iHeartRadio launches a HD2 station on 97.1 or 92.5 that can cover the loss of The Eagle), or Sirius XM and their radio channels devoted to Rock formats, and for concerts of the major names, i would say just personally follow your favorite bands on social media and their websites for details of their touring schedule and also for local bands, you do the same but also if you want to discovered them, go to the local music places they perform at like bars, clubs, and other music venues. and just crank it up on what ever streaming platform or Sirius XM you listen to for rock.

Is there even a mainstream anymore? You have hip hop, classic hip hop, Spanish language Latinos, English speaking Latinos, Country, Latino Country, Alternative, Alternative Alternative. And on and on. I could remember a time when everybody listened to the Top 40 Station, except for the old folks who listened to the easy listening station. There is no format today that "everybody" listens to. Trying to program a mainstream music station today is close to impossible. You are just looking for enough listeners now to survive without giving too many of those a reason to tune out.

 

[CTListener]

Is there even a mainstream anymore? You have hip hop, classic hip hop, Spanish language Latinos, English speaking Latinos, Country, Latino Country, Alternative, Alternative Alternative. And on and on. I could remember a time when everybody listened to the Top 40 Station, except for the old folks who listened to the easy listening station. There is no format today that "everybody" listens to. Trying to program a mainstream music station today is close to impossible. You are just looking for enough listeners now to survive without giving too many of those a reason to tune out.

"Grandpa, tell me 'bout the good old days ..." as the Judds sang a while back in a song you can still hear on stations running a format you didn't mention: Classic Country.

Mainstream AC/Hot AC is easy to program. AC evolved from what used to be called MOR, with ultra-polarizing hip-hop prompting the split. Both flavors of AC are solid listener and advertiser pleasers. So is classic rock. So is contemporary country.

 

[davideduardo]

"Grandpa, tell me 'bout the good old days ..." as the Judds sang a while back in a song you can still hear on stations running a format you didn't mention: Classic Country.

Mainstream AC/Hot AC is easy to program. AC evolved from what used to be called MOR, with ultra-polarizing hip-hop prompting the split. Both flavors of AC are solid listener and advertiser pleasers. So is classic rock. So is contemporary country.

I'd say that today's AC evolved in the early 70's as a reaction to progressive rock and hard rock on Top 40 stations.

AC had come on the scene long before Shugarhill Gang dropped Rapper's Delight.

Many former MOR stations saw an opening as Top 40 lost some of its Paul Anka and Niel Sedaka heritage and played more hard stuff and fewer adult songs.

In 1972 I became PD of WERC in Birmingham. It had been WBRC under Taft and was an MOR station. We took the adult appeal Top 40 songs and added more gold than CHR played and became "chicken rock" which was the precursor of AC in many markets.

One of the keys was building an adult sounding airstaff, a good news department and a mature approach. In our case in Alabama, we had the advantage of being the flagship station for that little football team just to our Southwest in Tuscaloosa.

 

[CTListener]

I'd say that today's AC evolved in the early 70's as a reaction to progressive rock and hard rock on Top 40 stations.

AC had come on the scene long before Shugarhill Gang dropped Rapper's Delight.

My wording was confusing, sorry. I meant the split of AC into AC and Hot AC was prompted by hip-hop. Am I correct, or close to correct, on that?

 

[davideduardo]

My wording was confusing, sorry. I meant the split of AC into AC and Hot AC was prompted by hip-hop. Am I correct, or close to correct, on that?

I'd say that Hot AC became an alternative to CHR when CHR became heavily loaded with rap and, then, hip hop. I've never looked at the former format of Hot AC stations, so it would be interesting for everyone to post what their local (if they have one) Hot AC was doing before that format.

 

[CTListener]

I'd say that Hot AC became an alternative to CHR when CHR became heavily loaded with rap and, then, hip hop. I've never looked at the former format of Hot AC stations, so it would be interesting for everyone to post what their local (if they have one) Hot AC was doing before that format.

In Hartford, WTIC-FM bailed on CHR, where it competed with WKSS, when rap entered the format. It remains a more current-oriented alternative to traditional AC WRCH to this day.

 

[JeremyAndrews]

I'd say that Hot AC became an alternative to CHR when CHR became heavily loaded with rap and, then, hip hop. I've never looked at the former format of Hot AC stations, so it would be interesting for everyone to post what their local (if they have one) Hot AC was doing before that format.

WTMX Chicago was basically AC by today's standards when it launched. It went Modern AC (Rock based) in the mid 90s until sometime in the Early-Mid 2000s but to this day it's still edgy at times. There was a period in the last few years when they were leaning more toward CHR.

WMYX Milwaukee was, supposedly the first to use the "Mix" term. Was more AC-ish but it evolved to Hot AC

WXLC Waukegan was CHR, "Hot 102.3" but evolved to Hot AC in the Mid 90s. Lately it sounds more CHR again

WKTI Milwaukee (no longer Hot AC) was a heritage CHR. It evolved to Hot AC because of the rap in the early 90s. They frequently ran corny ads like the one linked below talking about the other CHR in the market at the time (WLUM) which played a lot of Rap & R&B as well as Rock and Pop. WKTI made an attempt to tweak back to CHR about 16-17 years ago but it failed and they went Adult Hits by 2008.

 

[Kent]

My wording was confusing, sorry. I meant the split of AC into AC and Hot AC was prompted by hip-hop. Am I correct, or close to correct, on that?

My first memories of Hot AC being a thing were around Labor Day 1990. The first Hot AC I'd heard of was when Power 93 KITY in San Antonio became KSRR-FM Star 93 in September 1990.

I'm sure the influence of hip-hop and rap records on CHR's at the time was a factor in the change. I don't think it was the only factor, though. CHR had begun struggling a year or two earlier and was in a down cycle. Some people blamed the surge in dance tracks for the downturn, but I tend to think that was more of an effect than a cause. In other words, stations began playing tracks they wouldn't have touched a few years earlier because the product wasn't as good.

In some markets, like San Antonio and Phoenix, CHR's ran with the new Hot AC formula. Same for OKC. People generally seemed to think the lower/lowest rated CHR was the one to flip to Hot AC around the time, but that wasn't always the case. I seem to remember, outside morning drive, KITY and KZZP generally beat their competitors, though KITY had an unusually down book in Spring '90 and may have panicked because Spring is usually a good time for CHR. In other cases, AC was cluttered, and a lower rated AC took the new Hot AC format. Dallas was one of those situations, where KMGC "Magic 102.9" became KDMX "Mix 102.9." Nationwide acquired the station via swap with Shamrock (where Shamrock netted, and promptly sold, KWSS 94.5 San Jose from Nationwide), and Nationwide was already convinced Hot AC was the next big thing. I seem to remember Mix had some issues starting, but took off about six months later. It and KVIL forced KRSR "Star 105.3" from AC in late '91 or early '92.

 

[TheBigA]

I'd say that Hot AC became an alternative to CHR when CHR became heavily loaded with rap and, then, hip hop.

Or an alterative to mainstream AC in order to fine tune the target audience. Traditional AC was becoming increasingly mushy and dull. A vacuum emerged between the two formats that could reach an audience that was too old for CHR but not old enough for AC, in that sweet spot of women in their 40s. It was a matter of percentages, as in, how many currents you play per hour, how old is the gold you play, and what is the tempo. It became a completely new format that might not cannibalize audience from other formats in the cluster.

 

[davideduardo]

Or an alterative to mainstream AC in order to fine tune the target audience. Traditional AC was becoming increasingly mushy and dull. A vacuum emerged between the two formats that could reach an audience that was too old for CHR but not old enough for AC. It was a matter of percentages, as in, how many currents you play per hour, how old is the gold you play, and what is the tempo. It became a completely new format that might not cannibalize audience from other formats in the cluster/

In some cases the format was picked as part of consolidation.

In LA, the Bonneville AC, KBIG, was a competitor to KOST. It was sold to AM/FM as was KOST in the series of Chancellor-AM/FM-Clear Channel transaction. Obviously, AM/FM did not want two AC stations and the result was a more current based AC on KBIG, traditional AC on KOST and mainstream CHR on KIIS... creating the now-famous wall of women.

I wonder, as well, how many format divisions in this area of contemporary music happened due to the need of consolidated clusters to better allocate their audience resources and targets.

 

[victorres43]

I'd say that Hot AC became an alternative to CHR when CHR became heavily loaded with rap and, then, hip hop. I've never looked at the former format of Hot AC stations, so it would be interesting for everyone to post what their local (if they have one) Hot AC was doing before that format.

Everyone knows about WKTU being an AC then a prototype of a rhythmic contemporary format when the call letters were on 92.3. Then, in 1996, WKTU "returned", on 103.5, as a dance-heavy CHR, eventually evolving to a rhythmic-leaning Hot AC. A well-performing companion to WLTW and WHTZ, and an on-point mix of pop music for the city crowd. Not a Hot AC with the stereotypical downbeat pop rock sound.

WPLJ, as everyone knows, is an AOR, then a CHR, and then a Hot AC in 1992, with Power 95 WWPR briefly being a thing in 1987-88. As a Hot AC, it avoided "harder stuff" and "elevator music" when they first evolved to the format; lots of 70s were played during the 90s, especially disco. As late as the mid-2000s, they continued to play 70s music, though they had a brief stint as a modern AC in 1999. The station of White Port & Lemon Juice is now a godcaster.

Fresh 102.7 started as an alternative to WLTW for women born 1963-1982, playing a more modern mix of the AC format. As time went on, WWFS became a Hot AC, then sported the WNEW call letters (which were used during 102.7's days as MOR, as progressive rock, as AOR, and as Hot Talk), and then became the NEW 102.7. WNEW is a more pop rock friendly version of WKTU. And even after all these years, WLTW is #1 in a majority of recent books, and yes, Lite FM still plays some soft 80s tunes from time to time.


A majority of Hot ACs were the no-rap version of CHR during the 90s and 00s. Ironically, AC stations like WSHE and WMGF are playing a handful of hip-hop tunes, and the likes of WDUV and WFEZ do not omit the rap part of Michael Jackson's Black or White.

 

[davideduardo]

A majority of Hot ACs were the no-rap version of CHR during the 90s and 00s. Ironically, AC stations like WSHE and WMGF are playing a handful of hip-hop tunes, and the likes of WDUV and WFEZ do not omit the rap part of Michael Jackson's Black or White.

Remember, in the 50's and 60's we had a number of Top 40 hits that had a "recited" bridge in them. Country, later, had a few. While they were not rhythmically delivered, they were not "sung" like the rest of the song. So the Michael Jackson song fits that category nicely.

I just had this horrible vision of one of Lawrence Welk's singers rapping in the middle of a big band song! And Mr. Welk tapping his foot to carry the beat...

 

[Mrbiglott]

So will 97.1 KEGL be like 94.7 KREF-FM in Oklahoma City? Look at OKC they have 4 stations that carry Fox Sports Radio, and not only that on the weekends 94.7 KREF-FM, and 100.5 KATT both air the John Clay Wolf Show on Saturday mornings at the same time. So does this open the door for KEGL to air FSR in the overnight hours, and weekends?

 

[salemjedi54]

So will 97.1 KEGL be like 94.7 KREF-FM in Oklahoma City? Look at OKC they have 4 stations that carry Fox Sports Radio, and not only that on the weekends 94.7 KREF-FM, and 100.5 KATT both air the John Clay Wolf Show on Saturday mornings at the same time. So does this open the door for KEGL to air FSR in the overnight hours, and weekends?

They have to get Fox Sports Radio from KTCK AM/FM.

 

[briancraig]

Dallas was home to the most successful Hot AC of all, KVIL. In many ways, Ron Chapman at KVIL should be given credit for inventing Hot AC as it is done today.

 

[Mrbiglott]

They have to get Fox Sports Radio from KTCK AM/FM.

With KTCK-FM being in Flower Mound wouldn’t that technically give 97.1 the green light to air FSR in the overnights, and weekends? Yet again I could also see them using ESPN Radio for filler as well.